# Get your GOD-damned idiocy out of my education! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 30, 2004, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/get-your-god-damned-idiocy-out-of-my-education/277358 "2004-11-30T17:58:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2004, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/get-your-god-damned-idiocy-out-of-my-education/277358/21 "2004-11-30T19:16:01Z")
Good on you for posting this, **Ghanima**. From the outside looking in, it looks like all y’all have gone Crazy for Christ. I’ve read enough Heinlein to be scared, real scared. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2004, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/get-your-god-damned-idiocy-out-of-my-education/277358/22 "2004-11-30T19:22:41Z")
Dang it, I forgot to post my story about evolution. I was out for wings one night, and we got talking about evolution, and I made a point of calling it the **Theory** of evolution. It was funny to see the reactions of the people I was with - probably the same reaction you guys get when you call Creationism a theory. Bottom line - nobody knows. Period. We don’t know how we all got here, we don’t know where we go when we die, we don’t know how many turtles it takes to support the earth. ---
**Author:** ![Aldebaran](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Aldebaran](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aldebaran)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2004, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/get-your-god-damned-idiocy-out-of-my-education/277358/23 "2004-11-30T19:23:26Z")
I’m trying to remember wo was the last one who said on this message board that I am 1.completely wrong 2.so damn biased 3.so completely ignorant about the USA because I once again stated that the USA is not at all perceived as a secular nation by people outside the USA. Usual attacker(s) start to refer to the US constitution who would make US secular and that therefore I have no clue about the USA. I’m waiting now for these same people to show up here and tell the OP that he has no clue about his own country, its society its culture and its amazing addiction to the Christian religion in an amazing amount of different aspects and views. Not only that: the way this Christian religion is propagated in the USA is as much amazing as the addiction to it itself. God here and Jesus there. God and Jesus everywhere. God at school and Jesus on TV. Jesus Saves through Bible quotes on the packing of your grocery. I never saw any nation that makes such a marketing business out of God and Jesus then the “secular” USA. Salaam. A ---
**Author:** ![kung\_fu\_lola](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/f4b2a3/32.png) [@kung\_fu\_lola](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kung_fu_lola)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2004, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/get-your-god-damned-idiocy-out-of-my-education/277358/24 "2004-11-30T19:27:03Z")
> [@featherlou](#): > > Bottom line - nobody knows. Period. We don’t know how we all got here, we don’t know where we go when we die, we don’t know how many turtles it takes to support the earth. No, but it’s already been established that evolution does not claim to explain how life came to be. But we _do_ know what happens to life once it shows up. It evolves, or it is extinguished. As you said; “Period.” ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Ashtar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ea924/32.png) [@Lord\_Ashtar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Ashtar)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2004, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/get-your-god-damned-idiocy-out-of-my-education/277358/25 "2004-11-30T19:31:43Z")
> [@friedo](#): > > Fuck it. I’m sick and tired entrenced political correctness about theism and the inherrent evil it represents. Yes, theists are idiots. Even the smart ones. There is a cultural barrier that tells us we _must_ respect another person’s beliefs, no matter how absurd, because disliking someone for their opinions is wrong. It is taboo to say out loud that religion entirely based on fantasy, that the vast majority of religious history is filled with acts of unspeakable barbarism and cruelty in the name of fallacy, and that people who succumb to its temptations are intellectual dilatantes who are afraid or unwilling to accept the fact that magic is not real. Sound superior? I feel superior to theists in the same way that a tolerant person feels superior to a racist. I feel superior in the sae way that democracy is superior to totalitarianism. Religion, like statism, is backwards, barbaric and foolish, and whether by accident or design is a tool of both exterior and self-opression. Oh no, we _can’t_ say that. Because we have to respect their beliefs. Well, I do not, and I will no longer pretend that I do. I don’t care if it makes me a pariah. [Fight Club] Yes, these are bruises from fighting. Yes, I’m comfortable with that. I am enlightened. [/Fight Club] ---
