# Genre Fiction Mafia **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [May 19, 2011, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genre-fiction-mafia/582387 "2011-05-19T01:03:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 44
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2011, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genre-fiction-mafia/582387/861 "2011-06-06T20:05:21Z")
> [@Normal\_Phase](#): > > Why is this supposed to be so anti-town/scummy anyway? Even accepting that ties are in fact bad in this game, there were three hours left in the Day at the time of Hirka’s vote. That’s a philosophical difference, I suppose. Given the typical play schedules of people on here, I turn a gimlet eye on people who do stupid things to the vote count in the last 8 hours or so. And unless we have a specific, mathematically sound plan for why it is otherwise, no-lynch (or actions that have a high chance of causing a no-lynch) are always 100% bad. ---
**Author:** ![Normal\_Phase](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Normal\_Phase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Normal_Phase)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2011, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genre-fiction-mafia/582387/862 "2011-06-06T20:10:02Z")
I’m not arguing that. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2011, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genre-fiction-mafia/582387/863 "2011-06-06T20:15:56Z")
Meh. \*\*vote Gnarly Pretty much for disappearing when he took a bit of heat. ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2011, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genre-fiction-mafia/582387/864 "2011-06-06T20:21:54Z")
> [@Tom\_Scud](#): > > which leaves me without a vote and with crap-all contribution so far Today. I sure hope Gnarly is scum and not a super-petulant Townie. Surely there is SOMEONE who has pinged you as the most scummy. As for the super-petulant townie defense, well…that ship has SAILED. That ship sailed in my first damn mafia game, in fact (in which we had both an instance of someone getting so mad about the way the game was going that they subbed out (guess what, they were scum) and an instance of the patented Idle histrionic defense (guess what, he was scum).) ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2011, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genre-fiction-mafia/582387/865 "2011-06-06T20:25:36Z")
Bear in mind you’re talking to someone who subbed out of a Meeko-gone-apeshit game. ---
**Author:** ![Astral\_Rejection](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/258eb7/32.png) [@Astral\_Rejection](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astral_Rejection)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2011, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genre-fiction-mafia/582387/866 "2011-06-06T20:27:28Z")
I’m feeling pretty good about the gnarly vote for exactly that reason. ---
**Author:** ![Astral\_Rejection](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/258eb7/32.png) [@Astral\_Rejection](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astral_Rejection)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2011, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genre-fiction-mafia/582387/867 "2011-06-06T20:28:28Z")
(in response to Normal Phase, re: gnarly’s self-vote) ---
**Author:** ![Normal\_Phase](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Normal\_Phase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Normal_Phase)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2011, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genre-fiction-mafia/582387/868 "2011-06-06T20:56:39Z")
I’ve seen both town and scum do things like this, so I’m hesitant giving it too much credence in itself. Happily for my current peace of mind, that’s not the only thing against him. ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2011, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genre-fiction-mafia/582387/869 "2011-06-06T20:56:45Z")
I don’t have a problem with the gnarly lynch. **vote gnarlycharlie** ---
**Author:** ![MHaye](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/bbe5ce/32.png) [@MHaye](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MHaye)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2011, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genre-fiction-mafia/582387/870 "2011-06-06T21:44:53Z")
I apologise for silence. I had a couple of rl things come up that had to be fitted in this evening, and they just took longer than I expected them to. > [@Zeriel](#): > > As for the super-petulant townie defense, well…that ship has SAILED. That ship sailed in my first damn mafia game, in fact (in which we had both an instance of someone getting so mad about the way the game was going that they subbed out (guess what, they were scum) and an instance of the patented Idle histrionic defense (guess what, he was scum).) Zeriel, Idle’s histrionics were a deliberate echo of his actions in the Good Ship Hispaniola, when he was Town. You can’t draw any conclusions from it either way. I’m not happy with Gnarly’s reaction, because it hurts his own team whoever it may be. Unfortunately it appears to be a done deal now. I’m going to review a couple of cases and hopefully place a vote. ---
