# Geographical oddities (another thread) **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [December 10, 2014, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/geographical-oddities-another-thread/706895 "2014-12-10T23:11:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![vontsira](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/51bf81/32.png) [@vontsira](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vontsira)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2014, 8:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/geographical-oddities-another-thread/706895/121 "2014-12-16T08:57:31Z")
> [@vontsira](#): > > Re that general part of the world: I was surprised and intrigued to discover a couple of years ago (by chance, in course of a project undertaken) that the New York borough of Staten Island is not only separated by a wide stretch of water from the rest of New York; but is to its west, hard-up-against New Jersey – separated from NJ by only a narrow channel. I’d hitherto imagined Staten Island as being “in splendid isolation”. In practical terms, it might seem to make more sense for S.I. to be part of New Jersey; but how boring and fun-devoid, that would be… > [@CalMeacham](#): > > Yes – I’ve long argued that Staten Island really ought to be part of New Jersey. It’s separated from NJ only by the Arthur Kill and the Kill van Kull. The only thing physically connecting it to the rest of New York is the Verrazano-Narrows bridge, which was an architectural marvel at the time because bit was so long. (The only other connection is the Staten Island Ferry). Staten Island is so remote from the city that it really does feel more like Suburban New Jersey. **And it’s the only borough that lacks a subway**. In my understanding, Staten Island does have a subway, kind-of (finding out about the island’s railway status, past and present, was the project which alerted me to its odd-geography aspect). If I have things rightly, the island has one passenger rail line: St. George to Tottenville, 14 miles – part of what used to be a more extensive system. This line is third-rail electric, and run, like the NY subways proper, by the New York City Transit Authority. The line uses modified versions of the subways’ standard passenger stock, and is usually reckoned as an isolated, and all-above-ground, portion of the subway system. ---
**Author:** ![Iggy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iggy/32/3364_2.png) [@Iggy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Iggy)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2014, 10:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/geographical-oddities-another-thread/706895/122 "2014-12-16T10:02:58Z")
> [@Peremensoe](#): > > No way. Bristol to Memphis is 500 miles. Which leads to the trivia tidbit… Bristol, TN is closer, as the crow flies, to Canada than to Memphis, TN. ---
**Author:** ![Cunctator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/43a26b/32.png) [@Cunctator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cunctator)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2014, 10:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/geographical-oddities-another-thread/706895/123 "2014-12-16T10:22:18Z")
The northernmost point of Victoria is at the same latitude as the southern suburbs of Sydney. ---
**Author:** ![Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/earl_snake-hips_tucker/32/3269_2.png) [@Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Earl_Snake-Hips_Tucker)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2014, 12:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/geographical-oddities-another-thread/706895/124 "2014-12-16T12:00:44Z")
> [@Shagnasty](#): > > Atlanta, Georgia is closer Chicago, Illinois than it is to Miami, Florida. It a fact that many people have a hard time with but measure it if you don’t believe me. As the crow flies, yes. But to drive it, Miami is a little closer. ---
**Author:** ![JKellyMap](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jkellymap/32/15880_2.png) [@JKellyMap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKellyMap)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2014, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/geographical-oddities-another-thread/706895/125 "2014-12-16T15:38:08Z")
> [@vontsira](#): > > In my understanding, Staten Island does have a subway, kind-of (finding out about the island’s railway status, past and present, was the project which alerted me to its odd-geography aspect). If I have things rightly, the island has one passenger rail line: St. George to Tottenville, 14 miles – part of what used to be a more extensive system. This line is third-rail electric, and run, like the NY subways proper, by the New York City Transit Authority. The line uses modified versions of the subways’ standard passenger stock, and is usually reckoned as an isolated, and all-above-ground, portion of the subway system. Yes. In fact, a majority of the NYC subway system’s track miles are ABOVE ground. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2014, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/geographical-oddities-another-thread/706895/126 "2014-12-16T16:09:25Z")
> [@vontsira](#): > > In my understanding, Staten Island does have a subway, kind-of (finding out about the island’s railway status, past and present, was the project which alerted me to its odd-geography aspect). If I have things rightly, the island has one passenger rail line: St. George to Tottenville, 14 miles – part of what used to be a more extensive system. This line is third-rail electric, and run, like the NY subways proper, by the New York City Transit Authority. The line uses modified versions of the subways’ standard passenger stock, and is usually reckoned as an isolated, and all-above-ground, portion of the subway system. That’s sort of special pleading. The Staten Island railway was not built by the companies responsible for the subways in the rest of Manhattan, and at first nobody thought it was going to link up with them. Then in the 1920s they thought somebody was going to build a tunnel under the Narrows (!) and finally link up with the subway system. So they electrified the system and started using standard subway trains. But the link-up never happened. So now they have a railway that looks like a subway and is operated by the same authority, but it still doesn’t connect with the rest of the system or go underground at any point. It’s like a case of convergent evolution, with the Staten Island railway as the dolphin to the ichthyosaurus that is the rest of New York’s Subway system. > **[Staten Island Railway](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Staten_Island_Railway)** > > .mw-parser-output .RMbox{box-shadow:0 2px 2px 0 rgba(0,0,0,.14),0 1px 5px 0 rgba(0,0,0,.12),0 3px 1px -2px rgba(0,0,0,.2)}.mw-parser-output .RMinline{float:none;width:100%;margin:0;border:none}.mw-parser-output table.routemap{padding:0;border:0;border-collapse:collapse;background:transparent;white-space:nowrap;line-height:1.2;margin:auto}.mw-parser-output table.routemap .RMcollapse{margin:0;border-collapse:collapse;vertical-align:middle}.mw-parser-output table.routemap .RMreplace{margin:0;bor... ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2014, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/geographical-oddities-another-thread/706895/127 "2014-12-16T16:39:47Z")