**Author:** ![SentientMeat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/43a26b/32.png) [@SentientMeat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SentientMeat)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2004, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/get-your-god-damned-idiocy-out-of-my-education/277358/26 "2004-11-30T19:33:22Z")
> [@](#): > > evolution theory doesn’t claim to know how life started. That is a mystery to everyone. No schoolbook claims to have the facts regarding how life began. You’re correct that evolution specifically only relates to the origin of _species_, but [abiogenesis](http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/abioprob/) is actually pretty solid these days. Anyone looking for a gap to fit God in should be advised that that one’s way too small already. ---
**Author:** ![Yeticus\_Rex](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/a698b9/32.png) [@Yeticus\_Rex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yeticus_Rex)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2004, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/get-your-god-damned-idiocy-out-of-my-education/277358/27 "2004-11-30T19:33:45Z")
> [@Ghanima](#): > > I look at religious people the same way I look at racists. Most of them can’t help that they were taught something like that. And they do have the right to feel the way they do. But they don’t have the right to impose their beliefs on others. That would be a huge mistake, **Ghanima**. Not all religious people impose their beliefs on others. Some maybe comparable to racists, but don’t throw all religious people into the same bin. ---
**Author:** ![SentientMeat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/43a26b/32.png) [@SentientMeat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SentientMeat)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2004, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/get-your-god-damned-idiocy-out-of-my-education/277358/28 "2004-11-30T19:37:48Z")
> [@](#): > > **lou** :I made a point of calling it the Theory of evolution. Evolution is a **fact** : Species die out and other species _which weren’t there before_ take their place, over _millions_ of years. This is _undeniable_. > [@](#): > > Bottom line - nobody knows. Period. We don’t know how we all got here, we don’t know where we go when we die, we don’t know how many turtles it takes to support the earth. Then there is _no such thing_ as “knowledge”. ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2004, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/get-your-god-damned-idiocy-out-of-my-education/277358/29 "2004-11-30T19:47:25Z")
> [@Aldebaran](#): > > I’m trying to remember wo was the last one who said on this message board that I am > 1.completely wrong > 2.so damn biased > 3.so completely ignorant about the USA > because I once again stated that the USA is not at all perceived as a secular nation by people outside the USA. > > Usual attacker(s) start to refer to the US constitution who would make US secular and that therefore I have no clue about the USA. > > I’m waiting now for these same people to show up here and tell the OP that he has no clue about his own country, its society its culture and its amazing addiction to the Christian religion in an amazing amount of different aspects and views. > Not only that: the way this Christian religion is propagated in the USA is as much amazing as the addiction to it itself. > > God here and Jesus there. > God and Jesus everywhere. > God at school and Jesus on TV. > Jesus Saves through Bible quotes on the packing of your grocery. > > I never saw any nation that makes such a marketing business out of God and Jesus then the “secular” USA. > Salaam. A Seeing as how I think I was one that said you were completely wrong, I’ll go ahead and jump in here. There is a huge difference between what you said, and what you now say you said. What ACTUALLY happened was that you came into Great Debates with a rant about how horrible the USers are for thinking that they live in a secular nation when Roy Moore can put up a granite 10 commandments in a courtroom lobby. That was a far cry from “because I once again stated that the USA is not at all perceived as a secular nation by people outside the USA.” See, I have no problem with you latter statement. The USA may not be perceived as a secular nation by people outside the USA. If that was what you had originally stated, we never would have had a problem. But, your revisionist history aside, that’s not what you said. You see, you consistently confuse the United States government and the United States society. This fundamental misunderstanding by you has been pointed out to you over and over and over and over, to no avail. I do not suspect this post will have any additional effect. However, I will refuse your request to tell the OP he is as horribly wrong as you remain. The OP feels great pressure from facets of society being Christian. I really can’t argue with him there. Evangelical Christians are growing in number and in their visibility. His point, and you’re original mess of an OP to which you appear to be referring, are completely different things. ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2004, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/get-your-god-damned-idiocy-out-of-my-education/277358/30 "2004-11-30T19:48:15Z")
