# German Speakers: I'm looking for a harsh descriptive word for someone who is an outcast or reject **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 6, 2024, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907 "2024-04-06T00:56:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Caribbean\_cruiser](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/caribbean_cruiser/32/9349_2.png) [@Caribbean\_cruiser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Caribbean_cruiser)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/1 "2024-04-06T00:56:58Z")
The protagonist in my novel is an outcast in his German town: despised, unwelcome, rejected by his neighbors. I need a pejorative German term for him. Not like “loser,” but something that captures his being ostracized by his people. FWIW, he moved to that community as a child. Prior to that, he was abandoned by his father. Yes, a hard life. I do not speak German. Is “die Ausgestoßenen” a reasonable choice? Thank you. ---
**Author:** ![Pitchmeister](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pitchmeister/32/3459_2.png) [@Pitchmeister](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pitchmeister)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 7:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/2 "2024-04-06T07:55:18Z")
For one, „die Ausgestoßenen“ is plural, and also not something you’d use as a pejorative. I’m wracking my brain trying to come up with a word that you would actually say to a person and that also conveys what you are trying to. Where exactly is this village? Words like that can be highly regional. ---
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 12:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/3 "2024-04-06T12:11:33Z")
I also have difficulties coming up with a word that conveys what the OP is after. There’s “Außenseiter” (outsider), but that word is rather neutral and not very harsh. But in a situation where a stranger lives in an intolerant community, he might be called “komischer Kauz” or “schräger Vogel” by the local people. Also both not very harsh, but expressing the otherness of the outsider. ---
**Author:** ![Maserschmidt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/maserschmidt/32/18829_2.png) [@Maserschmidt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maserschmidt)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/4 "2024-04-06T12:50:04Z")
Does _Paria_ not work? ---
**Author:** ![Pardel-Lux](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pardel-lux/32/20182_2.png) [@Pardel-Lux](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pardel-Lux)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 1:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/5 "2024-04-06T13:03:41Z")
I struggle to find a single word for that, but I have heard _der Zugereiste_ (or _doah Zug’reista_ in Bavaria) pronounced with a lot of spite. _Der Zugezogene_ would qualify too. _Der Fremde_ may sound too much like Camus. Combinations of noun + adjective could be: _Das fremde Ekel_ If he is not blond and blue eyed enough (what they call Bio-Deutsch nowadays, sigh…) he might be called quite directly _der Kanake_, _der dreckige Zigeuner_ (dirty gipsy) or _Kümmeltürke_ (cumin-eating turk. No, I don’t know what the problem with cumin is, but it is an insult). It’s a pity I don’t have children to ask, in my recollection children are great for coming up with the names that really hurt, but I will keep thinking. Perhaps this develops into a brain storming exercise. As for _Paria_, I think it sounds too highbrow for a rural insult: If you want to point out how backwards and intolerant they are, and that was my mental image of the situation, then using the word _Paria_ is perhaps not ideal. But it would be very apt in a setting like a private school, an _Internat_. ---
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/6 "2024-04-06T13:26:09Z")
> [@Pardel-Lux](#): > > _Kümmeltürke_ (cumin-eating turk. No, I don’t know what the problem with cumin is, but it is an insult) I’ve always wondered about that insult, because I’ve never eaten Turkish food that contained cumin. The Austrians however put cumin into nearly everything, at least you virtually cannot get any bread in Austria without it, so shouldn’t it be “Kümmelösi”? ---
**Author:** ![Pardel-Lux](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pardel-lux/32/20182_2.png) [@Pardel-Lux](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pardel-Lux)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/7 "2024-04-06T13:31:05Z")
Perhaps it comes from _Kameltreiber_ (camel driver, also an insult in its own right, so to speak, used against arabic looking people) or something similar, via some _Lautverschiebungen_ (phonetic shifts)? Kamel → Kümmel? Just improvising here. ---
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/8 "2024-04-06T13:34:56Z")
I don’t think so, but rather can imagine that the insult is as old as the rivalry and wars between the Holy Roman Empire and the Osman Empire. In those days, the people were even dumber than today when making up insults and probably simply thought "Cumin comes from the East. Turks come from the East. Ergo, “Kümmeltürke”. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/9 "2024-04-06T14:26:56Z")