**Author:** ![Red\_Skeezix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/aca169/32.png) [@Red\_Skeezix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Red_Skeezix)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2011, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genre-fiction-mafia/582387/871 "2011-06-06T21:48:10Z")
gnarlycharlie(7): Mahaloth[718], Hirka T’Bawa[723], Astral Rejection[725], [del]Normal Phase[del][735-850][/del][/del], gnarlycharlie[740], Pleonast[760], Tom Scud[863], Inner Stickler[869] Pleonast(3): pedescribe[775], Winston Smith[790], fluiddruid[791] Inner Stickler(3): SisterCoyote[792], Silver Jan[837], Stanislaus[849] Astral Rejection(2): gnarlycharlie[719], TexCat[844] Hirka T’Bawa(2): Weedy[833], [del]Tom Scud[del][839-860][/del][/del], Zeriel[841] Silver Jan(1): Normal Phase[850] TexCat(0): [del]Stanislaus[del][751-849][/del][/del] Did Not Vote:nesta, MHaye With these votes gnarlycharlie would be lynched. ---
**Author:** ![MHaye](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/bbe5ce/32.png) [@MHaye](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MHaye)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2011, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genre-fiction-mafia/582387/872 "2011-06-06T21:51:37Z")
> [@Red\_Skeezix](#): > > gnarlycharlie(7): Mahaloth[718], Hirka T’Bawa[723], Astral Rejection[725], [del]Normal Phase[del][735-850][/del][/del], gnarlycharlie[740], Pleonast[760], Tom Scud[863], Inner Stickler[869] > Pleonast(3): pedescribe[775], Winston Smith[790], fluiddruid[791] > Inner Stickler(3): SisterCoyote[792], Silver Jan[837], Stanislaus[849] > Astral Rejection(2): gnarlycharlie[719], TexCat[844] > Hirka T’Bawa(2): Weedy[833], [del]Tom Scud[del][839-860][/del][/del], Zeriel[841] > Silver Jan(1): Normal Phase[850] > TexCat(0): [del]Stanislaus[del][751-849][/del][/del] > Did Not Vote:nesta, MHaye > > With these votes gnarlycharlie would be lynched. **Gnarlycharlie is listed as voting twice - in 719 for Astral Rejection and 740for himself. Is that correct?** ---
**Author:** ![nesta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a4c791/32.png) [@nesta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nesta)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2011, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genre-fiction-mafia/582387/873 "2011-06-06T21:59:24Z")
Sorry for my low participation Today. Short weeks are always crazy but I was hoping to have time over the weekend, but that didn’t happen. I’ve spent what little time I had today going over **gnarly’s** and **Hirka’s** activity. I’m leaning **gnarly**. I don’t like the self-vote and disappearing. He is very defensive, and although he says a number of times that he’s going to contribute more that never materializes. As **Normal** pointed out, he seems more concerned that he’s suspected than he does with looking for scum. The thing I find most suspicious about **Hirka** is the strong defense of **Astral**. That line of thought didn’t work very well Yesterday, so I’m trying not to assign it undue weight. **Vote gnarlycharlie** ---
**Author:** ![Astral\_Rejection](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/258eb7/32.png) [@Astral\_Rejection](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astral_Rejection)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2011, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genre-fiction-mafia/582387/874 "2011-06-06T22:07:40Z")
> [@MHaye](#): > > **Gnarlycharlie is listed as voting twice - in 719 for Astral Rejection and 740for himself. Is that correct?** Same thing happened yesterday, with three extra votes for me. Red just really wants me dead. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![MHaye](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/bbe5ce/32.png) [@MHaye](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MHaye)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2011, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genre-fiction-mafia/582387/875 "2011-06-06T22:13:37Z")