> [@featherlou](#): > > Bottom line - nobody knows. Period. We don’t know how we all got here, we don’t know where we go when we die, we don’t know how many turtles it takes to support the earth. Only one. But he doesn’t actually support it, the four humongo elephants standing on his back do. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2004, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/get-your-god-damned-idiocy-out-of-my-education/277358/31 "2004-11-30T19:49:33Z")
> [@Ghanima](#): > > And what does he say? That I have to examine my faith in God. Excuse me, asshole, but go fuck yourself. Personally, I’d have cocked my head and pretended to seriously examine my faith for 1.3 seconds, than said “Inconclusive!” But then unlike you, I’m an atheist with a sense of humour. ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2004, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/get-your-god-damned-idiocy-out-of-my-education/277358/32 "2004-11-30T19:53:36Z")
> [@featherlou](#): > > Dang it, I forgot to post my story about evolution. I was out for wings one night, and we got talking about evolution, and I made a point of calling it the **Theory** of evolution. It was funny to see the reactions of the people I was with - probably the same reaction you guys get when you call Creationism a theory. Yes, evolution is a theory. A theory does not mean, as many seem to believe, “a wild guess without any firm evidence.” A scientific theory is a coherent explantion for a natural phenomenon supported by tested hypotheses. We have the thoery of gravity, but that doesn’t mean that gravity is merely a guess. We have the germ theory of disease, which is supported by tons of evidence including direct observation. > [@](#): > > Bottom line - nobody knows. Period. We don’t know how we all got here, we don’t know where we go when we die, we don’t know how many turtles it takes to support the earth. There is a plethora of things we don’t know–how will the universe end, how to make an effective cold vaccine, how did life originate, does P=NP. That’s one of the beauties of science, that the more we learn the more we find out how much more there is to learn. But you have a choice, to investigate those questions using reason and analysis, crafting tighter and more coherent theories based on better observations or to take refuge in myth and legend, never understanding the mechanics of the universe. Theists lack imagination because they rely on cheap, dull legends. Axheads floating on water, women turning into salt, virgins having babies. But the real world offers much more entrancing stories . . . That the starlight we see at night is ancient light that was generated by the fusion of hydrogen into helium thousands of years ago. That mitochondrial DNA can link an English schoolteacher to ancient bones from the Stone Age That eclipses of the sun and moon can be predicted exactly far into the future I wrote a post several years ago that I’m unable to find which addressed the comparative virtues of religion and science. ---
**Author:** ![Corner\_Case](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/corner_case/32/234_2.png) [@Corner\_Case](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Corner_Case)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2004, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/get-your-god-damned-idiocy-out-of-my-education/277358/33 "2004-11-30T19:58:58Z")
education - [n] the gradual process of acquiring knowledge by learning and instruction. I’ll always play Devil’s Advocate (as if you couldn’t tell) to test my beliefs and enlighten myself. I think **featherlou** ’s sig notes an important point: > [@H. Poincaré](#): > > To doubt everything or to believe everything are two equally convenient solutions; both dispense with the necessity of reflection. Give me a system that is completely religiously based and I fear for the scientific method and freedom of thought. Spanish Inquisistion anyone? Give me a system that is completely secular and I fear that there will be no underlying basis for treating life and the pursuit of happiness with any respect. In terms of the OP - education should teach history and the facts as we know them. The founding fathers were deists; the laws have a lot of christian principles; some people want religion in everything, some don’t. ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2004, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/get-your-god-damned-idiocy-out-of-my-education/277358/34 "2004-11-30T20:05:51Z")
> [@gobear](#): > > That mitochondrial DNA can link an English schoolteacher to ancient bones from the Stone Age I saw the same Travel Channel thing you did, I think (treasure hunters or something). I thought that was lame. They just picked whoever was the closest DNA match among like 10 kids and the teacher - of course you’ll get a ‘closest’ - and then tried to turn it around like ‘isn’t it amazing he’s a match!?’ Anyway, back to the thread. Evolution is as widely accepted a theory as anything in science. Creationism isn’t science. Don’t pretend it is. ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2004, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/get-your-god-damned-idiocy-out-of-my-education/277358/35 "2004-11-30T20:06:42Z")
