# Gertrude Stein: "Nazi is a Nazi is a Nazi." **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [May 1, 2012, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gertrude-stein-nazi-is-a-nazi-is-a-nazi/620549 "2012-05-01T19:37:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Eve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Eve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eve)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2012, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gertrude-stein-nazi-is-a-nazi-is-a-nazi/620549/1 "2012-05-01T19:37:15Z")
Jeez, I knew that bitch Coco Chanel was a Nazi whore, but Gertie was a surprise to me: > [@](#): > > The Met exhibit, which runs until June 3, details the history of the collection. But there’s one problem: It makes no clear mention of the reason this American-Jewish writer/collector, who remained in France during World War II, evaded Vichy violence, Nazi plunder and anti-Semitic laws: Gertrude Stein was what the French call une collabo — that is, a collaborator . . . Like several other American modernists, Stein was a vocally harsh critic of FDR and the New Deal. But she also flirted with fascism, becoming a great fan of Spain’s fascist Francisco Franco and of France’s Marshal Philippe Petain, the World War I hero who became the Vichy puppet leader of Occupied France and, ultimately, an ally of Adolf Hitler. Stein even became a Vichy propagandist, translating Petain’s speeches into English, then submitting them for publication in New York, to which the publisher Bennett Cerf reportedly responded, “Over my dead body!” > > Stein chose to collaborate to support her political beliefs — but also to safeguard herself, her life partner, Alice B. Toklas, and their property in wartime France. Although Stein’s own works were barred from distribution under Vichy/Nazi censorship, she and Toklas were otherwise protected. They were never put on any police lists of Jews in France and ignored American diplomatic warnings to flee to Switzerland . . . Worst of all, she lobbied for the nomination of Hitler for the 1938 Nobel Peace Prize. By that time, the Nuremberg Laws that so harassed Jews were some three years old; there is no way she didn’t know what kind of man she was offering up for world acclaim. OK, she was not exactly marching around in knee-high boots turning Jews over to the SS, but I found this kinda surprising. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2012, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gertrude-stein-nazi-is-a-nazi-is-a-nazi/620549/2 "2012-05-01T19:50:18Z")
Very surprising. I’m certain it was an oversight on your part, but [here’s the source for the quoted material.](http://www.nydailynews.com/opinion/a-nazi-collaborator-met-article-1.1068943) ---
**Author:** ![Eve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Eve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eve)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2012, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gertrude-stein-nazi-is-a-nazi-is-a-nazi/620549/3 "2012-05-01T19:53:59Z")
nm ---
**Author:** ![Craz3d117](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c4cdca/32.png) [@Craz3d117](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Craz3d117)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2012, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gertrude-stein-nazi-is-a-nazi-is-a-nazi/620549/4 "2012-05-01T20:00:26Z")
Surprising indeed, especially considering her affiliation with Hemingway. ---
**Author:** ![Lantern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/d26b3c/32.png) [@Lantern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lantern)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2012, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gertrude-stein-nazi-is-a-nazi-is-a-nazi/620549/5 "2012-05-01T20:43:53Z")
I happened to read an [article]([http://www.neh.gov/humanities/2012/m](http://www.neh.gov/humanities/2012/m) archapril/feature/the-strange-politics-gertrude-stein) on this very topic, which was linked on the Arts and Letters Daily. The writer has also written a book on Stein and Vichy. ---
**Author:** ![NDP](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ndp/32/55_2.png) [@NDP](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NDP)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2012, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gertrude-stein-nazi-is-a-nazi-is-a-nazi/620549/6 "2012-05-01T21:40:14Z")
[QUOTE=FTA] Although Stein’s own works were barred from distribution under Vichy/Nazi censorship, she and Toklas were otherwise protected. They were never put on any police lists of Jews in France and ignored American diplomatic warnings to flee to Switzerland . . . Worst of all, she lobbied for the nomination of Hitler for the 1938 Nobel Peace Prize. By that time, the Nuremberg Laws that so harassed Jews were some three years old; there is no way she didn’t know what kind of man she was offering up for world acclaim. [/QUOTE] Was Stein ever known as a self-hating Jew? That would be another reason that could explain her conduct during WWII. If so, that could also possibly explain why the Nazis and their French collaborators chose to ignore her. She was a public figure who could be used to spread propaganda defending their virulently anti-Semitic policies. I know I’m indulging in some dime-store psychology with that theory but I really don’t otherwise understand how someone could agree with–let alone make even a tacit alliance with–people who not only hate you for being what you are but will also kill you and all other people like yourself without hesitation. ---
**Author:** ![ZenBeam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/3ab097/32.png) [@ZenBeam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZenBeam)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2012, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gertrude-stein-nazi-is-a-nazi-is-a-nazi/620549/7 "2012-05-01T22:20:48Z")
**Lantern** ’s link was broken. [Here’s a fixed version](http://www.neh.gov/humanities/2012/marchapril/feature/the-strange-politics-gertrude-stein). ---
**Author:** ![koeeoaddi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/koeeoaddi/32/408_2.png) [@koeeoaddi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/koeeoaddi)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2012, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gertrude-stein-nazi-is-a-nazi-is-a-nazi/620549/8 "2012-05-01T22:42:33Z")
:eek: I had no idea. ---