A quick comment on Zeriel, who I voted for Yesterday. Zeriel has been quiet Today, citing arguments with his computer, which means there is little extra fuel for the fire. About the only thing that bothered me in his participation Today was [post=13882465]post 841[/post]. His assertion that Hirka caused a tie Yesterday is wrong; and since his vote was based on that false statement it needs to be removed or rejustified. At post 634, Fubbleskag had 6 votes and Pleo 5. Hirka switched from Pleo to Fubbleskag, making the vote 7-4. One vote was added for each player y post 645, making the vote 8-5. Then Hirka switched back in 649, making the vote 7-6 in Fubbleskag’s favour. At no time in that sequence of votes was there a tie. ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2011, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genre-fiction-mafia/582387/876 "2011-06-06T22:18:41Z")
> [@MHaye](#): > > Zeriel, Idle’s histrionics were a deliberate echo of his actions in the Good Ship Hispaniola, when he was Town. You can’t draw any conclusions from it either way. That was my point. The ship has sailed. The scum examples were to remind people that the histrionic/anger defense has been used by scum. ---
**Author:** ![MHaye](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/bbe5ce/32.png) [@MHaye](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MHaye)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2011, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genre-fiction-mafia/582387/877 "2011-06-06T22:34:04Z")
Something Pleo said in one of his long posts bothered me. > [@Pleonast](#): > > Also note that I am not voting for **gnarlycharlie** because they are not voting for scum. I am voting for them because they are voting for a player they do not think is scum. **charlie** has not expressed any reason for why they think their vote is on scum. That is why my vote. He’s very confident he knows what Gnarlycharlie is thinking. If Pleo’s vote was based on Gnarly voting for someone Gnarly claimed was not an ALE drinker, he’d have a consistent ground for his vote; but he doesn’t. He asserts Gnarly is not an ALE drinker. (He does this by claiming that Gnarly thinks Gnarly is not an ALE drinker; but this is only possible if Gnarly is not in fact an ALE drinker.) Further, he then votes for Gnarly, even though he plainly believes Gnarly is not an ALE drinker. This behaviour contradicts his claimed principle, the breaching of which was the ground for his vote of Gnarly. **Vote Pleonast** for the contradiction. ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2011, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genre-fiction-mafia/582387/878 "2011-06-06T22:41:58Z")
> [@MHaye](#): > > His assertion that Hirka caused a tie Yesterday is wrong; and since his vote was based on that false statement it needs to be removed or rejustified. > > At post 634, Fubbleskag had 6 votes and Pleo 5. Hirka switched from Pleo to Fubbleskag, making the vote 7-4. And \*\*Astral \*\*had 7 as well, according to the count in Post 629. **Hrika** ’s vote at Post 635 tied it between \*\*Fubbleskag \*\*and **Astral**. Fubbleskag then got massive town cred for unvoting Astral in Post 636 to untie it. At that point it’s 7 fubble, 6 Astral, 4 Pleo. Next vote is Fubble, post 641, for Pleo. 7 Fubble, 6 Astral, 5 Pleo. Next vote is TexCat, post 645, unvotes astral and votes fubble. 8 fubble, 5 Astral, 5 Pleo. Next vote is Hrika, post 649, who inexplicably switches BACK to Pleo, pushing it back closer to a tie. 7 fubble, 5 Astral, 6 Pleo. * * * Want to apologize for your false statement or careless counting there, **MHaye**? ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2011, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genre-fiction-mafia/582387/879 "2011-06-06T22:44:39Z")
Normal Phase gets a nice big FOS for also, somewhat inexplicably, assuming I meant that Hrika tied up fubble and Pleo, while (just like MHaye) completely ignoring the vote leader who he DID tie fubble with. ---
**Author:** ![Normal\_Phase](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Normal\_Phase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Normal_Phase)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2011, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genre-fiction-mafia/582387/880 "2011-06-06T22:49:59Z")
I was just about to ask why you didn’t say anything about me making that mistake when you responded earlier; I just didn’t see 635. I looked for a Hirka vote near the end of the day, found 649, and assumed it was what you were talking about. Since you have now FOSed me, OK I guess. MHaye, am I to take your earlier comment as implying that you are not in favor of the gnarly lynch? If so, why? There’s lots more to it than just his emotional response. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genre-fiction-mafia/582387.md?page=43) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/genre-fiction-mafia/582387.md?page=45)