# Getting bumped off a plane question. **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [October 20, 2019, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-bumped-off-a-plane-question/842042 "2019-10-20T17:44:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![SandyHook](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dec6dc/32.png) [@SandyHook](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SandyHook)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2019, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-bumped-off-a-plane-question/842042/1 "2019-10-20T17:44:51Z")
Mulling about the Quora website I found the item below: Q; What would you do if you were involuntarily bumped by any airline on an overbooked flight? Maxwell Arnold, I’m an informed passenger who knows his rights. Updated Feb 8, 2018 · Upvoted by Mac Jambo Sinclair, 20 years private pilot That’s easy. I’d take out my printed copy of the contract of carriage (which I almost always carry with me when flying) and ask them to point out where it says they’re allowed to do that. If they can. I will make sure that they have agreed in writing (or on video) to provide me with the maximum compensation I’m entitled to. If they can’t: Then I’ve successfully intimidated them into trying that “involuntary” bullshit on some other poor sap. If they try to drag me off the plane: Well, they can’t exactly say I didn’t warn them. He also included a picture of a t-shirt with this on it. I actually read my ticket contract. I have David Dao’s lawyer on speed dial. Go ahead and bump me. I dare you So, is there anything to this as a means of keeping from being bumped? Should I be carrying a contract copy around with me when I fly? Who is David Dao? Is the OP as full of shit as he sounds? ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2019, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-bumped-off-a-plane-question/842042/2 "2019-10-20T18:00:26Z")
There’s an extensive explanation here, too much to quote: > **[Bumping & Oversales | US Department of Transportation](https://www.transportation.gov/individuals/aviation-consumer-protection/bumping-oversales)** > > \*/ /\*--\>\*/ Bumping The vast majority of the time, passengers don’t have any problems boarding their flights.  But occasionally, airlines may “bump” passengers and have them give up their seat It’s perfectly legal for them to do it so long as they have some kind of fair non-discriminatory procedure for selection. In most cases you’d be denied boarding, in which I don’t think pointing at your t-shirt or producing a contract is going to get you very far. In the rare situation where they are asking you to leave the plane _after_ boarding, they are still legally entitled to do so. Insisting that you are not going to go down easy and they will have to physically drag you off the plane might give them pause, or they might call your bluff and you could find yourself facing criminal charges. ---
**Author:** ![Reply](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/reply/32/15952_2.png) [@Reply](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reply)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2019, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-bumped-off-a-plane-question/842042/3 "2019-10-20T18:01:53Z")
It’s just a comedy sketch, no? The contract of carriage no doubt lists the conditions and compensations for overbooking. Here’s United: [https://www.united.com/ual/en/us/fly/contract-of-carriage.html#tcm:76-6644](https://www.united.com/ual/en/us/fly/contract-of-carriage.html#tcm:76-6644) David Dao is the doctor who was dragged off a plane against his will (for being an entitled schmuck, IMHO): [2017 United Express passenger removal - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Express_Flight_3411_incident) United apologized and changed their policies not because they were contractually obligated to, but because the video went viral, people bandwagoned and shamed United into change. Nobody likes being overbooked and removed from a flight, so they took the opportunity to protest what until then was SOP for the airlines. I think it’s still SOP, really, but now they won’t get TSA involved or some such if a passenger refuses to comply. So TLDR, overbooking has happened forever, some passengers complain and whine, most get bumped anyway. But if you happen to resist and get recorded and successfully play the victim, well, you get fame and fortune and United looks bad. But it’s all right there in the contract. _shrug_ ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2019, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-bumped-off-a-plane-question/842042/4 "2019-10-20T18:12:55Z")
In the real world, they will first look for volunteers to disembark because that’s cheaper than the mandatory compensation for involuntarily bumped passengers. They may have to increase from their first offer for volunteers (once I was on a Thanksgiving flight on which the offers got really tempting, though I don’t remember details) but usually can get someone to volunteer. ---
