# Genetically engineered "dinochicken" proposed **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [March 18, 2009, 1:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genetically-engineered-dinochicken-proposed/489825 "2009-03-18T01:34:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2009, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genetically-engineered-dinochicken-proposed/489825/21 "2009-03-18T18:36:32Z")
> [@Darwins\_Finch](#): > > The difference is that the “monsters” they intend to create will be very similar to _real_, albeit extinct, animals, not mutant freaks with legs for eyes, etc. The implication being that if they can, by tweaking genetic switches, re-create an extinct animal, that further adds weight to the ideas a) that a significant component of evolution involves the tweaking of these genetic switches during development, and b) that birds did indeed evolve from theropod dinosaurs, and remain very much actual, non-extinct dinosaurs (and reptiles!). > > That, and they’re hoping for some medical breakthroughs along the way. I guess I didn’t see a) as seriously up for debate. And I’m hugely in support of studying genetic manipulation. My youngest is starting college next year in Mollecular and Cellular Bio and my best golfing buddy sells RNA interference agents. And I have a niece who just graduated with degrees in biomedical and chemical engineering. I know just enough about it to know how little I really know about it! 😛 But after reading this article (which I believe was an exerpt from a general audience-directed book in a general audience-directed magazine) I didn’t really get the impression that they would actually be “re-creating an extinct animal” such that they wouldn’t really be proving b). Instead, it came across to me as tho they would have fucked with something such that it _resembled_ something else. Yeah, a lot more sophisticated than gluing a fin and some horns on an iguana, but not exactly what they seemed to be presenting it as. Do my distinctions make any sense - or are they yet more evidence of my ignorance in this area. ---
**Author:** ![Damfino](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Damfino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damfino)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2009, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genetically-engineered-dinochicken-proposed/489825/22 "2009-03-18T18:47:39Z")
Dinochicken first appeared in the Isaac Asimov story [A Statue for Father](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Statue_for_Father). Apparently it was delicious, and they started a restaurant business. These were a species of dinosaur, though, not an engineered species. I know it’s spelt “dinachicken” in the link, but I remember it as “dinochicken.” ---
**Author:** ![Cuckoorex](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ad7895/32.png) [@Cuckoorex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cuckoorex)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2009, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genetically-engineered-dinochicken-proposed/489825/23 "2009-03-18T19:23:57Z")
OK, this was quick and dirty… [dinochicken.](http://pic20.picturetrail.com/VOL176/1171787/2428238/358603438.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2009, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genetically-engineered-dinochicken-proposed/489825/24 "2009-03-18T19:43:33Z")
> [@Cuckoorex](#): > > OK, this was quick and dirty… > [dinochicken.](http://pic20.picturetrail.com/VOL176/1171787/2428238/358603438.jpg) Hmm… the stance looks a little off; given that it now has a long tail, shouldn’t the body be forward a bit more? ---
**Author:** ![cjepson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a9adbd/32.png) [@cjepson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cjepson)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2009, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genetically-engineered-dinochicken-proposed/489825/25 "2009-03-18T19:45:38Z")
> [@Cervaise](#): > > Holy cow, I loved that book, and I had completely forgotten about it until just this minute. What was it called again? “The Enormous Egg” by Oliver Butterworth? (I liked “The Shy Stegosaurus of Cricket Creek” better.) ---
**Author:** ![Cuckoorex](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ad7895/32.png) [@Cuckoorex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cuckoorex)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2009, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genetically-engineered-dinochicken-proposed/489825/26 "2009-03-18T19:50:56Z")
> [@Lumpy](#): > > Hmm… the stance looks a little off; given that it now has a long tail, shouldn’t the body be forward a bit more? Sorry…told you it was quick and dirty…! Here’s the more [balanced version](http://pic20.picturetrail.com/VOL176/1171787/2428238/358605580.jpg)… ---
**Author:** ![Khampelf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/8e7dd6/32.png) [@Khampelf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Khampelf)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2009, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genetically-engineered-dinochicken-proposed/489825/27 "2009-03-18T20:19:59Z")
> [@Cuckoorex](#): > > Sorry…told you it was quick and dirty…! Here’s the more [balanced version](http://pic20.picturetrail.com/VOL176/1171787/2428238/358605580.jpg)… It still looks more like a ‘Dinoduck’. But, as I haven’t progressed past stick figures and cartoon cats, myself, Uhh. Good job! ---
**Author:** ![Darwins\_Finch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darwins_finch/32/20304_2.png) [@Darwins\_Finch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darwins_Finch)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2009, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genetically-engineered-dinochicken-proposed/489825/28 "2009-03-18T20:31:14Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > I guess I didn’t see a) as seriously up for debate. And I’m hugely in support of studying genetic manipulation. My youngest is starting college next year in Mollecular and Cellular Bio and my best golfing buddy sells RNA interference agents. And I have a niece who just graduated with degrees in biomedical and chemical engineering. I know just enough about it to know how little I really know about it! 