# Getting lapped in a bike race **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [June 2, 2016, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-lapped-in-a-bike-race/756325 "2016-06-02T17:17:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![alterego](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/6bbea6/32.png) [@alterego](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alterego)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2016, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-lapped-in-a-bike-race/756325/1 "2016-06-02T17:17:03Z")
If the winner of a race has a time of 23:26.8 and the loser also has a time of 23:26.8 (he finished the previous lap at the exact same moment that the winner won the race), and the race is then over, was the loser lapped? Note that the winner didn’t actually pass the loser. ---
**Author:** ![beowulff](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/beowulff/32/542_2.png) [@beowulff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/beowulff)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2016, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-lapped-in-a-bike-race/756325/2 "2016-06-02T17:25:53Z")
Yes. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2016, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-lapped-in-a-bike-race/756325/3 "2016-06-02T17:26:35Z")
I’d say yes. The loser still has a lap to go. Even if they are even, he _has_ been caught. ---
**Author:** ![Folly](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folly/32/3219_2.png) [@Folly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folly)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2016, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-lapped-in-a-bike-race/756325/4 "2016-06-02T17:29:44Z")
Some definitions of ‘lapped’ on a quick search say ‘to be one or more laps ahead’ and the answer is yes, while at least one definition used the word ‘overtake’ which would require passing. So it depends on which definition you want to go with. Personally, I would say the person was lapped. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2016, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-lapped-in-a-bike-race/756325/5 "2016-06-02T17:30:25Z")
When the winner crosses the line, the rest of the peleton doesn’t just pull over to the side of the road and wait for the team car to pick them up. Every rider must cover the same distance. Positions are awarded based on the time it takes the given rider to cover that distance. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2016, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-lapped-in-a-bike-race/756325/6 "2016-06-02T17:34:38Z")
Timing to only a .1 sec means there could be as much as a 3.6 foot difference between the bike positions (at 25 mph) and still record the same time. ---
**Author:** ![Folly](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folly/32/3219_2.png) [@Folly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folly)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2016, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-lapped-in-a-bike-race/756325/7 "2016-06-02T17:37:38Z")
I assumed the hypothetical to involve a quantum finish\* and that the loser still finished out the final lap. \*No fair, you changed the outcome by measuring it -Hubert Farnsworth ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2016, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-lapped-in-a-bike-race/756325/8 "2016-06-02T17:40:39Z")
Moved to the Game Room. Colibri General Questions Moderator ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2016, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-lapped-in-a-bike-race/756325/9 "2016-06-02T18:06:37Z")
“Finish time” in a mass start road or track bike race is a little unusual. Because of the importance of the drafting effect, riders ten to aggregate in groups, especially on non-technical flat road terrain or on the track where most of the resistance to forward motion is aerodynamic drag. In some track races and road stage races, both placing (1st, 2nd, 3rd…) and finish time matter, the former determining the stage win, the latter counting toward aggregate time for the “overall” win. In a pro race, the largest group (the “peloton”) is oftern 200 riders. There can be a significant passage of time between the first rider and the last rider a group, and it would be extremely dangerous if, approaching the finish line, every single rider tried to be as far forward as possible. Therefore, at the finish line, all riders deemed by the judges to be part of one contiguous group are assigned the same _time_ as the first person in that group. Thus, riders who aren’t in contention for the stage win can drift back in the group and keep out of the way. So, finishing “at the exact same moment” as the winner really means that the rider was in the same contiguous group as the winner across the finish line. Lapping is a relevant in concept in “criterium” road races (circuits, usually in towns) and mass start track races. If a rider is ahead or behind during the race, and later either catches or is caught by a group, then continues to finish the race with that group, he will get the same time as that group, but will indeed be considered to be either a lap ahead or a lap down. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2016, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-lapped-in-a-bike-race/756325/10 "2016-06-02T21:45:21Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > “Finish time” in a mass start road or track bike race is a little unusual. > > Because of the importance of the drafting effect, riders ten to aggregate in groups, especially on non-technical flat road terrain or on the track where most of the resistance to forward motion is aerodynamic drag. > > In some track races and road stage races, both placing (1st, 2nd, 3rd…) and finish time matter, the former determining the stage win, the latter counting toward aggregate time for the “overall” win. In a pro race, the largest group (the “peloton”) is oftern 200 riders. There can be a significant passage of time between the first rider and the last rider a group, and it would be extremely dangerous if, approaching the finish line, every single rider tried to be as far forward as possible. Therefore, at the finish line, all riders deemed by the judges to be part of one contiguous group are assigned the same _time_ as the first person in that group. Thus, riders who aren’t in contention for the stage win can drift back in the group and keep out of the way. The final stage of the Tour de France (at least since I’ve been watching it) starts well outside of Paris, and once they reach the city they do several laps around a course between the Arc de Triomphe and Place de la Concorde. (Saw some of the recent Tour of California and it seemed to be a similar finish in Sacramento. Don’t know about other multi-stage races.) I’ve occasionally wondered what would happen if a breakaway group got sufficiently far ahead that they were a lap ahead of the main group (and to gain all the efficiency benefits of riding in a group). Of course, the peloton has every reason not to allow that to happen, and to catch the breakaway before such a situation develops, but it still seems like it should be addressed by the rules. Would the race simply end for everyone as the leaders crossed the line, or would those breakaway riders stop and let the rest of the field ride their last lap? ---