**Author:** ![Hari\_Seldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hari_seldon/32/5173_2.png) [@Hari\_Seldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hari_Seldon)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2019, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-bumped-off-a-plane-question/842042/5 "2019-10-20T21:12:39Z")
If I were flying in Canada, the first thing I would do is to threaten to phone my friend Gabor Lucacs (see [Gábor Lukács | Air Passenger Rights](https://airpassengerrights.ca/en/about/team/gabor-lukacs)) who has spent much of his life terrorizing airlines, especially Air Canada. And he actually is a friend, although not a close one. He is a mathematician originally from Hungary who loves a good fight. Incidentally, I once overheard a gate agent telling a would-be passenger that when they overbook, they deny boarding according to the fare you paid. The higher you paid, the less likely to get bumped. ---
**Author:** ![OldGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/3bc359/32.png) [@OldGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OldGuy)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2019, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-bumped-off-a-plane-question/842042/6 "2019-10-20T21:17:08Z")
I hold a PhD. The only time I ever use the title Dr. is when booking flights. I was told, but have no other evidence, that the airlines are reluctant to bump doctors as they may be travelling to treat someone. I’ve never been bumped, but I have no idea if that is why. I do not fly often. I have been on flights where they asked for volunteers. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2019, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-bumped-off-a-plane-question/842042/7 "2019-10-20T21:40:02Z")
Nice strategic thinking, **Oldguy**. I wonder if they check for truthiness when I book a flight. If not, there’s nothing preventing me from trying the same gambit. (It might get a little dicey if an actual medical emergency arises mid-flight, but the tension of takeoffs and landings only lasts for a couple of minutes each. This way, I could be on edge for the entire flight, hoping nobody has a heart attack or starts giving birth. Exhilarating!) ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2019, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-bumped-off-a-plane-question/842042/8 "2019-10-20T21:43:09Z")
In my experience, when there is a medical emergency, they make an inflight announcement asking for medical staff to volunteer to assist, rather than going through the manifest looking for names with Dr in front of them. ---
**Author:** ![OldGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/3bc359/32.png) [@OldGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OldGuy)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2019, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-bumped-off-a-plane-question/842042/9 "2019-10-20T21:47:34Z")
If a medical emergency arose when I was flying, and I was asked, I’d simply say I was a PhD not a medical doctor. There is nothing wrong with titling yourself Doctor if you hold a PhD. In fact PhDs were the original doctors. The degree is quite a bit older than the MD. ---
**Author:** ![SandyHook](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dec6dc/32.png) [@SandyHook](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SandyHook)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2019, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-bumped-off-a-plane-question/842042/10 "2019-10-20T21:51:27Z")
Thanks guys. You answers are pretty much in line with what I thought. ---
**Author:** ![Reply](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/reply/32/15952_2.png) [@Reply](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reply)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2019, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-bumped-off-a-plane-question/842042/11 "2019-10-20T21:53:19Z")
> [@OldGuy](#): > > I was told, but have no other evidence, that the airlines are reluctant to bump doctors as they may be travelling to treat someone. It’s true they don’t like to bump doctors. They drag them instead 😉 ---
**Author:** ![susan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/susan/32/17537_2.png) [@susan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/susan)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2019, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-bumped-off-a-plane-question/842042/12 "2019-10-20T21:55:13Z")
Didn’t work for David Dao. ETA: Ninjaed. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2019, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-bumped-off-a-plane-question/842042/13 "2019-10-20T21:59:46Z")
That’s a good point. I think I’ll stick to my current strategy of boarding the plane dressed up like Snoopy, in his WWI flying ace outfit, so they’ll know there’s someone to call on if the plane gets attacked by the Red Baron… ---
**Author:** ![Reply](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/reply/32/15952_2.png) [@Reply](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reply)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2019, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-bumped-off-a-plane-question/842042/14 "2019-10-20T22:15:20Z")
For anyone interested, here’s the government’s briefing on your overbooking compensation rights: > **[Bumping & Oversales | US Department of Transportation](https://www.transportation.gov/individuals/aviation-consumer-protection/bumping-oversales)** > > \*/ /\*--\>\*/ Bumping The vast majority of the time, passengers don’t have any problems boarding their flights.  But occasionally, airlines may “bump” passengers and have them give up their seat And the relevant laws: [https://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/text-idx?node=pt14.4.250](https://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/text-idx?node=pt14.4.250) **However** , I think I was wrong about Doctor Dao: He was not denied boarding, but removed after he had already boarded. That may be different, legally: > **[United Airlines, Dr. Dao and Contract of Carriage](https://www.natlawreview.com/article/united-airlines-dr-dao-and-contract-carriage)** > > We live in a society where everyone is a potential source of video ‘news’.  Today people tend to reach for their phone to video a situation rather than to make any attempt to interven ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2019, 5:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-bumped-off-a-plane-question/842042/15 "2019-10-21T05:05:55Z")