> [@Greg\_Charles](#): > > A ship could sail from Pakistan to Kamchatka without turning. That’s the longest straight sea route on the planet. Wow…wow. ---
**Author:** ![Baron\_Greenback](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baron_greenback/32/48_2.png) [@Baron\_Greenback](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baron_Greenback)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2014, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/geographical-oddities-another-thread/706895/128 "2014-12-16T16:51:40Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > Wow…wow. That was my reaction too. This short video demonstrates [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VpQwuGueeoA](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VpQwuGueeoA) It’s not the most efficient route, but still 🆒 ---
**Author:** ![Freddy\_the\_Pig](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a587f6/32.png) [@Freddy\_the\_Pig](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freddy_the_Pig)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2014, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/geographical-oddities-another-thread/706895/129 "2014-12-16T17:21:35Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > My favorite oddity, which I’ve mentioned before, is the _Kentucky Bend_. As a result of the meandering Mississippi, the extreme western chunk of Kentucky got isolated from the rest of the state when the Mississippi shifted south, allowing Missouri to spill over into Tennessee and cut off that bit of Kentucky. Apparently the state boundaries were defined by the river, not by what it had been in the past. The Kentucky bend has existed for as long as the boundary has been surveyed. The boundary parallel grew out of the old Virginia and North Carolina colonial charters, and when they surveyed it out to the Mississippi in the early 1800’s they made the delightful discovery that it intersected the Mississippi not once but three times. At some point the river probably _will_ shift. The Mississippi, via earthquake or flood, will cut across the neck of the meander. When that happens, the boundary will _not_ shift with the river. The Kentucky Bend will remain in Kentucky, and look even weirder than it does today. The land connection to Tennessee will be a detached part of Tennessee west of the (new) Mississippi River. The Bend will be ringed to the north by an oxbow lake, which may or may not extend down to the KY/TN border. If it doesn’t, there will be a direct land connection between the Bend and Missouri. ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2014, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/geographical-oddities-another-thread/706895/130 "2014-12-16T17:37:07Z")
> [@dtilque](#): > > There’s lots of other exclaves out there, but perhaps my favorite is [Jungholz](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jungholz) Austria. It’s completely surrounded by Germany except at a single point on top of a mountain where it touches the rest of Austria. I like this one. Not quite an exclave, but it’s connection to the rest of Austria is about 20 feet wide, along generally inaccessible mountain terrain. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![elmwood](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmwood/32/3060_2.png) [@elmwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elmwood)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2014, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/geographical-oddities-another-thread/706895/131 "2014-12-16T17:38:51Z")
The most direct driving route between the two largest cities in New York State, New York City and Buffalo, [passes through Pennsylvania and New Jersey](https://www.google.com/maps/dir/Niagara+Square,+Buffalo,+NY+14202/Times+Square,+New+York,+NY/). ---
**Author:** ![Zeldar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/b77776/32.png) [@Zeldar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeldar)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2014, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/geographical-oddities-another-thread/706895/132 "2014-12-16T17:51:55Z")
Just an idle curiosity based question: Is there any place on Planet Earth where the old adage/saying “You can’t get there from here” is true? Assuming there’s not such an actual place, what comes closest? If it matters, I have no clue! ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2014, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/geographical-oddities-another-thread/706895/133 "2014-12-16T18:08:55Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > That’s sort of special pleading. The Staten Island railway was not built by the companies responsible for the subways in the rest of Manhattan, and at first nobody thought it was going to link up with them. Yes, but the subways of the rest of New York City were originally built by three different companies or city entities, and to this day there is poor connectivity, redundancy, and incompatibility between the former IRT, BMT, and IND systems. The IND originally had no connections to the other systems. BMT and IND trains are longer and wider than IRT trains, so BMT/IND trains can’t fit in IRT tunnels and IRT trains are too narrow to safely use BMT/IND platforms. (I grew up along a IRT line in the Bronx, and I remember how weird the BMT train seemed the first time I took one to Coney Island, with a completely different seating layout.) The Staten Island line may not be physically connected to the rest of the system, but the IRT isn’t connected to the rest of the system either in terms of trains, only in that in some places you can walk between IRT and BMT/IND platforms within the same station. Other than that it’s not really that much of an outlier. The first time I took it I was struck by how similar it was to the rest of the system; I had expect it to be more different. All four rapid transit lines in New York are cases of convergent evolution, not just the Staten Island line. