# German Speakers: I'm looking for a harsh descriptive word for someone who is an outcast or reject **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 6, 2024, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907 "2024-04-06T00:56:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Pardel-Lux](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pardel-lux/32/20182_2.png) [@Pardel-Lux](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pardel-Lux)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/21 "2024-04-06T14:58:36Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > You may be confusing caraway seed with cumin. Oh, yes, that is a horrible mess: English cumin is German " **Kreuzkümmel** (_Cuminum cyminum_), also **Kumin** or **Cumin** (Latin _Cuminum_, auch _Cyminum_) and **Römischer Kümmel**" and Spanish **comino** , while English caraway seed is in German **Echter Kümmel** (_Carum carvi_), usually just simply **Kümmel** , regionally sometimes **Wiesen-Kümmel** or **Gemeiner Kümmel** , but in Spanish it is called **alcaravea** _, alcarabia, alcarahueya, carvia, caravai, alcaravia, comino de prado_ or _alcaraveta_. It is a mess, and yes, I had to look it up and use copy&paste. I am tempted to write _Kreuzkruzifix_! ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/22 "2024-04-06T15:16:58Z")
May I suggest _shnook_, _shlemiel_, and _shlep_? ---
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/23 "2024-04-06T15:26:04Z")
I’m not versed enough in Yiddish to be really able to answer, but the exact equivalent for “Schlingel” in French would be “filou”, which also is used as a loanword in German, and I guess also in English. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/24 "2024-04-06T15:40:15Z")
Check out the strip at the top… 😉 > **[MAD Issue #117 - Read MAD Issue #117 comic online in high...](https://readcomiconline.li/Comic/MAD/Issue-117?id=72808#37)** > > Read MAD Issue #117 comic online free and high quality. Unique reading type: All pages - just need to scroll to read next page. Clothes don’t always “make the man.” 🤭 ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/25 "2024-04-06T15:51:05Z")
> [@EinsteinsHund](#): > > Yes, that seems to be the case, the spice I often encounter in Austrian cuisine is caraway, which according to wiki is called “Echter Kümmel” in German. Cumin in German is called “Kreuzkümmel”, which I have heard of, but I don’t know if I have ever tasted it. If you’ve had any kind of curry or Middle Eastern food like shawarma/döner, you’ve likely tasted cumin, although in combination with a lot of other stuff. The confusion happens in other languages, too. In Polish, “caraway” is _kminek_, but it would also sometimes be translated as “cumin” in English. The proper Polish term is _kmin rzymski_, which could be translated as “Roman cumin.” (Though I see current sources say the word _kumin_ is becoming popular in Polish spice shops.) Same thing happens in Hungarian. _Kömény_ means “caraway seed,” though clearly looks like a cognate of “cumin.” “Cumin” is _Római kömény_, like the Polish “Roman cumin.” And then there is fennel seed, which is _édes kömény_, or “sweet cumin.” (And in Polish is _koper włoski_, or “Italian dill.”) ---
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/26 "2024-04-06T16:15:49Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > If you’ve had any kind of curry or Middle Eastern food like shawarma/döner, you’ve likely tasted cumin, although in combination with a lot of other stuff. I’ve had döner in the past, but I’ve been a vegetarian for almost 30 years and I can’t remember the taste. But I’m quite sure that cumin (Kreuzkümmel) is used in Glühwein (mulled wine), so I might have tasted it. And why the confusion? Does cumin taste very similar to caraway? ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/27 "2024-04-06T16:20:34Z")
In Glühwein? Interesting. I typically remember cloves, cinnamon, maybe fennel or star anise in there, but cumin seems an odd choice. I would not say cumin and caraway are interchangeable. They look similar, though distinguishable if you’ve cooked with both. Caraway is a bit darker and slightly fatter than cumin, and used a lot to flavor rye bread. (In the States, I’ve found a lot of people associate the flavor of rye bread with caraway.) Caraway tastes a bit nuttier and more bitter to me than cumin? Cumin is a little earthier/mustier? I don’t know if that’s even a good description, as taste is so subjective. As a vegetarian, you’ve never had Indian food? Seems to be popular especially among vegetarians. The most used spices with curries are cumin, coriander seed, and probably turmeric. ---
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/28 "2024-04-06T16:21:45Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > In Glühwein? Interesting. I typically remember cloves, cinnamon, maybe fennel or star anise in there, but cumin seems an odd choice. Ah, I think you’re right, I confused cumin with star anise. That’s what’s always in Glühwein. ---
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2024, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/29 "2024-04-06T16:25:44Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > As a vegetarian, you’ve never had Indian food? Seems to be popular especially among vegetarians. The most used spices with curries are cumin, coriander seed, and probably turmeric. I live in the boondocks, and though there are two food places with Indian owners in my vicinity, they mostly offer generic fast food, pizza, pasta, döner and such, and not very much originally Indian, especially not vegetarian. Which was very disappointing for me when I first checked out their menus. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2024, 11:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/30 "2024-04-09T11:40:10Z")
> [@EinsteinsHund](#): > > Does cumin taste very similar to caraway? No. Cumin tastes earthy and warm. Caraway, on the other hand, is more in that family of spices & herbs that has a licorice-like taste (star anise, aniseed, fennel, tarragon, cicely, chervil, licorice itself). ---
**Author:** ![Quimby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/22d042/32.png) [@Quimby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quimby)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2024, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/31 "2024-04-09T13:18:44Z")
I asked my wife who was raised in Germany and she said your word describes someone who is rejected, unwelcome or an outcast so it could work but the singular is “der Ausgestoßene”. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2024, 1:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/32 "2024-04-09T13:20:27Z")
Interesting. I detect anise in everything you list, but I don’t taste any of it in caraway. ---
