# Georgia governor signs strictest abortion bill in nation **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [May 8, 2019, 9:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659 "2019-05-08T09:49:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2019, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/121 "2019-05-09T17:06:08Z")
Just for clarification-Where in [the bill](http://www.legis.ga.gov/Legislation/20192020/187013.pdf) are rape and/or the age of the pregnant woman brought up? ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2019, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/122 "2019-05-09T17:13:22Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Do stand-your-ground laws (generally, or just in Georgia, as you wish) require a specific threat of death or does a reasonably perceived threat of injury count? Pregnancy can be pretty injurious, I’m given to understand. I gotta figure if you walked up to Johnny Guntoter and said “I’m gonna enter your abdomen and slowly stretch out,” Johnny could plausibly view that as less-than-desirable. Does he have to retreat, though? How much do I have to stretch his abdomen before Johnny gets to decline? Reasonably perceived threat. Here is how I learned it: An anti-abort woman grabbed my right hand. As you may know, I suffered an injury to my left hand a while back, and my right hand is my only good hand. And the state considers me physically handicapped. So I pushed her into a building to get her to let go, whereupon she spit on me. I gave her a few chosen words, and _she called the cops_. The cops came, I crossed the street, they talked to her and then came to talk to me. I told them what happened, and explained about my right hand. She admitted grabbing it, but claimed she tripped and grabbed me to get her balance. The cops refused to file a report, telling her I had a good defense if it went to court. They told me I could file a charge of assault, but I didn’t. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2019, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/123 "2019-05-09T17:35:57Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Per Trump and many of his supporters, just men, quite obviously. \*\*From pussy grabbing \*\*to **jailing women for doing certain things to their bodies** , it’s quite clear how this administration and many of its supporters view women. They’re okay with women not being in control of their bodies. This is what they want. I bolded “pussy grabbing” because there couldn’t be a more appropriate example to show just how little regard Trump supporters have for vulnerable women. I emphasize vulnerable women because I realize there are many women who support Trump, presumably doing so precisely because they don’t share that same sense of vulnerability and believe that none of that awful shit we liberals whine about - things like being sexually assaulted or bleeding to death during a pregnancy - could ever happen to _them_. And they’ll even tell you that 'Well if all those things do happen, well I guess it’s all a part of God’s plan." ---
**Author:** ![Translucent\_Daydream](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/translucent_daydream/32/16170_2.png) [@Translucent\_Daydream](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Translucent_Daydream)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2019, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/124 "2019-05-09T17:36:27Z")
**HD** , you have a penis, right? I ask this because I am lead to believe that you are male based on the writings here. If you have a penis, that generally means that you won’t be pregnant anytime soon, so you won’t be faced with the decision to have an abortion or not. (I’m reaching back to my elementary school education, so if I’m wrong, please correct me.) Since you won’t ever have one as far as I can tell, why do you have such an aversion to what other people do with their bodies? * * * I’m really not that smart, I’ll be honest. But I read the law, and I’m not sure where it says that all Georgia abortions will be carried out in **HD** ’s living room. I just don’t get why you care so much. I guess you could say that you are “pro baby” or whatever, but I am too. I really get uneasy around the idea of abortion, but (its a big but), I am never ever ever going to be pregnant. I feel like I don’t really have a say, and even if I do have a say, its a really small say. I have a penis too. But then again, I never understood why straight people gave such a big damn about gay marriage. I’m a straight dude. I won’t ever be in a gay marriage as far as I can tell. I mean I tried out a straight marriage and I’m really happy with it. I’m straight and that works out pretty well, but if I was a gay dude, I would be pretty pissed if I couldn’t get married because some dickhead who was straight wouldn’t allow it. I can’t help but frame my view on abortion like gay marriage. I don’t think I should have a say in what other people do with their bodies. I can understand the sentiment with wanting fewer abortions to happen, but hey, I won’t ever have one nor will any other penis having dude in the real world. I’m not trying to pick on you **HD** , I just don’t get your motivations or the reasoning you have on this one. I think we would probably get along in the real world just fine. Having a man tell a woman what she can do with her bodies just reminds me of growing up on the farm, and telling female animals what they were going to do with their bodies. CAVEAT: I did give an abortion to a man once, in a video game. I had to give Stan’s dad Randy an abortion to beat a level on South Park’s Stick of Truth. I guess it was a success? ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2019, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/125 "2019-05-09T17:43:43Z")
> [@Annie-Xmas](#): > > Reasonably perceived threat. Here is how I learned it: > > An anti-abort woman grabbed my right hand. As you may know, I suffered an injury to my left hand a while back, and my right hand is my only good hand. And the state considers me physically handicapped. So I pushed her into a building to get her to let go, whereupon she spit on me. I gave her a few chosen words, and _she called the cops_. > > The cops came, I crossed the street, they talked to her and then came to talk to me. I told them what happened, and explained about my right hand. She admitted grabbing it, but claimed she tripped and grabbed me to get her balance. > > The cops refused to file a report, telling her I had a good defense if it went to court. They told me I could file a charge of assault, but I didn’t. LOL! She started it but she ends up calling the cops when she can’t finish. Typical. ---
