# George Bush is a Brave Man **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 13, 2004, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/george-bush-is-a-brave-man/274574 "2004-11-13T16:41:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Aeschines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aeschines/32/16251_2.png) [@Aeschines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aeschines)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2004, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/george-bush-is-a-brave-man/274574/21 "2004-11-13T18:18:26Z")
> [@F. U. Shakespeare](#): > > Point being: there was much less security in the past. The security level _really_ racheted up after the attempt on Reagan. After the McKinley assassination, the Secret Service began to protect the president. So I would say that was “rachet #1.” I don’t know when #2 would have taken place. After the attempt on Truman? Kennedy getting killed? ## Wouldn’t the attempt on Reagan have been several rachets along? As for the OP, I agree with **Orbifold’s** analysis. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2004, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/george-bush-is-a-brave-man/274574/22 "2004-11-13T18:28:58Z")
> [@Neurotik](#): > > Frankly, Dio, I think this is just the early salvo in the attempt at the hagiography of Bush ala Reagan. I’m waiting for the inevitable Mt. Rushmore push. ---
**Author:** ![Aeschines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aeschines/32/16251_2.png) [@Aeschines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aeschines)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2004, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/george-bush-is-a-brave-man/274574/23 "2004-11-13T18:30:57Z")
They’re gonna put Alfred E. Newman on Mt. Rushmore? BTW, well put, **Dio**. ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2004, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/george-bush-is-a-brave-man/274574/24 "2004-11-13T18:41:46Z")
To quote Super Chicken, “You knew the job was dangerous when you took it, Fred.” Saying the POTUS is brave because he knows he’s going to be a target for the assorted crackpots out there is trivializing the word, IMO. After all, the POTUS has a Secret Service detail, goes out in public escorted by some sort of local police detail, and knows that anywhere he goes gets cleared for his personal safety. Contrast that to (say) police officers or firefighters, who don’t have any of these luxuries, risk getting killed in unexpected situations (is that guy you just pulled over for speeding going to try to ambush you?), and are fully expected to throw themselves in harm’s way for any civilian who’s endangered. This is not to say that the job of POTUS is trivial – it can be damn hard, especially when you’re working 16-hour days trying to make the world a better place while a hostile Republican Congress is nipping at your heels – but “brave” is not exactly the foremost word to describe the job. ---
**Author:** ![SPOOFE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c5a1d2/32.png) [@SPOOFE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SPOOFE)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2004, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/george-bush-is-a-brave-man/274574/25 "2004-11-13T20:21:42Z")
> [@](#): > > I’d like to ask Sam Stone why Fundamentalist Muslims needed to be attacked Was it wrong when Clinton did it? Why or why not? (I don’t know why I ask… it’s just gonna result in more “Leave poor widdle Saint Clinton alone, you meanie!”) ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2004, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/george-bush-is-a-brave-man/274574/26 "2004-11-13T20:29:41Z")
Clinton didn’t do it. ---
**Author:** ![Rashak\_Mani](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ea666f/32.png) [@Rashak\_Mani](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rashak_Mani)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2004, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/george-bush-is-a-brave-man/274574/27 "2004-11-13T20:53:19Z")
How about being wounded or pshycollogically crippled ? How many presidents were crippled by their “service” ? Would anyone here think its more dangerous to sleep in the White House than serving in Iraq ? ---
**Author:** ![coffeecat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/coffeecat/32/3405_2.png) [@coffeecat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/coffeecat)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2004, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/george-bush-is-a-brave-man/274574/28 "2004-11-13T21:20:07Z")
Courage isn’t just about objective danger. Lying in a foxhole while bombs explode around you has a certain immediacy, and it takes some Big Brass Ones to face the threat. I don’t think the president feels that sitting in his office, regardless of how objectively dangerous it may be. Driving without your seat belt while smoking is dangerous too, but it doesn’t make you brave to do it. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Flying\_Dutchman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/9fc348/32.png) [@The\_Flying\_Dutchman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Flying_Dutchman)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2004, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/george-bush-is-a-brave-man/274574/29 "2004-11-13T21:36:43Z")
> [@Orbifold](#): > > Now to turn things around, why did _you_ ignore _my_ other point? Why is the probability of death the only thing you’re using to compare George Bush to the soldiers in Iraq, when there’s also a difference in the things they have to live through every day? Because your point is so obvious, and there just is no comparison. For another perspective I give you the [The 10 most dangerous jobs in America](http://money.msn.com/content/invest/extra/P63405.asp) > [@](#): > > The 10 most dangerous jobs > Occupation Fatalities per 100,000 > Timber cutters 117.8 > Fishers 71.1 > Pilots and navigators 69.8 > Structural metal workers 58.2 > Drivers-sales workers 37.9 > Roofers 37 > Electrical power installers 32.5 > Farm occupations 28 > Construction laborers 27.7 > Truck drivers 25 American presidents 9302 per 100,000 ---
