# German speakers: Um berufen? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [March 28, 2004, 1:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-um-berufen/236843 "2004-03-28T01:51:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![commasense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/commasense/32/3017_2.png) [@commasense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/commasense)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2004, 1:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-um-berufen/236843/1 "2004-03-28T01:51:32Z")
I came across this phrase in a Jeeves and Wooster story. It’s obviously an idiom, and my German dictionary and several online translation services have not been very helpful. Here’s the context: Bertie, speaking to his Aunt Dahlia, says, > [@](#): > > “Nothing could have kept me away,” I replied, touched. “I felt you needed me.” > > “Yes.” > > “Quite.” > > “Or, rather,” she said, “not you, of course, but Jeeves. The minute all this happened, I thought of him. The situation obviously cries out for Jeeves. If ever in the whole history of human affairs there was a moment when that lofty brain was required about the home, this is it.” > > I think, if I had been standing up, I would have staggered. In fact, I’m pretty sure I would. But it isn’t so dashed easy to stagger when you’re sitting in an arm-chair. Only my face, therefore, showed how deeply I had been stung by these words. > > Until she spoke them, I had been all sweetness and light–the sympathetic nephew prepared to strain every nerve to do his bit. I now froze, and the face became hard and set. > > “Jeeves!” I said, between clenched teeth. > > “Oom beroofen,” said Aunt Dahlia. > > I saw that she had got the wrong angle. > > “I was not sneezing. I was saying ‘Jeeves!’” > > “And well you may. What a man! I’m going to put the whole thing up to him. There’s nobody like Jeeves.” The gag is that Bertie thinks the unfamiliar phrase means something like “gesunheit.” It obviously does _not_ mean “over appoint,” which is what some online resources gave me. From the context, it would appear to mean something like “He’s the one.” Could someone familiar with German help out? Thanks. Ironic discovery: Google and Yahoo turned up the [Gutenberg Project](http://www.gutenberg.net/1/0/5/5/10554/10554-8.txt) edition of this story. But Ask Jeeves didn’t! ---
**Author:** ![commasense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/commasense/32/3017_2.png) [@commasense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/commasense)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2004, 1:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-um-berufen/236843/2 "2004-03-28T01:53:53Z")
D’oh! I may not be fluent in German, but I _do_ know how to spell “gesundheit.” ---
**Author:** ![kellner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/c2a13f/32.png) [@kellner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kellner)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2004, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-um-berufen/236843/3 "2004-03-28T16:18:52Z")
“unberufen” literally means something like “unbidden”. There is a superstition that it can be used to prevent the effects of mentioning “taboo” or unlucky phrases. ---
**Author:** ![z1221z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/ee7513/32.png) [@z1221z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/z1221z)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2004, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-um-berufen/236843/4 "2004-03-28T17:15:55Z")
> [@kellner](#): > > “unberufen” literally means something like “unbidden”. > > There is a superstition that it can be used to prevent the effects of mentioning “taboo” or unlucky phrases. Interesting. I´m a german native speaker (Austria) and I have never heard “unberufen” used like this before. I did a quick google search, and the phrase seems to be somewhat common, meaning what you said; even Wilhelm Busch used it. Is this a local idiom? My first assosication with “unberufen” is “legalese”, where it is used in a diffenerent meaning. ---
**Author:** ![Mops](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mops/32/16494_2.png) [@Mops](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mops)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2004, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-um-berufen/236843/5 "2004-03-28T17:24:42Z")
The usual instance where you’ll hear the exclamation “unberufen” by Germans will be to avoid **tempting fate**. - “I am quite confident to land that job.” - “_unberufen_” - “I’ll celebrate my birthday on Friday, _unberufen_.” In this it is related to _Gesundheit_ which also has its sources in superstition, but is used in different context. Also _unberufen_ is used much less often nowadays that _Gesundheit_ as it is more overtly superstitious. I don’t quite see how “unberufen” fits in the Wodehouse text (if you don’t interpret the invocation of Jeeves’ name as a prophecy of Good Things to happen). Judging from the context Wodehouse might have confused it with _Gesundheit_. ---