**Author:** ![Al128](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/al128/32/16541_2.png) [@Al128](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Al128)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2024, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/33 "2024-04-09T19:11:54Z")
> [@Quimby](#): > > I asked my wife who was raised in Germany and she said your word describes someone who is rejected, unwelcome or an outcast so it could work but the singular is “der Ausgestoßene”. yep, Ausgestossener or Verstossener would fit the bill. ---
**Author:** ![Pitchmeister](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pitchmeister/32/3459_2.png) [@Pitchmeister](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pitchmeister)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2024, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/34 "2024-04-09T19:52:08Z")
…except that it‘s not a pejorative. If you were to say that about another person (and you more than likely would not, if you’re a bigoted small-town hick), it would be more to say: „Oh, that poor guy!“ as opposed to „Haha, stupid [slur]!“ ---
**Author:** ![Q.Q.Switcheroo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/q.q.switcheroo/32/5713_2.png) [@Q.Q.Switcheroo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Q.Q.Switcheroo)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2024, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/35 "2024-04-09T20:00:37Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > The confusion happens in other languages, too. And even dialects of the same language - see American vs. British English re: coriander/cilantro. ---
**Author:** ![Mops](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mops/32/16494_2.png) [@Mops](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mops)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2024, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/36 "2024-04-09T20:14:45Z")
Another German here, and I also cannot find a word meeting the parameters. All general German terms denoting being an outcast or ‘other’ (the most common being _Außenseiter_ (m)/_Außenseiterin_ (f)) are descriptive not pejorative, i.e. they are terms a third party or the outcast themselves would use to describe the person being an outcast, in the usual case while lamenting that state of affairs, but not terms the townfolk despising the person themselves would use sneeringly to refer to the person. There is a wealth of specific pejorative terms, of course, but all of them refer to a specific reason the person is an outcast, i.e. they allege being a recent arrival (in small villages), bad manners or behaviour of some kind, being on welfare, being too sociable, not being sociable enough, wrong denomination (in very small and backward villages), suspicion of some kind, associating with other outcasts (kind of outcast needs to be specified here too), questionable antecedents etc. - is there a specific reason your protagonist is disliked? ---
**Author:** ![Caribbean\_cruiser](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/caribbean_cruiser/32/9349_2.png) [@Caribbean\_cruiser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Caribbean_cruiser)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2024, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/37 "2024-04-09T20:39:06Z")
> [@Mops](#): > > There is a wealth of specific pejorative terms, of course, but all of them refer to a specific reason the person is an outcast, i.e. they allege being a recent arrival (in small villages), bad manners or behaviour of some kind, being on welfare, being too sociable, not being sociable enough, wrong denomination (in very small and backward villages), suspicion of some kind, associating with other outcasts (kind of outcast needs to be specified here too), questionable antecedents etc. - is there a specific reason your protagonist is disliked? Without getting too detailed, the young protagonist arrived as an outsider, an outcast. ---
**Author:** ![Mops](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mops/32/16494_2.png) [@Mops](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mops)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2024, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/38 "2024-04-09T20:56:54Z")
> [@Caribbean\_cruiser](#): > > … > Without getting too detailed, the young protagonist arrived as an outsider, an outcast. Then the only terms I can think of is _Außenseiter_ (m)/_Außenseiterin_ (f), but as I said this is descriptive not a slur. _Verachteter_ (m)/_Verachtete_ (f) (despised person) might also serve, but that too is merely descriptive of the state of affairs. The term _Ausgestoßener_ (m)/_Ausgestoßene_ (f) literally means ‘outcast’, but it requires a specific prior act of being cast out by a community of some sort (family, sect, etc.), i.e. you cannot arrive in a community and be an instant _Ausgestoßener_ there. Is there any wholly contentless slur (i.e. a word denoting contempt but not alleging any specific objectionable quality at all) in English? I cannot think of one. If what the townfolk objects to in the protagonist is his/her mere arrival as a newcomer, the term _Zugezogener_ (m)/_Zugezogene_ (f) i.e. person newly living in town applies, but that nowadays only makes one a second-class community member, not an outcast (the days of isolated, deeply clannish villages are long past in Germany. I am sometimes affectionately called a fishhead for arriving in South Germany from North Germany a mere three decades ago, but that’s the extent of it). ---
**Author:** ![Pardel-Lux](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pardel-lux/32/20182_2.png) [@Pardel-Lux](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pardel-Lux)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2024, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/39 "2024-04-09T21:00:16Z")
What do you think of _der Stinker_ (the stinky one)? When Germans cannot stand somebody one way they express that is saying “I cannot stand the way he smells” (_ich kann ihn nicht riechen_). It is short, snappy and pejorative. ---
**Author:** ![Mops](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mops/32/16494_2.png) [@Mops](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mops)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2024, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907/40 "2024-04-09T21:12:24Z")
> [@Pardel-Lux](#): > > What do you think of _der Stinker_ (the stinky one)? When Germans cannot stand somebody one way they express that is saying “I cannot stand the way he smells” (_ich kann ihn nicht riechen_). It is short, snappy and pejorative. But really juvenile - I can imagine child or youth peer group use that, as a contentless insult (in the manner of the mythical cooties), but adults would only use that only when alleging an actual bad smell. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-im-looking-for-a-harsh-descriptive-word-for-someone-who-is-an-outcast-or-reject/999907.md?page=3)