# Genome sequencing for everybody! **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 5, 2009, 3:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genome-sequencing-for-everybody/516388 "2009-11-05T03:25:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2009, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genome-sequencing-for-everybody/516388/41 "2009-11-09T21:44:17Z")
> [@](#): > > Also, please explain to my the scientific merit of doing this sequencing for the entire population as opposed to a large sample of it? Will we gain any enhanced understanding from a sample of 300 million as opposed to 150 million subjects? Unlikely. We could probably reduce the sample size by orders of magnitude again and still have similarly valid and interesting results. The scientific studies could be done on a (comparably) very small portion of the population, but for the application of the results of those studies, it’d be best if as many people as possible and willing were scanned. Suppose, for instance, that you found that a certain gene led to a disease, but one which was easily, cheaply, and successfully treatable if the treatment is started before symptoms appear. In that case, the ideal situation would be for everyone with that gene to find out about it, so they can go get the cheap, easy treatment, rather than waiting for symptoms to show up and possibly needing a more expensive or less reliable treatment. Now, if some folks don’t want to find out if they have a risk for some conditions, that’s their business: As I stated before, I’d like to see the entire program be completely voluntary. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2009, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genome-sequencing-for-everybody/516388/42 "2009-11-09T22:14:11Z")
Just as a side note, a very similar study will be done soon - but for dogs. A guide dog facility has tissue samples and breeding records of every dog they have bred since the late 1940s. They also have very extensive health records. When the dog genome is sequenced, they will be able to start matching various disorders with the genomes. I’d think that bloodline records would be important to human data also, though that increases the privacy concerns. ---
**Author:** ![NetTrekker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nettrekker/32/2909_2.png) [@NetTrekker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NetTrekker)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2011, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genome-sequencing-for-everybody/516388/43 "2011-04-11T15:48:48Z")
Another 23andMe sale offer today…zero cost for testing, just $9/mo. for the subscription. As much as I’d like to do it out of health & ancestry curiosity, I can’t get past the potential for unauthorized access to the data and resulting possibilities of genetic discrimination ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2011, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genome-sequencing-for-everybody/516388/44 "2011-04-11T16:26:47Z")
It would be great for science, but I don’t trust the gov. to not hand the info over to law enforcement, employers or health insurance companies sooner or later. ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2011, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genome-sequencing-for-everybody/516388/45 "2011-04-11T16:27:54Z")
nm ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2011, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genome-sequencing-for-everybody/516388/46 "2011-04-11T17:53:45Z")
> [@Wesley\_Clark](#): > > It would be great for science, but I don’t trust the gov. to not hand the info over to law enforcement, employers or health insurance companies sooner or later. It would be sooner. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2011, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genome-sequencing-for-everybody/516388/47 "2011-04-11T18:09:01Z")
> [@threemae](#): > > Also, please explain to my the scientific merit of doing this sequencing for the entire population as opposed to a large sample of it? Well, one idea I’ve heard of is that theoretically you might be able to see correlations between the effects of various medical treatments and particular genes, and give people more personalized treatments. If people with Gene Combination X tend to react badly to Drug Y but react better than average to the less commonly used Drug Z, then you might want to start out with Drug Z instead of Y. Although in that case you wouldn’t necessarily have everyone’s genetic history in some central bank, it could just become standard practice for your doctor to have your genes analyzed and it would go in your private medical records. ---
**Author:** ![Le\_Jacquelope](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e0b2c6/32.png) [@Le\_Jacquelope](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Le_Jacquelope)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2011, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genome-sequencing-for-everybody/516388/48 "2011-04-11T18:15:38Z")
> [@nameless](#): > > Obviously security is part of the issue here. Can we maintain sufficient security to ensure that your genome remains private? Cost is also part of the issue. Using near-future technologies, this will still cost about a trillion dollars. We can maybe ameliorate that by having people buy in or by renting the database to biotech corporations, but it is still going to cost a lot. Is it worth it? Absolutely not. There is zero chance of keeping your genome private, as you put it. insurance corporations want to tie that information to you, and will do whatever it takes to get it done. That puts them in the role of predators. And you in the role of prey. They, being predators, will find ways around that “anonymity” and “privacy”. Or better yet they’ll come back later and brute force you by requiring you to surrender the information as part of a contract. If you don’t surrender the genome information, you don’t get any insurance. Basic contract law. ---
**Author:** ![Nancarrow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c37758/32.png) [@Nancarrow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nancarrow)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2011, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genome-sequencing-for-everybody/516388/49 "2011-04-11T20:45:16Z")
With a large enough sample, we will be able to find the genetic roots of, and hopefully a cure for, zombism. ---
**Author:** ![Farmer\_Jane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Farmer\_Jane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Farmer_Jane)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2011, 7:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genome-sequencing-for-everybody/516388/50 "2011-04-14T07:54:38Z")
One the one hand, the idea of a Human Genome Project for everyone in America sounds great. It’s good for the nerds. Let us have a trillion for once. I mean, if you’re going to gut NASA, give us something else! On the OTHER hand, look at what the Social Security number has become. I envision this world in which everyone’s genome is mapped and recorded in a database, where all of your information is stored on an electronic national ID card, cash doesn’t exist anymore, all of your steps are traceable and the Amish are the only free people left. ---