**Author:** ![raventhief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/raventhief/32/4_2.png) [@raventhief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raventhief)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2019, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/126 "2019-05-09T17:49:15Z")
> [@puddleglum](#): > > Stand your ground laws only apply if the person is being threatened. So in your scenario if the fetus is pointing a gun at the mother or is advancing with a knife then it could be legally aborted. Threatened with a weapon? Do stand your ground laws not apply if the threatening person is unarmed but may harm you nonetheless? ETA I live in a state with a duty to retreat, and I have no idea how that may work in this instance. Something inside my body to threatening to hospitalize me! I must get away from the threat! ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2019, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/127 "2019-05-09T17:51:40Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > LOL! She started it but she ends up calling the cops when she can’t finish. > > Typical. Yes. She assaults me and when I defend my only good hand, she spits on me. And then tells the cop I called her “some bad names.” She got off easy. Legally I could have thrown her under the nearest passing bus and the most I would have gotten is probation. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2019, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/128 "2019-05-09T17:57:19Z")
> [@raventhief](#): > > Threatened with a weapon? News to me, too. I thought one of the arguments for concealed carry was that a 110-pound woman might have a chance to defend herself against a 250-pound man who could certainly injure her even without a weapon. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2019, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/129 "2019-05-09T17:58:30Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > People IRL don’t generally engage in the sort of extreme hyperbole you have here. It’s not the restrictions that’s a laughing matter, it’s your post. Still avoiding with the bullshit. Can’t say as I blame you. If bullshit is all you got, lead with it. My point stands. > [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Some day I hope I find you in a thread on gun control so I can quote your words back to you. You’ll try. Let me save us both some time. Different things are different. Protection of women’s rights contribute to a better society. Protection of gun rights contribute to social decline. If you need cites, you’re willfully not paying attention. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2019, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/130 "2019-05-09T18:05:01Z")
Looking over a list of pregnancy symptoms, I gotta say that somebody who threatened to do that to ME is gonna get the stink-eye and if there’s a gun in reach, my hand’s going for it. Seriously, what kind of sick masochistic freak would put up with this from anyone for _months_ and then form a lifelong fixation on them afterward like some kind of hopped-up Stockholm-syndrome victim? It’s sick, I tell you, sick! By the way, this Sunday is Mother’s Day. Just a reminder. ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2019, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/131 "2019-05-09T18:09:48Z")
To quote the anti-aborts: GOD chose you to be a mother. GOD gave the baby permission to use your body. You are going to answer to GOD if you murder your baby. ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2019, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/132 "2019-05-09T18:13:32Z")
> [@aldiboronti](#): > > … > > This idiotic law, as the article goes on to state, may have unintended consequences. If fetuses have legal personhood then they are entitled to due process. I look forward to thousands of Habeas Corpus suits for the thousands of fetuses illegally imprisoned across the state. The law defies belief. But will the Supreme Court strike it down? I’d like to think so but I’m not so sure it will. I don’t think that is a problem as there are mothers with their babies/small children already in prison living with them. Some prisons even have play parks for that. The things I can think of which would be unintended consequences is that the mother should be able to drive in the HOV lane and get another tax deduction - both positions I support. May be some negative consequences like when only a limited number of people are allowed, well that person is now counted as 2, such as on hiking permits and legal limits to occupancy. Also i do feel like the banning of abortion is also tied into restricting immigration. They need to be done together so we have replacement/entry level workers as society, and those unwanted babies, age. ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2019, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/133 "2019-05-09T18:19:22Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > She went into labor well before her fetus was independently viable. She miscarried. > > I suppose we could break out the dictionary cites at this stage, but what’s the point, really? > > So, how do you feel about “stand your ground” laws? Should they apply to women? Good question. Could the woman claim the baby is trying to kill her and therefore her abortion falls under the stand your ground law? ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2019, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/134 "2019-05-09T18:23:15Z")
> **[Alabama Senate strips rape exception from abortion ban](https://www.al.com/news/2019/05/alabama-senate-strips-rape-exception-from-abortion-ban-vote-on-bill-next-week.html)** > > Senators could give final passage today to a bill to make abortion a felony in Alabama. Alabama’s Senate apparently just stripped the rape exception from its bill. I mean, we wouldn’t want these sick f\*ckers to have any compassion now, would we? ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2019, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/135 "2019-05-09T18:23:38Z")