**Author:** ![Mops](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mops/32/16494_2.png) [@Mops](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mops)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2004, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-um-berufen/236843/6 "2004-03-28T17:27:58Z")
> [@z1221z](#): > > Interesting. I’m a german native speaker (Austria) and I have never heard “unberufen” used like this before. … Might be Northern German usage at that. I distinctly recollect it being used in North Germany but now that I live in South Germany I did not notice it being used. ---
**Author:** ![kellner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/c2a13f/32.png) [@kellner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kellner)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2004, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-um-berufen/236843/7 "2004-03-28T17:34:43Z")
> [@z1221z](#): > > I´m a german native speaker (Austria) and I have never heard “unberufen” used like this before. I have only heard this very rarely myself, I just remembered that it exists. A little more common is the slightly different but somewhat related “beschreien”, as in: “Why should I be afraid? I haven’t had a severe accident in years.” - “Beschrei es nicht! (Don’t… it)” ---
**Author:** ![commasense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/commasense/32/3017_2.png) [@commasense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/commasense)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2004, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-um-berufen/236843/8 "2004-03-28T21:50:09Z")
Yes, _unberufen_ means something like “knock wood” (according to my Cassell’s), but I’m reasonably sure that’s not what Aunt Dahlia meant. As **tschild** says, it doesn’t really work in the context. I think _oom_ means _um_. The transliteration is pretty straightforward, and if _unberufen_ had been meant, I think Wodehouse would have written _oonberoofen_ with an N and as one word. Unless all you German speakers are telling me that there is no idiomatic meaning to _um berufen_… ---
**Author:** ![kellner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/c2a13f/32.png) [@kellner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kellner)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2004, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-um-berufen/236843/9 "2004-03-28T23:51:44Z")
> [@commasense](#): > > Unless all you German speakers are telling me that there is no idiomatic meaning to _um berufen_… None that I am aware of. On its own it is a bit odd because the combination of \+\ would usually be written as one word. _um berufen_ can occur within a sentence e.g. _um berufen zu werden…_ - _in order to be appointed…_ “um berufen” (as a phrase) gives three pages of google hits, mostly infinitives like the one above plus a few mishandled hyphenations. _umberufen_ exists as a verb meaning _reappointed_. The fact that my multi-kilogram “Deutsches Wörterbuch” doesn’t list it suggests that it at least has no common meanings that are not evident from the pieces. _umberufen_ gives eleven google hits, ten of them meaning _reappointed_ and this interesting one that uses it as a synonym for _unberufen_: [http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/lewis/lewten101.htm](http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/lewis/lewten101.htm) This link seems to imply a Jewish connection, but I don’t know anything about that. Tomorrow I’ll be at my university anyway and I could have a look in the Grimm (yes, the fairy tale guys) 33 volume monster dictionary of all things German. ---
**Author:** ![commasense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/commasense/32/3017_2.png) [@commasense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/commasense)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-um-berufen/236843/10 "2004-03-29T01:19:27Z")
“Reappointed” could be it! Although it may not be clear from this single passage, the recurring theme of all the Jeeves stories is that people are constantly seeking Jeeves’ assistance. Aunt Dahlia might be saying, Once again we are calling on (i.e. reappointing) Jeeves. That seems to me to make more sense than _unberufen_. ---
**Author:** ![z1221z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/ee7513/32.png) [@z1221z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/z1221z)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-um-berufen/236843/11 "2004-03-29T16:56:02Z")
> [@commasense](#): > > “Reappointed” could be it! Although it may not be clear from this single passage, the recurring theme of all the Jeeves stories is that people are constantly seeking Jeeves’ assistance. I doubt it. Although you can say “Er wurde 1972 an die Universität Mailand umberufen” (“He was reappointed to the University of Milan in 1972”), it is very uncommon, gives only 11 google hits and sounds clumsy (IMHO). Also, I don´t think it is used as a “standalone phrase”. I reread your quote a few times, and I could not make much sense out of it, but I´m not really an expert for what may be an archaic or cultural idiom. (I´m not familiar with the Jeeves stories, but why does Aunt Dahlia use a german phrase, and why does the author use a transliteration?) If you don´t get an answer here, I would try the usenet group de.etc.sprache.deutsch; you can post in english, and there are many knowledgeable people in that newsgroup. ---