I believe the Dept of Transportation (not the airline) changed their policy to say that a passenger could not be removed once boarded. Before you board, anyone is fair game depending on what the local country’s compensation policy is. Be careful how you argue. Interfering with flight crew is legally risky. (I saw a fellow pulled off a plane after it had left the gate after he interrupted the safety talk twice to complain he should have been allowed to move up to first class, not the lady who got it) I remember once (at the gate, before boarding started) the airline asked for volunteers to give up their seats. I approached the gate and said (at 6AM) “We aren’t in a hurry, if you can get us into New York before 10PM that’s fine by us.” Our stopover in Toronto, but we didn’t care what route they came up with, there were multiple options. They could not; that says something about chances for rescheduling a bumped flight. ---
**Author:** ![ftg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ftg/32/2801_2.png) [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2019, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-bumped-off-a-plane-question/842042/16 "2019-10-21T15:50:39Z")
> [@OldGuy](#): > > I hold a PhD. The only time I ever use the title Dr. is when booking flights. I was told, but have no other evidence, that the airlines are reluctant to bump doctors as they may be travelling to treat someone. The department secretaries at one university liked to do this for us. The only time it _might_ have helped is when our flight got routed to another airport and the airline gave two of us a free rent-a-car to get home that night. I then adopted it as a general rule for such situations on my own. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2019, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-bumped-off-a-plane-question/842042/17 "2019-10-21T16:18:45Z")
My father is a retired professor and he used the doctor title (or professor) when booking tickets, because he seemed to get more respect. ---
**Author:** ![WildaBeast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wildabeast/32/6_2.png) [@WildaBeast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WildaBeast)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2019, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-bumped-off-a-plane-question/842042/18 "2019-10-21T17:21:39Z")
> [@Reply](#): > > For anyone interested, here’s the government’s briefing on your overbooking compensation rights: Just as a point of clarification – passengers getting bumped **involuntarily** due to overbooking is extremely rare. In those cases the airline almost always is able to find people willing to volunteer. As I understand it the most common reason for passengers being involuntarily denied boarding is a last minute change of aircraft. Like for example, a 767 has a mechanical problem, and the airline doesn’t have another 767 available. The best they can come up with is a 737. But all the passengers won’t fit on the much smaller 737, so 20 people will need to be bumped. Obviously finding 20 volunteers is a pretty tall order, so most of those will be involuntary, but it’s preferable to outright canceling the flight. The Dr. Dao incident was a pretty unusual case, since they didn’t ask for volunteers until after the flight had boarded. A quirk of human psychology is that once we have something in out possession we’re much less likely to want to give it up. Had that asked before they boarded it’s very likely someone would have volunteered. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2019, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-bumped-off-a-plane-question/842042/19 "2019-10-21T18:14:53Z")
Upthread someone linked to the Department of Transportation rules for bumping passengers and it said that if the bumping is due to a change in aircraft, the airline does not have to offer compensation to the bumped passengers. And as for the Dr. Dao incident, there were many things wrong with the way that the airline handled that, not just that they waited until after the flight had boarded. ---
**Author:** ![squidfood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a87d85/32.png) [@squidfood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squidfood)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2019, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-bumped-off-a-plane-question/842042/20 "2019-10-21T18:30:06Z")
Arguing with the airline desk staff when they screwed up my reservation once (100% their fault) is the one time of my life I ever tried the “actually, it’s Dr. Squidfood” when they called me “Mr. Squidfood”. It didn’t win me any points but it made me fee good for a second. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-bumped-off-a-plane-question/842042.md?page=2)