# Georgia governor signs strictest abortion bill in nation **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [May 8, 2019, 9:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659 "2019-05-08T09:49:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 42
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2019, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/821 "2019-06-01T21:27:25Z")
> [@elbows](#): > > How about we use the measure hospitals routinely use to decide if someone is dead and can be disconnected from life support? Beating hearts are disconnected when there ceases to be measurable brain activity. If a beating heart isn’t enough to keep that person connected to life support, it makes no sense that it be the threshold for a fetus to be maintained. > > In a fetus brain activity is measurable at 24 weeks. Without brain activity it is no more alive than a brain dead patient. I suppose if I was a pro-choice American, I could picture that being an acceptable cut-off for purely-elective procedures, i.e. 22-23 weeks, before the brain-activity stage, but as part of that compromise I’d want to put an end to bullshit delaying tactics and medically-irrelevant regulations and I’d have misgivings that pro-lifers would be able to resist trying to reintroduce them. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2019, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/822 "2019-06-01T21:37:21Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > I suppose if I was a pro-choice American, I could picture that being an acceptable cut-off for purely-elective procedures, i.e. 22-23 weeks, before the brain-activity stage, but as part of that compromise I’d want to put an end to bullshit delaying tactics and medically-irrelevant regulations and I’d have misgivings that pro-lifers would be able to resist trying to reintroduce them. I’m about the same way but without so much of a misgiving as an expectation that the right would continue to attempt to bite away with irrelevant laws. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2019, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/823 "2019-06-01T21:49:54Z")
Yes, you’re right, I was just being polite. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2019, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/824 "2019-06-01T23:39:16Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > One male dog can impregnate quite a number of females. That’s exactly why it’s pointless. You start with 100 males and 100 females, then neuter 99 of the males and leave the females alone, and you get 100 litters of puppies (fathered by a very busy, and happy, sire). Spay 99 females and leave the males alone, and you get one litter (from a very. very popular bitch, LOL). Point taken on behavioral stuff, but for population control it’s spaying that matters. You’re never going to get to 100 percent, but spaying even 50 percent of females cuts the next generation in half. ---
**Author:** ![not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/not_what_you_d_expect/32/3246_2.png) [@not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/not_what_you_d_expect)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2019, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/825 "2019-06-02T01:28:05Z")
Why the fuck are we talking about dogs? My body, my choice. End of fucking story. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2019, 3:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/826 "2019-06-02T03:18:09Z")
> [@not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](#): > > … My body, my choice. End of fucking story. Sorry, but that’s not how we do things in a democracy. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2019, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/827 "2019-06-02T03:44:12Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Sorry, but that’s not how we do things in a democracy. Well, not _American_ democracy. Canadian democracy said “Okay” a while ago. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2019, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/828 "2019-06-02T15:06:11Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Sorry, but that’s not how we do things in a democracy. Wow, way to try to make democracy look like a tyranny. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2019, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/829 "2019-06-02T15:08:22Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Well, not _American_ democracy. Canadian democracy said “Okay” a while ago. Yes, the unelected Senators. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2019, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/830 "2019-06-02T15:13:57Z")
Canadians (including some in my own family) love to talk high and mighty, but they seem to forget that nearly all the time we had Obama in the Oval Office, they had Stephen Harper at 24 Sussex. (For those who don’t know Canadian politics, Harper is…not good. Not Trump type bad, but definitely Mitch McConnell type bad.) ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2019, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/831 "2019-06-02T16:19:28Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > Canadians (including some in my own family) love to talk high and mighty, but they seem to forget that nearly all the time we had Obama in the Oval Office, they had Stephen Harper at 24 Sussex. (For those who don’t know Canadian politics, Harper is…not good. Not Trump type bad, but definitely Mitch McConnell type bad.) Mitch McConnell makes Harper look saintly. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2019, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/832 "2019-06-02T17:05:41Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > Canadians (including some in my own family) love to talk high and mighty, but they seem to forget that nearly all the time we had Obama in the Oval Office, they had Stephen Harper at 24 Sussex. (For those who don’t know Canadian politics, Harper is…not good. Not Trump type bad, but definitely Mitch McConnell type bad.) I don’t really see how pointing out comparisons of different laws regarding reproductive rights and how they have played out for the public benefit is being “high and mighty”, but does that mean that having Trump in the Oval office mean that your opinions are invalid? ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2019, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/833 "2019-06-02T18:19:01Z")