**Author:** ![wolf\_meister](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolf_meister/32/15202_2.png) [@wolf\_meister](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolf_meister)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2004, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/george-bush-is-a-brave-man/274574/30 "2004-11-13T22:48:48Z")
Folks, for the record, there have only been 42 persons that have held the office of President of the United States. Grover Cleveland gets counted twice. So, adjust your statistics accordingly. (I guess this would make being President even more “dangerous”). :rolleyes: As far as being President? Even though it may be “risky”, the risk to reward ratio is fantastic !!! If nothing else, think of going to your high school reunion !!! Say ‘hello’ to every girl that refused to go out with you, go out of your way to meet every teacher who thought you’d be a failure, confront every bully who taunted you !!! AND if they give you any trouble ?? The Secret Service will bash their brains in. Also, once you’ve been President (at least in modern times) you are set for life !!! How much is Bill Clinton getting for book deals? Speaking engagements?? George W Bush has endangered himself and others by confronting terrorists? Well what did the people in the WTC, the Pentagon, or those 4 planes do to bring _that_ on themselves? Nothing. As others have said, I believe it is the folks in our military that did the brave thing. They joined, knowing full well that they might be put in harm’s way. And for what ? To get money for college? To help finance a house? To learn a job skill? Think about the risk to reward ratio for _that_ job and President seems a LOT more appealing. Perhaps we should open a thread aout how “tough” it is being a rock star, a movie star, etc. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2004, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/george-bush-is-a-brave-man/274574/31 "2004-11-13T23:02:18Z")
> [@Sam Stone](#): > > I agree with the OP 100%. It IS very dangerous. And Bush’s decision to take on Islamic fundamentalists made it infinitely more dangerous. Which does not precisely explain the dearth of assassination attempts. Though like the imaginary plot to Kill the first Bush, I imagine they might just make one up at some point. ---
**Author:** ![Zagadka](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zagadka/32/7272_2.png) [@Zagadka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zagadka)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2004, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/george-bush-is-a-brave-man/274574/32 "2004-11-13T23:07:40Z")
Know who else is brave, by those standards? The f_ing terrorists. I mean, come on, it takes cajones to kill 3,000 Americans while living in a cave. That Osama is one brave mother f_er. So was Che Guevara, so is Fidel Castro. Arafat, too. Those guys are pretty damn Brave. I mean, Bush has like a few million people protecting him, not to mention a crack squad of security experts. He can’t take a piss without someone making sure it is safe. Those guys I mentioned, all that stood between them and instant, horrible torture and death is a few friends and an AK-47. I wouldn’t call them “heroes” though. And they didn’t trade in risking their life daily and living in muddy squalor for being the most powerful person on the planet having cushy state dinners with foreign dignitaries. ---
**Author:** ![Ryan\_Liam](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ryan_liam/32/3965_2.png) [@Ryan\_Liam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ryan_Liam)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2004, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/george-bush-is-a-brave-man/274574/33 "2004-11-13T23:13:55Z")
> [@Zagadka](#): > > lol. He gets what he deserves. No, actually, he doesn’t. ---
**Author:** ![Zagadka](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zagadka/32/7272_2.png) [@Zagadka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zagadka)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2004, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/george-bush-is-a-brave-man/274574/34 "2004-11-13T23:16:07Z")
> [@Ryan\_Liam](#): > > No, actually, he doesn’t. With any luck, anyway. Actually, I don’t want Bush assassinated. That would suck, it’d mean we’d have Cheney leading, and I don’t even want to consider how much that would suck. ---
**Author:** ![Ryan\_Liam](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ryan_liam/32/3965_2.png) [@Ryan\_Liam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ryan_Liam)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2004, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/george-bush-is-a-brave-man/274574/35 "2004-11-13T23:28:03Z")
> [@Zagadka](#): > > With any luck, anyway. > > Actually, I don’t want Bush assassinated. That would suck, it’d mean we’d have Cheney leading, and I don’t even want to consider how much that would suck. :rolleyes: lets just hope you don’t get to office, that way, we’re both happy. ---
**Author:** ![Zagadka](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zagadka/32/7272_2.png) [@Zagadka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zagadka)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2004, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/george-bush-is-a-brave-man/274574/36 "2004-11-13T23:31:35Z")
> [@Ryan\_Liam](#): > > :rolleyes: lets just hope you don’t get to office, that way, we’re both happy. I wasn’t really planning on it, but if you think I have a shot, I could start a campaign for '08…? ---
**Author:** ![Ryan\_Liam](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ryan_liam/32/3965_2.png) [@Ryan\_Liam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ryan_Liam)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2004, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/george-bush-is-a-brave-man/274574/37 "2004-11-13T23:33:52Z")
> [@Zagadka](#): > > I wasn’t really planning on it, but if you think I have a shot, I could start a campaign for '08…? are you a troll? ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2004, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/george-bush-is-a-brave-man/274574/38 "2004-11-13T23:38:08Z")
I have to side with RedFury and Diogenes. I have a “problem”, or “issues” with Chickenhawks. ---
**Author:** ![Zagadka](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zagadka/32/7272_2.png) [@Zagadka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zagadka)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2004, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/george-bush-is-a-brave-man/274574/39 "2004-11-13T23:38:36Z")
> [@Ryan\_Liam](#): > > are you a troll? :smack: We’re in GD, genius. Anyway, I could ask the same of you. I make a statement that I consider Cheney unfit for the Presidency, and you say that you’re glad I’m not a candidate? WTF? ---
**Author:** ![Ryan\_Liam](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ryan_liam/32/3965_2.png) [@Ryan\_Liam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ryan_Liam)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2004, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/george-bush-is-a-brave-man/274574/40 "2004-11-13T23:40:24Z")
Because you say GWB is better in his position ‘fucking everything up’ because thats what he’s best at, and thats what you insinuate as well as saying the Reublican party cannot rule and is full of retards. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/george-bush-is-a-brave-man/274574.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/george-bush-is-a-brave-man/274574.md?page=3)