😛 You’d be surprised just how few people actually “get” a). Just look around on these boards, for example, in any evolution-related topic. Evolution is often described as “mutations arise, natural selection picks the ones that work, discards the ones that don’t, and voila! – you have a new trait!” (that being a general paraphrase of the descriptions). However, new traits don’t usually appear out of the blue as such descriptions imply. Rather, when development is tweaked, new features can appear, or existing features can be heavily modified. It has been said that most evolution happens during development; that evo-devo is a fairly new field is testament to the fact that the relationship between development and evolution is really only just beginning to be explored, and the implications realized. I mean, it’s certainly not “news” to folks who already get this stuff, but it is big news with respect to how the general public views evolution. > [@](#): > > But after reading this article (which I believe was an exerpt from a general audience-directed book in a general audience-directed magazine) I didn’t really get the impression that they would actually be “re-creating an extinct animal” such that they wouldn’t really be proving b). Instead, it came across to me as tho they would have fucked with something such that it _resembled_ something else. Yeah, a lot more sophisticated than gluing a fin and some horns on an iguana, but not exactly what they seemed to be presenting it as. Quite right: they won’t be actually resurrecting a formerly extinct animal. But they will be re-creating the “grade”, or morphology, of an extinct form, which is pretty impressive in itself. If successful, it means that at the very least, all the macro-morphological genetic components needed to make a _T. rex_-like organism remain intact in extant birds. Of course, because the folks involved are selectively tweaking specific components, what they’ll get will be a very peculiar chicken, not a resurrected _Velociraptor_. It would be a chicken descendant, not a chicken ancestor. At any rate, the resemblance, such as it might exist, between the presumed dinochicken and a maniraptoran dinosaur, such as _Velociraptor_ or even _Archaeopteryx_, would be specifically because of the evolutionary heritage of the animals, not because we mad-scienced together a chimera from various animals. What’s even more fascinating is that the project doesn’t involve adding or subtracting any genes at all. It’s all about regulating the expression of existing genes. If we can turn birds into pre-avian dinosaurs (or even pre-avian dinosaur look-a-likes) without touching the genome, well, that’s some powerful stuff. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2009, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genetically-engineered-dinochicken-proposed/489825/29 "2009-03-18T21:12:10Z")
> [@Darwins\_Finch](#): > > If we can turn birds into pre-avian dinosaurs (or even pre-avian dinosaur look-a-likes) without touching the genome, well, that’s some powerful stuff. I guess I’ll have to take your word for it. I was surprised at how much this struck me as a sideshow stunt, right alongside the alligator man, seal boy, and the bearded lady. Of course, the other day my kid brought home a book from the library saying she thought I might find it interesting and that it actually said some interesting stuff despite being horribly “dumbed down.” I think I made it all the way to page 18 or so before I had to stop due to a headache! 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2009, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genetically-engineered-dinochicken-proposed/489825/30 "2009-03-18T21:13:42Z")
> [@Darwins\_Finch](#): > > Of course, because the folks involved are selectively tweaking specific components, what they’ll get will be a very peculiar chicken, not a resurrected _Velociraptor_. And even if they did get that, they’ll be safe as long as Samuel L. Jackson stays away from the research facility. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2009, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genetically-engineered-dinochicken-proposed/489825/31 "2009-03-18T21:17:47Z")
> [@lieu](#): > > Mmmmm… KFD. > [@Dante](#): > > We’re gonna need a bigger bucket. You two win the thread. > [@Cuckoorex](#): > > Sorry…told you it was quick and dirty…! Here’s the more [balanced version](http://pic20.picturetrail.com/VOL176/1171787/2428238/358605580.jpg)… It needs to hold its head much farther forward, not tilt the body forward. ---
**Author:** ![eclectic\_wench](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ac91a4/32.png) [@eclectic\_wench](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eclectic_wench)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2009, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genetically-engineered-dinochicken-proposed/489825/32 "2009-03-18T21:27:19Z")
My husband is SO going to want one for a pet. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2009, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genetically-engineered-dinochicken-proposed/489825/33 "2009-03-18T22:24:59Z")
> [@eclectic\_wench](#): > > My husband is SO going to want one for a pet. My personal language rule: anything that can disembowel you isn’t pet. ---
**Author:** ![Terrifel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c68b51/32.png) [@Terrifel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terrifel)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2009, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genetically-engineered-dinochicken-proposed/489825/34 "2009-03-18T23:19:57Z")
When I worked at a petting zoo some years ago, one of the chickens had thumbs, complete with little claws. He was a [Polish chicken](http://www.feathersite.com/Poultry/CGP/Polish/BRKPolish.html), so he wasn’t particularly reminiscent of a dinosaur even with the clawed forearms. He was routinely beaten up by the non-thumbed chickens, which suggests that opposable digits are not an evolutionary advantage in the world of poultry. Granted, we never let him near any firearms. ---
**Author:** ![Projammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/projammer/32/559_2.png) [@Projammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Projammer)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2009, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genetically-engineered-dinochicken-proposed/489825/35 "2009-03-19T03:10:25Z")
That’s going to be a whole new spin on cockfighting. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2009, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genetically-engineered-dinochicken-proposed/489825/36 "2009-03-19T04:00:57Z")
> [@Projammer](#): > > That’s going to be a whole new spin on cockfighting. Cockfighting involves chickens?? :eek: Who knew…? ---
**Author:** ![Sunspace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunspace/32/1250_2.png) [@Sunspace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunspace)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2009, 5:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genetically-engineered-dinochicken-proposed/489825/37 "2009-03-19T05:41:21Z")
> [@Damfino](#): > > Dinochicken first appeared in the Isaac Asimov story [A Statue for Father](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Statue_for_Father). Apparently it was delicious, and they started a restaurant business. These were a species of dinosaur, though, not an engineered species. > > I know it’s spelt “dinachicken” in the link, but I remember it as “dinochicken.” _That’s_ the story I was trying to remember! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genetically-engineered-dinochicken-proposed/489825.md?page=1)