**Author:** ![commasense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/commasense/32/3017_2.png) [@commasense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/commasense)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-um-berufen/236843/12 "2004-03-29T18:10:47Z")
> [@](#): > > …why does Aunt Dahlia use a german phrase, and why does the author use a transliteration? It’s easier to answer the second part of this question than the first. Bertie is the narrator and presumably doesn’t know German, so he just wrote down what he heard. As for why Aunt Dahlia is using a German phrase, that is much less clear, especially since she doesn’t seem to be using the language correctly. Dahlia is Bertie’s favorite aunt because she is less conventional and more cosmopolitan than a typical middle-aged English lady (like Aunt Agatha). I think we can assume that she’s traveled a bit and may have some command of other languages. There would seem to be several possibilities here: 1. Bertie got it wrong. Dahlia said something in German, like _gesundheit_, but not knowing the language, Bertie just wrote some nonsense German-sounding phrase. 2. Dahlia got it wrong. Bertie faithfully transcribed what Dahlia said, but her command of the language was faulty. 3. Wodehouse got it wrong. He meant _unberufen_ or _gesundheit_, or something else, but was misinformed about the term or its meaning. 4. You’ve gotten it wrong. There is some (possibly archaic) meaning for the term (either _um berufen_, _umberufen_, or _unberufen_) that you kind folks haven’t dug up yet. FYI, the story is set in the 1920s, so the term wouldn’t be all that archaic. The first three possibilities didn’t seem very likely to me, which is why I posted the OP. I haven’t read all of Wodehouse, but he doesn’t seem to be so sloppy as to include an incorrect foreign phrase. I expect his characters generally to use language correctly, even if it’s whimsical slang like “tinkety-tonk” (meaning bye-bye). But now that option 4 is seeming less likely, I’m puzzled. Perhaps the solution is: 1. I’ve gotten it wrong. Dahlia uttered a nonsense phrase that happens to sound like German, but isn’t, and I’ve led you all on a wild goose chase. But this is unsatisfying for the same reasons that 1-3 are. Why would Dahlia say some nonsense phrase in that situation? It doesn’t make sense. And if the answer is anything except 4, then there would seem to be no way of ever finding out what was intended by the mystery phrase, short of a seance with the spirit of Pelham Grenville. _Unberufen_ in the sense of “knock wood” may be looking better. ---
**Author:** ![z1221z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/ee7513/32.png) [@z1221z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/z1221z)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2004, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-um-berufen/236843/13 "2004-03-29T20:15:24Z")
> [@commasense](#): > > \ > > _Unberufen_ in the sense of “knock wood” may be looking better. Yes, it does. Especially if Bertie (the narrator) doesn´t know German and wrote down what he heard, it might well be “unberufen”. But although it may be “unberufen”, it´s still somewhat cryptic, and it is not really obvious what Aunt Dahlia was trying to say. ---
**Author:** ![camilleri](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7ba0ec/32.png) [@camilleri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/camilleri)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2010, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-um-berufen/236843/14 "2010-06-14T20:54:50Z")
What Bertie’s Aunt Dahlia actually said was “Unberufen” which meant, “Touch wood” or “Knock on wood.” That does make sense in context. She has just said that, to remedy her daughter’s breakup with Tuppy, she will call on Jeeves for advice. Bertie says “Jeeves” and she expresses her hope that his idea will succeed: “Knock on wood.” ---
**Author:** ![Damfino](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Damfino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damfino)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2010, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-um-berufen/236843/15 "2010-06-14T21:14:36Z")
I’ve also come across this phrase only in the indicated Wodehouse book. The spelling “Oom” may have been used with reference to the phrase “Oom Paul” meaning “Uncle Paul” referring to [, Paul Kruger](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Kruger), President of the Transvaal during the Boer War, which was comparatively recent to the time of the story. Could it be a Dutch phrase? ---