**Author:** ![Pleonast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pleonast/32/1183_2.png) [@Pleonast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pleonast)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2016, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-lapped-in-a-bike-race/756325/11 "2016-06-03T00:44:42Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > There can be a significant passage of time between the first rider and the last rider a group, and it would be extremely dangerous if, approaching the finish line, every single rider tried to be as far forward as possible. Therefore, at the finish line, all riders deemed by the judges to be part of one contiguous group are assigned the same _time_ as the first person in that group. That’s the problem with allowing Fermions to race when the rules are better suited to Bosons. ---
**Author:** ![Laggard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9de053/32.png) [@Laggard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Laggard)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2016, 1:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-lapped-in-a-bike-race/756325/12 "2016-06-03T01:07:56Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > The final stage of the Tour de France (at least since I’ve been watching it) starts well outside of Paris, and once they reach the city they do several laps around a course between the Arc de Triomphe and Place de la Concorde. (Saw some of the recent Tour of California and it seemed to be a similar finish in Sacramento. Don’t know about other multi-stage races.) I’ve occasionally wondered what would happen if a breakaway group got sufficiently far ahead that they were a lap ahead of the main group (and to gain all the efficiency benefits of riding in a group). Of course, the peloton has every reason not to allow that to happen, and to catch the breakaway before such a situation develops, but it still seems like it should be addressed by the rules. Would the race simply end for everyone as the leaders crossed the line, or would those breakaway riders stop and let the rest of the field ride their last lap? Why would it end for those lapped non breakaway riders? For each rider the overall elapsed time clock continues until they cross the finish line. Riders do lose overall places on the last stage. It’s no different than on a totally linear stage. The winners are sometimes in the showers when the slower riders finish. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2016, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-lapped-in-a-bike-race/756325/13 "2016-06-03T01:21:11Z")
> [@Laggard](#): > > Why would it end for those lapped non breakaway riders? For each rider the overall elapsed time clock continues until they cross the finish line. Riders do lose overall places on the last stage. It’s no different than on a totally linear stage. The winners are sometimes in the showers when the slower riders finish. It shouldn’t end for those riders who haven’t completed the full distance, but I think the chaos of having a few riders sprinting for the finish (and racing for the stage win) among a larger crowd that still had one lap to ride, and then separating the riders who’d finished from those who hadn’t, would be unmanageable. Consider the opposite, the peloton has reached Paris and is riding laps around the final circuit and one rider has a flat tire. He falls out of the peloton to get his bike fixed, but because he’s riding alone he can’t catch back up. The peloton laps him. At the end of the race do they keep the whole course clear and single out that one rider to keep going? ---
**Author:** ![Laggard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9de053/32.png) [@Laggard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Laggard)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2016, 2:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-lapped-in-a-bike-race/756325/14 "2016-06-03T02:02:01Z")
Dupe ---
**Author:** ![Laggard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9de053/32.png) [@Laggard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Laggard)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2016, 2:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-lapped-in-a-bike-race/756325/15 "2016-06-03T02:07:46Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > It shouldn’t end for those riders who haven’t completed the full distance, but I think the chaos of having a few riders sprinting for the finish (and racing for the stage win) among a larger crowd that still had one lap to ride, and then separating the riders who’d finished from those who hadn’t, would be unmanageable. Consider the opposite, the peloton has reached Paris and is riding laps around the final circuit and one rider has a flat tire. He falls out of the peloton to get his bike fixed, but because he’s riding alone he can’t catch back up. The peloton laps him. At the end of the race do they keep the whole course clear and single out that one rider to keep going? It’s a very wide course and these are pros. Lapped riders would simply ride on the inside and would be safely passed. There’s also a gps device on each bike that records each riders elapsed time. There would be no chaos. ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2016, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/getting-lapped-in-a-bike-race/756325/16 "2016-06-03T13:59:06Z")
> [@Laggard](#): > > Dupe Look, just because I got lapped, you don’t have to call me a dupe. Ha. Before this one race, a cyclist friend came up to me and said “I’m probably going to win this race. So if you want to get an inch from my back wheel and stay there, you’ve got a good chance of coming in second.” So I did. Got a Personal Best time that day. The wind resistance is indeed a huge factor. But no lapping… just wanted to add to the discussion anyhow.