# German "Letters of Transit" (Casablanca) **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [November 21, 2012, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-letters-of-transit-casablanca/641755 "2012-11-21T19:22:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2012, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-letters-of-transit-casablanca/641755/21 "2012-11-23T15:42:37Z")
> [@elbows](#): > > Or abandoning Sam in Casablanca, (after all they’ve been through together), without so much as by your leave! No, Rick arranged for Sam to stay on when Ferrari bought the Cafe Americain. Not that there was any doubt Sam would agree to say, knowing his place and all that. ---
**Author:** ![matt\_mcl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ab992/32.png) [@matt\_mcl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/matt_mcl)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2012, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-letters-of-transit-casablanca/641755/22 "2012-11-23T15:56:24Z")
> [@Sigmagirl](#): > > But she really wasn’t interested. Even though for special friends of Rick’s there was a special discount. ---
**Author:** ![Freddy\_the\_Pig](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a587f6/32.png) [@Freddy\_the\_Pig](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freddy_the_Pig)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2012, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-letters-of-transit-casablanca/641755/23 "2012-11-24T03:17:30Z")
> [@matt\_mcl](#): > > Which reminds me: When Laszlo says, “Any violation of neutrality would reflect on Captain Renault,” what exactly does he mean? In what way would it “reflect” on Renault, what would the consequences be, and how does this protect him? The government in Vichy was nominally neutral in World War II, and while dependant on German forbearance, wished to present itself to the French people and to the world as something more than Nazi puppets. For Renault to allow a visiting German army officer, who has no legal authority in French Morocco, to arbitrarily arrest or even shoot a legal refugee (Laszlo) would look like shit. The government might even fire Renault as an easy way to “stand up to the Nazis” without doing anything substantive. ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2012, 4:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-letters-of-transit-casablanca/641755/24 "2012-11-24T04:33:57Z")
> [@Cicero](#): > > I guess I should mention that is not entirely correct. Vichy France was not a Dictatorship (in name anyway) . Given that Petain had full powers, without any kind of check or elected representation, it was definitely a dictatorship. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2012, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-letters-of-transit-casablanca/641755/25 "2012-11-24T16:31:32Z")
> [@denquixote](#): > > I don’t know if we are supposed to think that, since Laszlo did have the letters and was on the plane, but Major Strasser certainly intended to stop the plane anyway, until Rick stopped him. Just another inconsistency. The possessor of the papers cannot be challenged … and yet … It is only an inconsistency if you assume that Strasser was actually a major in the Geheime Staatspolizei (Gestapo). There is, of course, an alternate explanation that resolves all of the apparent inconsistencies and errors in the film. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2012, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-letters-of-transit-casablanca/641755/26 "2012-11-24T17:15:08Z")
> [@Cicero](#): > > Vichy France was not a Dictatorship (in name anyway)… What modern dictatorship has ever called itself a dictatorship? ---
**Author:** ![AuntiePam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f19dbf/32.png) [@AuntiePam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AuntiePam)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2012, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-letters-of-transit-casablanca/641755/27 "2012-11-24T18:44:32Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > Mrs Piper’s grandparents had something similar to a “letter of transit”. The emigrated from Hungary to Canada in the 1920s, and to do so had to go through Austria to get to Germany. They were given a special transit visa to go through Austria on the train, heavily marked with “Nicht Aufstehen!” (sorry, I’m doing it by memory, so I’ve probably got it spelt wrong), which meant that they could not stay in Austria; the visa was solely to permit transit through Austria. > > Not a separate document, though; it was stamped in their Hungarian passports. Sounds like what happened with one of the Jewish families in Matthew Brzezinski’s book, _Isaac’s Army_. The Osnos family managed to get transit visas to assist in their flight from Germany to India. These papers were often good for just 24 hours; sometimes they were legally obtained, sometimes purchased on the black market, sometimes forged; sometimes a stamp in a passport, sometimes a separate document. Weird, that there was so much red tape in a time of chaos. Bureaucrats will be the last survivors of the apocalypse. ---
**Author:** ![Cicero](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cicero/32/3594_2.png) [@Cicero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cicero)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2012, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-letters-of-transit-casablanca/641755/28 "2012-11-24T18:48:44Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > What modern dictatorship has ever called itself a dictatorship? Who said anything about what they called themselves? You can do better than that. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2012, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-letters-of-transit-casablanca/641755/29 "2012-11-24T19:11:55Z")
> [@Cicero](#): > > Who said anything about what they called themselves? You can do better than that. The what exactly did you mean by saying Vichy France “was not a Dictatorship (in name anyway)”? Most modern dictatorships continue to maintain at least the forms and institutions of democracy, even if all power is concentrated in one or a few people. Virtually no dictatorships are dictatorships “in name.” ---
**Author:** ![Cicero](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cicero/32/3594_2.png) [@Cicero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cicero)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2012, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-letters-of-transit-casablanca/641755/30 "2012-11-24T19:23:52Z")
For the purpose of the thread, I clarified that the Government of the time was the Vichy Govt which was not a Dictatorship in name, but anything that Germany would want, would have happened. That is pretty clear from post #31. Today, Hitler is known as a Dictator. As is Stalin. Petain or Lavelle are not. I trust this assists you. If you want to start a separate thread about colloborationist govts versus dictatorships I would be happy to participate. ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2012, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-letters-of-transit-casablanca/641755/31 "2012-11-24T22:40:31Z")
> [@Cicero](#): > > Today, Hitler is known as a Dictator. As is Stalin. Petain or Laval are not. > > . How would you define Petain then? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-letters-of-transit-casablanca/641755.md?page=1)