# General car talk **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [August 30, 2022, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/general-car-talk/970611 "2022-08-30T15:18:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Tride](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tride/32/13907_2.png) [@Tride](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tride)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2022, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/general-car-talk/970611/61 "2022-09-09T00:12:42Z")
Sure–but did the up front price decrease (or at least not go up)? It’s pretty easy to quantify all these features vs the previous list price. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2022, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/general-car-talk/970611/62 "2022-09-09T00:13:46Z")
> [@california\_jobcase](#): > > I predict black-market hacking will proliferate if the car companies try to push the subscription model. I think they will make it quite difficult to hack it, via the ECMs and other computer controls. This is far more advanced than just not installing the switches. ---
**Author:** ![california\_jobcase](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9d8465/32.png) [@california\_jobcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/california_jobcase)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2022, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/general-car-talk/970611/63 "2022-09-09T00:25:43Z")
I think you’d be surprised at how talented some car oriented people are! ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2022, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/general-car-talk/970611/64 "2022-09-09T00:32:39Z")
I’m sure they are very talented, but so are the engineers at BWM. I’m pretty confident that cars that report back to the manufacturer will be able to detect when their controls are being bypassed and take appropriate action. ---
**Author:** ![Capn\_Carl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/838e76/32.png) [@Capn\_Carl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Capn_Carl)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2022, 9:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/general-car-talk/970611/65 "2022-09-09T09:34:18Z")
Here’s how that works with a Tesla Model 3 option: The long range version’s motors are capable of producing 420 horsepower. Tesla’s software limits them to 370 hp, which is more than enough for most owners, then charges $2000 to unlock the full 420 hp for the few customers that want it. A Canadian performance parts company sells a product that unlocks the 420 hp for about half that price. But there’s a catch. Tesla issues over-the-air software improvements a few times each year. If you accept a software update and you have the non-Tesla power upgrade, Tesla will detect it and disable your car. You have to remember to disconnect the product during software updates. ---
**Author:** ![carnut](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnut/32/3531_2.png) [@carnut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnut)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2022, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/general-car-talk/970611/66 "2022-09-09T22:26:09Z")
> [@Capn\_Carl](#): > > The long range version’s motors are capable of producing 420 horsepower. Tesla’s software limits them to 370 hp, which is more than enough for most owners, then charges $2000 to unlock the full 420 hp for the few customers that want it. Why I’m not interested in Tesla, right there. That and friends who turned there’s in for “something reliable”. ---
**Author:** ![Pork\_Rind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pork_rind/32/111_2.png) [@Pork\_Rind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pork_Rind)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2022, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/general-car-talk/970611/67 "2022-09-09T22:54:30Z")
Flip side there is that I didn’t pay $2,000 for additional power I don’t need. And just anecdotally, my Model Y LR has been more reliable than my Chevy Bolt, although neither would fall into the category of ‘problematic’. My Bolt had one service visit in three years, while my Tesla has required zero visits in two years. ---
**Author:** ![IgoZoom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c37758/32.png) [@IgoZoom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IgoZoom)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2022, 2:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/general-car-talk/970611/68 "2022-09-12T02:21:45Z")
My 2006 Mazda3 had some hidden features that I learned how to activate from enthusiast forums after I bought it. It has heated seats but the buttons to activate them are blank (because they’re standard in Canada, they put them in some that were sold in the U.S.) but just didn’t label the buttons. There is also a fuel economy computer that was standard on the top trim level but could be unlocked by pressing the correct key sequence. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2022, 12:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/general-car-talk/970611/69 "2022-09-12T12:46:37Z")
> **[Where Are All the EV Convertibles?](https://www.autoweek.com/news/a41134663/where-are-all-the-ev-convertibles/)** > > Electric vehicles weigh a lot; are the safety issues surrounding possible rollovers keeping automakers from building more open-air EV models? Interesting article on why there are no convertible EVs on the market right now. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2022, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/general-car-talk/970611/70 "2022-09-14T15:35:41Z")
Ferrari finally steps into the SUV market. No EV or hybrid, but a 6.5 liter V-12. > **[Ferrari Purosangue SUV revealed: V12 power, big price tag, surprisingly pretty...](https://autos.yahoo.com/ferrari-purosangue-revealed-ferraris-next-170000217.html)** > > The Ferrari Purosangue is a four-door, four-seat SUV with a naturally aspirated 6.5-liter, 715-hp V12. We've seen it in person: Here's what we think. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2022, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/general-car-talk/970611/71 "2022-09-14T17:32:43Z")
I remember this back when it was called the Hyundai Veloster. About $420,000 cheaper, too. That thing isn’t an SUV. It’s a 4500 lb hatchback. Hey, it’s only $100/lb. At least a Porsche Panamera is within reach of upper middle class peoole who want an overweight sports SUV. I don’t know what the market is for that thing at nearly half a million bucks. ---