> [@EinsteinsHund](#): > > I’ve never eaten Turkish food that contained cumin. I sure have. It’s common in Eastern cooking. In terms of ethnic slurs. is “Churka” ever used in German? It’s the Russian equivalent of “Wog.” ---
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/10 "2024-04-06T14:29:16Z")
No, I’ve never heard the word “Churka”, but I’m a Wessie. Maybe it’s better known in East Germany where most people learned Russian instead of English in school. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/11 "2024-04-06T14:35:22Z")
IIRC, the literal meaning of “Churka” is “stump.” In English, you might say someone is “dumb as a stump,” but the sense of it in Russian is far harsher. I could see it being used as a loan word, like “droogs” and “groodies” in Burgess’s Nadsat. ---
**Author:** ![Caribbean\_cruiser](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/caribbean_cruiser/32/9349_2.png) [@Caribbean\_cruiser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Caribbean_cruiser)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/12 "2024-04-06T14:39:03Z")
Be back soon… ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/13 "2024-04-06T14:41:13Z")
You may be confusing caraway seed with cumin. Austrians use caraway a lot; I’ve not noticed them using cumin. Cumin is more a Middle Eastern to South Asian spice (as well as Mexican on this side of the pond.) ---
**Author:** ![Pardel-Lux](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pardel-lux/32/20182_2.png) [@Pardel-Lux](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pardel-Lux)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/14 "2024-04-06T14:41:33Z")
I have never met an Amish person in Germany, but there are some Methodists that, I have heard, can be similar in some respects. I’ll keep thinking. I know a blog I should read again about such a person. ---
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/15 "2024-04-06T14:43:07Z")
In this case I’m out, because as far as I know the Amish in the US speak an obsolete German dialect that differs much from modern High German, and they’ll probably have their own dialect word for a shunned person. I don’t know if there are Amish communities in Germany (I’ve never heard about any and doubt it), and if there are, what dialect those communities speak. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/16 "2024-04-06T14:44:32Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > You may be confusing caraway seed with cumin. This occurred to me as well. I think caraway is called _kummel_ in Russian too. (Cumin is both _kumin_ and _zira_.) ---
**Author:** ![Caribbean\_cruiser](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/caribbean_cruiser/32/9349_2.png) [@Caribbean\_cruiser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Caribbean_cruiser)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/17 "2024-04-06T14:48:28Z")
I just found an online source that may help with this, as the scenario involves an Amish family in Ohio. ---
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/18 "2024-04-06T14:48:45Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > You may be confusing caraway seed with cumin. Austrians use caraway a lot; I’ve not noticed them using cumin. Cumin is more a Middle Eastern to South Asian spice (as well as Mexican on this side of the pond.) Yes, that seems to be the case, the spice I often encounter in Austrian cuisine is caraway, which according to wiki is called “Echter Kümmel” in German. Cumin in German is called “Kreuzkümmel”, which I have heard of, but I don’t know if I have ever tasted it. > **[Caraway](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caraway)** > > Caraway, also known as meridian fennel and Persian cumin (Carum carvi), is a biennial plant in the family Apiaceae, native to western Asia, Europe, and North Africa. > The etymology of "caraway" is unclear. Caraway has been called by many names in different regions, with names deriving from the Latin cuminum (cumin), the Greek karon (again, cumin), which was adapted into Latin as carum (now meaning caraway), and the Sanskrit karavi, sometimes translated as "caraway", but other times understood ... ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/19 "2024-04-06T14:52:27Z")
A quick look at an Amish dictionary yields _schlingle_, a “rogue.” It doesn’t seem to be capitalized like nouns in Modern German. Maybe it would be worthwhile to check a Yiddish dictionary too? ---
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/20 "2024-04-06T14:56:35Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > A quick look at an Amish dictionary yields _schlingle_, a “rogue.” It doesn’t seem to be capitalized like nouns in Modern German. A “Schlingel” in High German is a trickster, a naughty boy so to say. I don’t know, but it sounds like a Yiddish leanword, which we have many of in German. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907.md?page=2)