Hmm, might be a new metric for evaluating the validity of expressed political opinion - it’s tied to the stupidity level of your highest elected official. Hence, no American has anything of value to say on the topic until at least January 2021. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2019, 3:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/834 "2019-06-03T03:31:07Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > I don’t really see how pointing out comparisons of different laws regarding reproductive rights and how they have played out for the public benefit is being “high and mighty”, but does that mean that having Trump in the Oval office mean that your opinions are invalid? It means I certainly can’t say we’re doing better than Canada right now. But I remember my mom’s significant other circa mid-2006 lording it over me about how “Americans love Bush, they just like to march to that fascist beat” or whatever. Then a few months later, Pelosi became Speaker and Harper became PM with a Conservative-controlled legislature (which is how it works in parliamentary systems: no division between the legislative and executive branches). And a couple years after that, we got Obama and full control of Congress, while Harper and the Conservatives continued to reign supreme up north. I’m just saying, don’t get too fucking smug up there in the Great White North, because things can reverse rather quickly. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2019, 5:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/835 "2019-06-03T05:14:54Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > It means I certainly can’t say we’re doing better than Canada right now. But I remember my mom’s significant other circa mid-2006 lording it over me about how “Americans love Bush, they just like to march to that fascist beat” or whatever. Then a few months later, Pelosi became Speaker and Harper became PM with a Conservative-controlled legislature (which is how it works in parliamentary systems: no division between the legislative and executive branches). And a couple years after that, we got Obama and full control of Congress, while Harper and the Conservatives continued to reign supreme up north. So this is about a family feud? Heh, lemme tell you about my family… > [@](#): > > I’m just saying, don’t get too fucking smug up there in the Great White North, because things can reverse rather quickly. You think that Canada is going to impose restrictions on reproductive rights in the near future? ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2019, 5:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/836 "2019-06-03T05:47:06Z")
Who knows. What I’m saying is that Canadians often take a pose (and not just in my family, I have heard it from people I am mildly acquainted with, people I’ve just met, and people who post on boards like this) of smugly clucking, “We are so much more civilized up here. My my, it’s so shocking and terrible what goes on in the States.” And yeah, being stuck with the old Confederacy does hold us back, oftentimes. But if we severed that region and operated a country with just the rest of it (even still including hardcore red states like Oklahoma, Kansas, Indiana, etc.), we would be \*way \*more progressive than Canada. That Harper and the Conservatives were in charge until so recently shows that even without that slave-state legacy, Canada is on the knife’s edge, just like we are–and given Trudeau’s unpopularity, a Conservative comeback in the near future hardly looks impossible to imagine. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2019, 6:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/837 "2019-06-03T06:17:41Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > Who knows. What I’m saying is that Canadians often take a pose (and not just in my family, I have heard it from people I am mildly acquainted with, people I’ve just met, and people who post on boards like this) of smugly clucking, “We are so much more civilized up here. My my, it’s so shocking and terrible what goes on in the States.” When they talk about healthcare, they deserve to be smug and I agree with them. As far as reproductive rights, they certainly can demonstrate that they take a much more liberal position. We can be smug about our economy and our military, if those are things that we are proud of. > [@](#): > > And yeah, being stuck with the old Confederacy does hold us back, oftentimes. But if we severed that region and operated a country with just the rest of it (even still including hardcore red states like Oklahoma, Kansas, Indiana, etc.), we would be \*way \*more progressive than Canada. Yeah, we jettison our deep conservative areas, and we become more progressive. I am sure that there are some geographic areas of Canada that could be removed to make it more liberal. > [@](#): > > That Harper and the Conservatives were in charge until so recently shows that even without that slave-state legacy, Canada is on the knife’s edge, just like we are–and given Trudeau’s unpopularity, a Conservative comeback in the near future hardly looks impossible to imagine. The benefit of the Parliamentary system over ours is that the minority party isn’t shut out of governing. Even with a majority coalition, they cannot make as sweeping changes as can be made when the Republicans manage a small majority of seats from a minority of votes. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2019, 9:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/838 "2019-06-03T09:59:01Z")
An American trying to warn us about the potential for Canadian conservatism is like a person on fire warning someone about the potential for mildly uncomfortable humidity. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2019, 1:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/839 "2019-06-03T13:52:17Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > An American trying to warn us about the potential for Canadian conservatism is like a person on fire warning someone about the potential for mildly uncomfortable humidity. And a Canadian concerned about American conservatism is like a person watching someone running around on fire, and saying, “Stop, Drop, and Roll, dude!” 😉 ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2019, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/840 "2019-06-03T15:24:23Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > Yeah, we jettison our deep conservative areas, and we become more progressive. I am sure that there are some geographic areas of Canada that could be removed to make it more liberal. Yes, their rural “flyover country”, particularly their Plains states and Mountain West, which are–like our Plains states and Mountain West–very conservative. But we have the same thing, PLUS the Deep South. Our counterbalancing cities and “coastal elite” areas must be much more deeply progressive, and well populated, to give us even a fighting chance, much less sweeps like we got in 2008. ETA: Even during their Liberal periods, Canada is worse than the U.S. when it comes to environmental regulation, freedom of the press, and freedom from religion. And if you talk to Native people there, you won’t find many of them endorsing the notion that it’s a progressive country. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659.md?page=41) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659.md?page=43)