**Author:** ![Eve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Eve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eve)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2012, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gertrude-stein-nazi-is-a-nazi-is-a-nazi/620549/9 "2012-05-01T23:26:39Z")
> [@koeeoaddi](#): > > :eek: > > I had no idea. Me neither! I know very little about her, as I find her writing so annoying. But she struck me as a nice person; smart, funny. I may have to read a bio of her, as long as it does not quote her “poetry.” I did recently read a new bio of Chanel that really details her collaboration, and even I was shocked–I knew she lived with a Nazi officer, sold to Nazis, and tried to screw her Jewish partners out of the firm–but it turns out she was actually a paid SS agent, and if Churchill had not saved her bacon, she might have been hanged after the war! ---
**Author:** ![Slithy\_Tove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slithy_tove/32/18248_2.png) [@Slithy\_Tove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slithy_Tove)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2012, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gertrude-stein-nazi-is-a-nazi-is-a-nazi/620549/10 "2012-05-01T23:45:11Z")
Please excuse the hijack, but close by the topic of Chanel and the Nazis (or was that just Goebbels in drag?): to anyone further interested I’d like to recommend [Broken Threads: The Destruction of the Jewish Fashion Industry in Germany and Austria](http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B006QS7WM4?qid=1335915276&sr=8-2), by (my former fiber arts instructor) Roberta Kremer. Thank you for letting me make the plug. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gertrude-stein-nazi-is-a-nazi-is-a-nazi/620549/11 "2012-05-02T00:00:17Z")
I can’t even recall why I’m supposed to know who she is, though I do remember her name. Voting rights or something? Could Jews vote in France? ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gertrude-stein-nazi-is-a-nazi-is-a-nazi/620549/12 "2012-05-02T00:18:20Z")
Are you asking about Stein? She was a writer and art collector. I don’t know much more about her except that according to Lynne Truss, you can find a quote from her hating on just about every punctuation mark except the period. Explains a lot, in my opinion. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gertrude-stein-nazi-is-a-nazi-is-a-nazi/620549/13 "2012-05-02T00:23:19Z")
Yes, I am asking about Stein. Why is (or was) she famous? ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gertrude-stein-nazi-is-a-nazi-is-a-nazi/620549/14 "2012-05-02T00:28:02Z")
For being a writer and an art collector. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Second\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@The\_Second\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Second_Stone)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gertrude-stein-nazi-is-a-nazi-is-a-nazi/620549/15 "2012-05-02T00:29:23Z")
> [@Boyo\_Jim](#): > > I can’t even recall why I’m supposed to know who she is, though I do remember her name. Voting rights or something? > > Could Jews vote in France? Stein and her brother Leo discovered Picasso and collected art in Paris during the early 20th century. They had lots of artists over and promoted the careers of a lot of great artists from when they were unknowns. They had a falling apart after Leo confessed that he hated Gertrude’s writing style. She was a self-proclaimed genius as a writer and lots of people agree with her. She was a genius at picking out up and coming artists. The Steins were born in the SF Bay Area and their family owned one of the many San Francisco street car companies, from which they got the wealth necessary to leave Oakland (“there is no there, there” is a famous G.S. quote re Oakland) and live in Paris and collect art. ---
**Author:** ![rowrrbazzle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rowrrbazzle/32/414_2.png) [@rowrrbazzle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rowrrbazzle)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gertrude-stein-nazi-is-a-nazi-is-a-nazi/620549/16 "2012-05-02T03:02:26Z")
> [@Boyo\_Jim](#): > > Yes, I am asking about Stein. Why is (or was) she famous? [Rose is a rose is a rose is a rose](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rose_is_a_rose_is_a_rose_is_a_rose). [Pigeons on the grass alas](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Four_Saints_in_Three_Acts). ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gertrude-stein-nazi-is-a-nazi-is-a-nazi/620549/17 "2012-05-02T03:09:00Z")
In Spanish it’s “Arroz es arroz es arroz.” ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2012, 4:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gertrude-stein-nazi-is-a-nazi-is-a-nazi/620549/18 "2012-05-03T04:30:47Z")
Also, while she was never “out” in the way we think of it today, she’s one of the few unambiguously gay figures from her era, making her an early icon in gay culture. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2012, 9:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gertrude-stein-nazi-is-a-nazi-is-a-nazi/620549/19 "2012-05-03T09:51:42Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > In Spanish it’s “Arroz es arroz es arroz.” BUt only if you’re one of those people who pronounce any S as a Z. ---
**Author:** ![njtt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ecd19e/32.png) [@njtt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/njtt)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2012, 10:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gertrude-stein-nazi-is-a-nazi-is-a-nazi/620549/20 "2012-05-03T10:02:11Z")
Is this so uncommon amongst the modernist writers of that era? Ezra Pound was an overt fascist and Nazi collaborator; there is some quite blatant anti-semitism in some of T.S. Eliot’s poems from the 1920s; and that is just the Americans that spring to mind. The poet D’Annunzio (I think he counts as modernist in the same sense as Stein) effectively kickstarted the fascist takeover of Italy. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gertrude-stein-nazi-is-a-nazi-is-a-nazi/620549.md?page=2)