**Author:** ![WildaBeast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wildabeast/32/6_2.png) [@WildaBeast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WildaBeast)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2022, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/general-car-talk/970611/72 "2022-09-14T17:54:18Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > That thing isn’t an SUV. It’s a 4500 lb hatchback. I’ve said before, with the rise of “crossovers” the line between SUV, station wagon, and hatchback is becoming increasingly blurry. As far as I’m concerned, most large crossovers are pretty much just tall station wagons, and small crossovers are are essentially hatchbacks with a little more ground clearance. ---
**Author:** ![Lancia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lancia/32/17174_2.png) [@Lancia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lancia)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2022, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/general-car-talk/970611/73 "2022-09-14T17:54:21Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > That thing isn’t an SUV. It’s a 4500 lb hatchback That is true of most modern “SUV’s”. Even “crossovers” are in no way a cross between an SUV and traditional sedan, they are at best merely a modern take on a hatchback or wagon. If I’m feeling supremely generous I might be willing to concede the term “crossover” is accurate for some AWD models, but they’re still basically just a AWD wagon. Modern refinements have made the creature-comfort distinctions between a true utility vehicle like a long-bed pickup and a passenger car much less pronounced than they used to be. This has long been one of me personal pet peeves: terms like _crossover_ and _SUV_ don’t mean jack anymore, and even things with traditional names like _pickup truck_ don’t mean much – something with a 48" bed, front-wheel drive, and a 2500lb towing capacity is not a pickup in my book anymore than an El Camino was. Edit: Ninja’d. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2022, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/general-car-talk/970611/74 "2022-09-14T18:05:26Z")
Oh, I know. But usually calling something an ‘SUV’ at least includes some characteristic like a higher ride height. Or at least it used to. We have a Saab 9-2x wagon that has AWD, decent ground clearance, etc. No one ever called it an SUV or even a crossover, It’s a wagon or at best a ‘hot hatchback’. Calling a vehicle an SUV is now pure marketing devoid of any actual defining characteristics other than that it’s got four seats and is not a sedan. ---
**Author:** ![Pork\_Rind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pork_rind/32/111_2.png) [@Pork\_Rind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pork_Rind)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2022, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/general-car-talk/970611/75 "2022-09-14T18:19:48Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > I don’t know what the market is for that thing at nearly half a million bucks. Existing Ferrari owners that want to stay in the brand instead of buying a Bentley for their four seat needs. I know enough Ferrari guys to know they’ll sell every one of these they can make. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2022, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/general-car-talk/970611/76 "2022-09-14T18:40:09Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > But usually calling something an ‘SUV’ at least includes some characteristic like a higher ride height. Ferrari isn’t calling it an SUV. > The Ferrari Purosangue is the first ever four-door, four-seater car in Ferrari’s history > **[Ferrari Purosangue: Unlike any other - Ferrari.com](https://www.ferrari.com/en-US/auto/ferrari-purosangue)** > > Ferrari has created a unique car and the encapsulation of the Prancing Horse’s DNA, where performance, driving pleasure and comfort coexist in perfect harmony. And that’s why this new model was called Ferrari Purosangue – Italian for thoroughbred. ---
**Author:** ![WildaBeast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wildabeast/32/6_2.png) [@WildaBeast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WildaBeast)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2022, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/general-car-talk/970611/77 "2022-09-14T18:51:44Z")
Yeah, part of it is probably confusion / disagreement among journalists / bloggers / the general public over exactly what an SUV is, to the point where people are calling every tall vehicle with four seats that isn’t a sedan an “SUV”. ---
**Author:** ![carnut](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnut/32/3531_2.png) [@carnut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnut)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2022, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/general-car-talk/970611/78 "2022-09-14T21:08:53Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > when it was called the Hyundai Veloster Nailed it. ---
**Author:** ![Capn\_Carl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/838e76/32.png) [@Capn\_Carl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Capn_Carl)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2022, 1:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/general-car-talk/970611/79 "2022-09-15T01:42:22Z")
I agree, paying $2k for power that’s already there is a ripoff, but I can’t imagine going back to an ICE car like your friends did. Now, when I drive one they feel weak, unresponsive, and noisy. It’s like I’ve visited the future, and doing so has made the present feel primitive. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2022, 1:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/general-car-talk/970611/80 "2022-09-15T01:48:01Z")
> **[Car brands with the highest customer satisfaction ratings in 2022 - Autoblog](https://autos.yahoo.com/car-brands-highest-customer-satisfaction-155600453.html)** > > Overall customer satisfaction with cars fell by 1.3% from 2021 to 2022, but some brands posted a significant increase. Here's how they rank. I love my Suby, but I’m surprised to see it ranked so high. No surprise on Toyota or Lexus, but a few surprises like Ram and Chevy. To state the obvious; customer satisfaction doesn’t equal quality but I’m sure it’s correlated. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/general-car-talk/970611.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/general-car-talk/970611.md?page=5)