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2014, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/geographical-oddities-another-thread/706895/134 "2014-12-16T18:21:55Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > Yes, but the subways of the rest of New York City were originally built by three different companies or city entities, and to this day there is poor connectivity, redundancy, and incompatibility between the former IRT, BMT, and IND systems. The IND originally had no connections to the other systems. BMT and IND trains are longer and wider than IRT trains, so BMT/IND trains can’t fit in IRT tunnels and IRT trains are too narrow to safely use BMT/IND platforms. (I grew up along a IRT line in the Bronx, and I remember how weird the BMT train seemed the first time I took one to Coney Island, with a completely different seating layout.) The Staten Island line may not be physically connected to the rest of the system, but the IRT isn’t connected to the rest of the system either in terms of trains, only in that in some places you can walk between IRT and BMT/IND platforms within the same station. Other than that it’s not really that much of an outlier. The first time I took it I was struck by how similar it was to the rest of the system; I had expect it to be more different. All four rapid transit lines in New York are cases of convergent evolution, not just the Staten Island line. Yes, I know all that. But although the IND, BMT, and IRT were built by separate companies, they were all commissioned by the city as subways. Why they ended up so different, and with incompatible train/tunnel sizes and with absurd duplications of routes in many areas (with unserved sections in others) I still do not know. It’s an example of incredibly poor planning or unresolved responsibilities. The Staten Island railroad was not part of that whole mess, but its own line with no underground route or similarity to the casrs of the subways, that was brought in later. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2014, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/geographical-oddities-another-thread/706895/135 "2014-12-16T18:23:13Z")
> [@clairobscur](#): > > With which country France has the longest border? > > With Brazil, in French Guiana : 730 km Second longest is with Spain (620 km) I have to challenge (pedantically) the second part: it looks to me like the border with Belgium is longer than _either run of_ the two borders with Spain. ---
**Author:** ![Diceman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Diceman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diceman)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2014, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/geographical-oddities-another-thread/706895/136 "2014-12-16T18:24:34Z")
> [@Zeldar](#): > > Just an idle curiosity based question: Is there any place on Planet Earth where the old adage/saying “You can’t get there from here” is true? > > Assuming there’s not such an actual place, what comes closest? > > If it matters, I have no clue! Good question. I’m sure the Canadian arctic is full of places that no human being has ever visited. If we restrict to places where people actually live, I’d suggest Pitcairn Island, or some other remote island that’s too small to have an airport would be the most difficult place to access. ---
**Author:** ![cjepson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a9adbd/32.png) [@cjepson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cjepson)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2014, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/geographical-oddities-another-thread/706895/137 "2014-12-16T18:41:21Z")
> [@Zeldar](#): > > Just an idle curiosity based question: Is there any place on Planet Earth where the old adage/saying “You can’t get there from here” is true? If you mean that literally, then what you’re asking is whether there is any place on the surface of the Earth that a human cannot get to by any means. I would think that the most likely candidate would be the middle of some large volcanic caldera. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2014, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/geographical-oddities-another-thread/706895/138 "2014-12-16T18:42:11Z")
R’lyeh ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2014, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/geographical-oddities-another-thread/706895/139 "2014-12-16T18:50:43Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > Yes, I know all that. But although the IND, BMT, and IRT were built by separate companies, they were all commissioned by the city as subways. Why they ended up so different, and with incompatible train/tunnel sizes and with absurd duplications of routes in many areas (with unserved sections in others) I still do not know. It’s an example of incredibly poor planning or unresolved responsibilities. The Staten Island railroad was not part of that whole mess, but its own line with no underground route or similarity to the casrs of the subways, that was brought in later. Well, no, they weren’t all commissioned as subways, if by that you mean entirely underground systems. As has been said, most of the “subway” system is above ground. The Third Avenue El and other Els were entirely or almost entirely elevated even in Manhattan. I don’t see the fact that the Staten Island line is entirely above ground as a fundamental distinction. The IND is the only real “subway” system, with almost all of its track below ground. The Staten Island line is an oddity, but there are lots of other oddities in the system. ---
**Author:** ![vontsira](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/51bf81/32.png) [@vontsira](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vontsira)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2014, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/geographical-oddities-another-thread/706895/140 "2014-12-16T20:22:34Z")
I feel that it was me who set off the dispute about the Staten Island rail line: I just couldn’t resist commenting – with it having been the assignment which I was doing, which brought Staten Island and its rail route (of whose existence I’d hitherto been unaware) to my close notice in the first place. As a Brit, I feel that I’m in no position to pontificate about US railroads / subways 🙂 – can see where both sides are coming from in the difference of opinion. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/geographical-oddities-another-thread/706895.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/geographical-oddities-another-thread/706895.md?page=8)