> [@friedo](#): > > Fuck it. I’m sick and tired entrenced political correctness about theism and the inherrent evil it represents. Yes, theists are idiots. Even the smart ones. There is a cultural barrier that tells us we _must_ respect another person’s beliefs, no matter how absurd, because disliking someone for their opinions is wrong. It is taboo to say out loud that religion entirely based on fantasy, that the vast majority of religious history is filled with acts of unspeakable barbarism and cruelty in the name of fallacy, and that people who succumb to its temptations are intellectual dilatantes who are afraid or unwilling to accept the fact that magic is not real. Sound superior? I feel superior to theists in the same way that a tolerant person feels superior to a racist. I feel superior in the sae way that democracy is superior to totalitarianism. Religion, like statism, is backwards, barbaric and foolish, and whether by accident or design is a tool of both exterior and self-opression. Oh no, we _can’t_ say that. Because we have to respect their beliefs. Well, I do not, and I will no longer pretend that I do. I don’t care if it makes me a pariah. > > Religion isn’t evil necessarily because of the deeds that religious people commit. Indeed, most of them are perfectly nice individuals. Religion is evil because it specifically necessitates rejection of the very intellect that has driven the development of our society into one of unencumbered technological advancement and scientific discovery. Yes, religious people have contributed immeasurably to the progress of mankind. And they probably could have still done it if they weren’t obsessed with imaginary friends and primitive rituals. Imagine what Isaac Newton could have accomplished if he didn’t spend the last 50 years of his life studying numerology. > > It is not enough to say that I disagree with religious beliefs and am therefore an atheist. I both disagree with and vehemetly despise religious belief. I have tremendous respect for the accomplishments of religious people, but I do not now, nor will I ever, respect their beliefs. That is not wrong, nor should it be scandalous to say out loud. Wow. I don’t think I’ve ever heard anyone just come out and say it before. I’m with you, brother. ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2004, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/get-your-god-damned-idiocy-out-of-my-education/277358/36 "2004-11-30T20:18:26Z")
> [@Elenia28](#): > > Wow. I don’t think I’ve ever heard anyone just come out and say it before. > > I’m with you, brother. I was inspired by Douglas Adams. He said it a lot more eloquently (and calmly) than I. ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2004, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/get-your-god-damned-idiocy-out-of-my-education/277358/37 "2004-11-30T20:19:00Z")
> [@bup](#): > > I saw the same Travel Channel thing you did, I think (treasure hunters or something). I thought that was lame. They just picked whoever was the closest DNA match among like 10 kids and the teacher - of course you’ll get a ‘closest’ - and then tried to turn it around like ‘isn’t it amazing he’s a match!?’ > > . Didn’t see that. I read about Cheddar Man and his modern relative in **The Seven Daughters of Eve**. ---
**Author:** ![Corner\_Case](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/corner_case/32/234_2.png) [@Corner\_Case](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Corner_Case)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2004, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/get-your-god-damned-idiocy-out-of-my-education/277358/38 "2004-11-30T20:31:49Z")
> [@gobear](#): > > **The Seven Daughters of Eve**. Gosh, I didn’t know [Eve](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/member.php) had any daughters. What are their names? ---
**Author:** ![davenportavenger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/5f8ce5/32.png) [@davenportavenger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davenportavenger)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2004, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/get-your-god-damned-idiocy-out-of-my-education/277358/39 "2004-11-30T20:42:28Z")
> [@friedo](#): > > I feel superior in the sae way that democracy is superior to totalitarianism. Theists =/= ultra-religious wackjobs. ---
**Author:** ![Ghanima](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Ghanima](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ghanima)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2004, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/get-your-god-damned-idiocy-out-of-my-education/277358/40 "2004-11-30T20:44:21Z")
> [@Yeticus Rex](#): > > That would be a huge mistake, **Ghanima**. Not all religious people impose their beliefs on others. Some maybe comparable to racists, but don’t throw all religious people into the same bin. Hello, did I say that every religious person does this? Whooooosh. I don’t care if its just one person or all of them. It’s still wrong. Go ahead and worship your deity, but get it out of my government and get it out of my bank and get it out of my classroom. The sheer willful ignorance is just staggering. “Intelligent design” my ass! What’s so intelligent about bad backs, fallen arches, bunyons, poor eyesight, heart failure, appendices that rupture and kidney stones? FUCK intelligent design. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/get-your-god-damned-idiocy-out-of-my-education/277358.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/get-your-god-damned-idiocy-out-of-my-education/277358.md?page=3)