**Author:** ![capybara](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/capybara/32/202_2.png) [@capybara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/capybara)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2010, 5:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-um-berufen/236843/16 "2010-06-15T05:32:15Z")
I was thinking it might be related to Dutch-- 'beroven" is to deprive. Om beroven would be, like, "in order to deprive. . . " or om can also serve as a variety of other prepositions in a phrase. No idea how that works here but, hell, could be Indonesian or Afrikaaans usage or something obscure like that that was in vogue once for 20 minutes. Oom, BTW, is just any old uncle. Added: poking around, the old school spelling was with 2 o’s. I think pitch this to Dutch/Flemish dopers for a try. ---
**Author:** ![WotNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e19b73/32.png) [@WotNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WotNot)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2010, 8:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-um-berufen/236843/17 "2010-06-15T08:05:21Z")
A simple Google search reveals that it’s a Yiddish term (presumably these documents weren’t available in… 2004!?) From [here (PDF):](http://www.thekramers.org/kolkramers/archive/vol01issue20.pdf) > [@](#): > > Mommy didn’t really know what Umberufen meant either, or whether it was Yiddish or Hungarian. Grandma explained that it was Yiddish, and that you say it when saying something good, like _Kein Ayin Harah_. And from [here (PDF again):](http://www.youngisrael.org/content/PDFs/Halacha_Central/Halochoscope/hs13-35a.pdf) > [@](#): > > In some circumstances, disclosure of blessings is unavoidable. Similarly, one might wish to highlight a praiseworthy attribute in someone else. There is an old minhag to add a phrase, ‘bli ayin hara, (or umberufen!) with no intent for the evil eye’, when saying something of this nature. And [here’s another:](http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/lewis/lewten101.htm) > [@](#): > > Even today orthodox Hebrews use a form of propitiation before counting, such as “May it please God,” or “God willing.” In addition to this and similar expressions, they use another form of propitiation, the words umbeschrien and umberufen when telling the age of a person, counting the number of children in a family, or the days before a wedding. [\*46] This is supposed to counteract whatever evil might result from mentioning the time, number or things that are precious to their owners. Hebrews also avoid counting money unless the protective words are used. So that would seem to answer that, and satisfy the the requirements for waking a zombie. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Superfluous\_Parentheses](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/8edcca/32.png) [@Superfluous\_Parentheses](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superfluous_Parentheses)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2010, 10:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-um-berufen/236843/18 "2010-06-15T10:25:02Z")
> [@capybara](#): > > I was thinking it might be related to Dutch-- 'beroven" is to deprive. Om beroven would be, like, "in order to deprive. . . " or om can also serve as a variety of other prepositions in a phrase. No idea how that works here but, hell, could be Indonesian or Afrikaaans usage or something obscure like that that was in vogue once for 20 minutes. Oom, BTW, is just any old uncle. > Added: poking around, the old school spelling was with 2 o’s. I think pitch this to Dutch/Flemish dopers for a try. “Om beroven” is really ungrammatical in Dutch (and I assume, Flemish). “in order to rob/deprive” would be something like “om te beroven” which doesn’t make any sense as a stand alone utterance, and in context, neither does “oom beroven” which just means “(to) rob uncle”. Afrikaans is different enough from Dutch/Flemish that it _might_ have some idiomatic meaning, but I doubt it. ETA: WotNot’s explanation seems the most logical contextually. ---
**Author:** ![Sigmagirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c89c15/32.png) [@Sigmagirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sigmagirl)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2010, 12:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-um-berufen/236843/19 "2010-06-15T12:34:41Z")
Damn. I was hoping for the seance. ---
**Author:** ![commasense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/commasense/32/3017_2.png) [@commasense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/commasense)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2010, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-um-berufen/236843/20 "2010-06-21T19:08:22Z")
> [@WotNot](#): > > A simple Google search reveals that it’s a Yiddish term (presumably these documents weren’t available in… 2004!?) > > [snip] > > So that would seem to answer that… I don’t think so, because much of Yiddish is borrowed from German, and although Aunt Dahlia may very likely have had some exposure to German in school or in traveling, it’s highly unlikely (IMHO) that this upper-middle-class matron would ever have had occasion to pick up any Yiddish. (A quick Google search indicates a single – favorable – reference to Jews in Wodehouse’s work, but no Jewish characters.) So although I’m willing to accept “touch wood” as the meaning – finally – I think it had to have been from the German, not Yiddish. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/german-speakers-um-berufen/236843.md?page=2)