> [@Translucent\_Daydream](#): > > If you have a penis, that generally means that you won’t be pregnant anytime soon, so you won’t be faced with the decision to have an abortion or not. (I’m reaching back to my elementary school education, so if I’m wrong, please correct me.) Since you won’t ever have one as far as I can tell, why do you have such an aversion to what other people do with their bodies? I am not **HurricaneDitka** , but if I may add in my two pennies, the reaction of most pro-lifers to being told that “If someone else has an abortion, it’s none of your business. Just don’t abort yours.” is akin to a child-welfare advocate being told, “If someone else abuses their kids, it’s none of your business. Just don’t abuse yours.” It immediately elicits a reaction of no, I am not going to just stand on the sidelines while this sort of thing is happening. Whether abortion \*\*is \*\*murder or not is a separate philosophical question. But if that’s what the premise is, (in the pro-lifer’s mind,) then the logic is technically sound - you can’t say that one should not intervene just because oneself is not affected. Pro-lifers see that as Holocaust logic; that just because the Holocaust wasn’t happening in Allied nations didn’t mean Allies shouldn’t intervene. Another argument that pro-choicers fail to understand why pro-lifers don’t buy is the “If we make abortion illegal, then many women will die in illegal unsafe abortions” argument. That doesn’t win over (most) pro-lifers because the math does not add up. If 1 million legal abortions are prevented, but 7,000 women die yearly in illegal back-alley abortions, then from pro-life math logic, that equates a net gain of 993,000 lives saved (assuming that the fetus is a life just like the mother is a life.) One can say that that logic is abhorrent, but from a mathematical standpoint, it’s sound. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2019, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/136 "2019-05-09T18:31:42Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > [Chaos erupts as Alabama Senate strips rape exception from abortion ban, delays vote - al.com](https://www.al.com/news/2019/05/alabama-senate-strips-rape-exception-from-abortion-ban-vote-on-bill-next-week.html) > > Alabama’s Senate apparently just stripped the rape exception from its bill. > > I mean, we wouldn’t want these sick f\*ckers to have any compassion now, would we? If you still support the Alabama bill now that there are no rape or incest exceptions, please speak up and let us know. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2019, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/137 "2019-05-09T18:33:56Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > I am not **HurricaneDitka** , but if I may add in my two pennies, the reaction of most pro-lifers to being told that “If someone else has an abortion, it’s none of your business. Just don’t abort yours.” is akin to a child-welfare advocate being told, “If someone else abuses their kids, it’s none of your business. Just don’t abuse yours.” It immediately elicits a reaction of no, I am not going to just stand on the sidelines while this sort of thing is happening. > > Whether abortion \*\*is \*\*murder or not is a separate philosophical question. But if that’s what the premise is, (in the pro-lifer’s mind,) then the logic is technically sound - you can’t say that one should not intervene just because oneself is not affected. Pro-lifers see that as Holocaust logic; that just because the Holocaust wasn’t happening in Allied nations didn’t mean Allies shouldn’t intervene. > > Another argument that pro-choicers fail to understand why pro-lifers don’t buy is the “If we make abortion illegal, then many women will die in illegal unsafe abortions” argument. That doesn’t win over (most) pro-lifers because the math does not add up. If 1 million legal abortions are prevented, but 7,000 women die yearly in illegal back-alley abortions, then from pro-life math logic, that equates a net gain of 993,000 lives saved (assuming that the fetus is a life just like the mother is a life.) One can say that that logic is abhorrent, but from a mathematical standpoint, it’s sound. There is no talking with the religious zealots - I don’t care whether I persuade them or not. I’m more interested in getting everyone else to understand what life will be like the longer these people stay in power. If you want to live in a free society, then you should be afraid of people who want to control women’s bodies. Chances are, that’s not all they want to control. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2019, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/138 "2019-05-09T18:35:02Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > If you still support the Alabama bill now that there are no rape or incest exceptions, please speak up and let us know. I don’t know why you think I would. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2019, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/139 "2019-05-09T18:38:13Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > I don’t know why you think I would. Not addressed to you personally. ---
**Author:** ![nelliebly](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nelliebly/32/5422_2.png) [@nelliebly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nelliebly)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2019, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659/140 "2019-05-09T18:52:34Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Just for clarification-Where in [the bill](http://www.legis.ga.gov/Legislation/20192020/187013.pdf) are rape and/or the age of the pregnant woman brought up? It’s in Section 4, part 5 (b). Leaving out the language the new law strikes from the old one: > [@](#): > > No abortion is authorized or shall be performed if the probable gestational age of the an unborn child has been determined in accordance with Code Section 31-9B-2 to have a detectable human heartbeat except when: > … > 5 (b)(2) The probable gestational age of the unborn child is 20 weeks or less and the pregnancy is the result of rape or incest in which an official police report has been filed alleging the offense of rape or incest. There is nothing regarding the age of the pregnant female. (Sorry, can’t call an 11-year-old kid a “woman” in this case.) Also note this applies only to females who\*\* report the assault\*\* to the cops. So a woman is raped by a popular college football player and too scared of possible repercussions to report it to the cops? Yeah, she’s SOL. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/georgia-governor-signs-strictest-abortion-bill-in-nation/833659.md?page=8)