**Author:** ![Farmer\_Jane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Farmer\_Jane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Farmer_Jane)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2011, 7:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genome-sequencing-for-everybody/516388/51 "2011-04-14T07:55:39Z")
> [@Le\_Jacquelope](#): > > Absolutely not. There is zero chance of keeping your genome private, as you put it. > > insurance corporations want to tie that information to you, and will do whatever it takes to get it done. That puts them in the role of predators. And you in the role of prey. They, being predators, will find ways around that “anonymity” and “privacy”. Or better yet they’ll come back later and brute force you by requiring you to surrender the information as part of a contract. If you don’t surrender the genome information, you don’t get any insurance. Basic contract law. _chants_ SINGLE PAYER! SINGLE PAYER! ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2011, 8:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genome-sequencing-for-everybody/516388/52 "2011-04-14T08:00:19Z")
> [@CitizenPained](#): > > I envision this world in which everyone’s genome is mapped and recorded in a database, where all of your information is stored on an electronic national ID card, cash doesn’t exist anymore, all of your steps are traceable and the Amish are the only free people left. I hear that sort of thing a lot, but it doesn’t make any sense. An oppressive government doesn’t need to know your genes to be oppressive, nor does it take fancy hi-tech gene based tracking methods to be oppressive. Nor would low-tech people like the Amish be any safer from an oppressive government that just decided to send thugs over to beat them up. Any government powerful enough to do its job is powerful enough to be oppressive, it doesn’t need futuristic gadgetry to do so. ---
**Author:** ![Farmer\_Jane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Farmer\_Jane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Farmer_Jane)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2011, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genome-sequencing-for-everybody/516388/53 "2011-04-14T17:52:44Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > I hear that sort of thing a lot, but it doesn’t make any sense. An oppressive government doesn’t need to know your genes to be oppressive, nor does it take fancy hi-tech gene based tracking methods to be oppressive. Nor would low-tech people like the Amish be any safer from an oppressive government that just decided to send thugs over to beat them up. Any government powerful enough to do its job is powerful enough to be oppressive, it doesn’t need futuristic gadgetry to do so. I didn’t say a high tech government was an oppressive one. I just said it would make it easier. I mentioned the Amish because I was thinking about how much more private they were (no SSNs, no internet, etc). I didn’t say anything about government thugs beating people up. 😕😕 ---
**Author:** ![gurujulp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/ba9def/32.png) [@gurujulp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gurujulp)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2011, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genome-sequencing-for-everybody/516388/54 "2011-04-14T17:55:27Z")
> [@nameless](#): > > As you may know, all of you have a genome. It is made of DNA, which is an instruction set for most of your parts. Sometimes the parts break and tragic disease is the result. Other times, things change and nothing at all seems to happen! What a big mysterious machine the genome is! > > Anyway, recent technological advances in sequencing technology have brought the price of an individual genome sequence down to [$50,000](http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/11/science/11gene.html)–not cheap, but nowhere near the 2.7 billion the original Human Genome Project cost. Other biotech companies believe they can deliver a [$5,000 genome](http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2008/10/the-cheapest-ge/) within the timeframe of a year or so (editor’s note: they’re already late). [There’s a genome X-prize also.](http://genomics.xprize.org/) > > What this means is, assuming the price drops to \>$5K/person, for roughly the cost of the Iraq and Afghanistan wars, we could have instead sequenced the genomes of all 300 million Americans. This would be an unprecedented data set. If we kept it going for years, we’d learn a hell of a lot about human genetics. > > This is assuming the price doesn’t fall even further within the next few years, which I believe will inevitably happen. > > My question is– > > Would you support a national initiative to collect the genomes of the entire American populace? Assumptions: (1) an individual would not be associable with their genome (2) participation is voluntary (3) you retain a copy of your genomic information (the government does as well, but it cannot link it to you in any way) > > Obviously security is part of the issue here. Can we maintain sufficient security to ensure that your genome remains private? Cost is also part of the issue. Using near-future technologies, this will still cost about a trillion dollars. We can maybe ameliorate that by having people buy in or by renting the database to biotech corporations, but it is still going to cost a lot. Is it worth it? You don’t own your genes, you caretake them- see any unwanted child as an example… I think it should all be public census data- plug in and make it happen! Unfortuately, with the laws that currently exist, I wouldn’t allow this invasion of my privacy… ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2011, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genome-sequencing-for-everybody/516388/55 "2011-04-14T18:14:12Z")
Genome sequencing for some, miniature American flags for others! ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2011, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genome-sequencing-for-everybody/516388/56 "2011-04-14T18:19:25Z")
Speaking as a Cancer researcher who is struggling to effectively analyze the several hundred genomes he has at his disposal, I’m not sure how one would even begin to make sense of a three hundred million of them. For data analysis purposes I would think a few thousand up to perhaps ten thousand “normal” controls would suffice to measure the background genetic diversity of the population. Beyond that studies targeting specific diseases would make more sense than a blanket sequencing. If the price becomes low enough I would definitely be in favor of genetic sequencing done on all patients that are part of a clinical trial. Doing so and making it public would provide ample data for any research needs. As far as targeted therapy goes, this can likely be done with a non-comprehensive genetic test that will be much cheaper. Now if the price goes way down, and if our understanding of the genome goes way up then we may reach the point that routine individual genetic sequencing makes sense in the same way that cholesterol screening does today. In that case it will be more the health care market than the government that will be behind it. Wow I think this is the first time I sided with the free market over government on this board. I may have to turn in my yellow-dog liberal card. ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2011, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genome-sequencing-for-everybody/516388/57 "2011-04-14T18:24:29Z")
> [@CitizenPained](#): > > I mentioned the Amish because I was thinking about how much more private they were (no SSNs, no internet, etc). Ironically, since there is a fair amount of inbreeding in Amish communities, the Amish are among the groups of people for which we have the most genetic data. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2011, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genome-sequencing-for-everybody/516388/58 "2011-04-14T20:06:13Z")
> [@CitizenPained](#): > > I didn’t say anything about government thugs beating people up. 😕😕 That’s kind of implied with “oppressive”. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genome-sequencing-for-everybody/516388.md?page=2)