Getting tired of San Francisco

[Voyager]

@Roderick_Femm

My problem with living here is the continued upward pressure on population and prices and pretty much everything, combined with the dig-in-their-heels types who just don’t want to see any changes at all. The result is that there is no vision about a viable future here. Houses turn from 2BR single family homes to 6BR boarding houses, and the city turns a blind eye because housing. The city is openly anti-private cars, but public transportation gets worse instead of better. They expect people to walk and bike if they can’t use public transit, but I’m 70 with 2 wonky knees, I ain’t biking. Not to mention that this is a city famous for its hills. Add to that, we don’t take advantage of any of the cultural stuff going on here. Kind of a waste, really.

I live in Fremont. We don’t have a walkable (or really any) downtown, but getting around here is not an issue. And we have plenty of nice parks and neighborhoods to walk in. I see tons of walkers every day, and more tons of dog walkers. I walked my dog on every block of my extended neighborhood and was very comfortable doing so, even at night.
Where I live I have a short or moderate walk to 3 grocery stores, a Whole Foods, a Sprouts, a (dying) mall, a couple of shopping centers, and enough restaurants that if I decided to make a project of eating at every one the set would turn over before I was done. Nothing world class, but plenty of ethnic diversity.
Plus I’m about a 10 minute car ride from my doctor.

We’re also right on the BART. With the Senior Clipper Card getting into the city is pretty affordable.
Housing prices here are ridiculous compared to the rest of the country but probably pretty reasonable to you.
After staying in the middle of Manhattan for 3 weeks I decided that while I love cities, I’d rather be close to one rather than in one. So I understand where you are coming from.

[panache45]

The grass is always greener.

If you left SF, you’d be amazed at the number of things you’d miss.

[fedman]

@I_Love_Me_Vol.I

It might be to you but the rent prices in the two cities suggest otherwise.

but Chicago has more space for more housing, and has fewer rent restrictions, not to mention better commutes/transit

[peccavi]

@fedman

but Chicago has more space for more housing, and has fewer rent restrictions, not to mention better commutes/transit

“…The trouble with you Chicago people is, that you think you are the best people down here; whereas you are merely the most numerous…” - Mark Twain

[digs]

I love Chicago*, but if you can’t take a tough winter, this past one would’ve killed you.
*Tiny daughter: “I love living in [small town in Wisconsin]!”
Me: “Oh, that’s good. How come?”
Daughter: “Because we can always drive to a real city!”

Apparently she loved the many weekends we spent on Michigan Ave (Field Museum/Art Inst./Aquarium/Giordano’s Pizza/Graham Crackers Comics…)

[Celidin]

@peccavi

“…The trouble with you Chicago people is, that you think you are the best people down here; whereas you are merely the most numerous…” - Mark Twain

“What is it with people from Chicago that they’re so happy to have been born there? I meet so many people who can’t wait to tell me they’re from Chicago and when I meet them, they’re living anywhere but Chicago.”

– President Bartlet

[Two_Many_Cats]

@Celidin

“What is it with people from Chicago that they’re so happy to have been born there? I meet so many people who can’t wait to tell me they’re from Chicago and when I meet them, they’re living anywhere but Chicago.”

– President Bartlet

They must’ve moved to get away from those Chicagoans talking about how great Chicago is.

– Mike Nelson

[duality72]

Perhaps consider something north of the Bay in wine country, like Santa Rosa or Healdsburg?

[Roderick_Femm]

@duality72

Perhaps consider something north of the Bay in wine country, like Santa Rosa or Healdsburg?

There are more seasons up there, hot and cold.

I think my favorite idea so far was posted earlier, to move to one of the walkable small towns on the peninsula, like Burlingame (one example that springs to mind, I expect there are others with similar geography). Slightly warmer than the city sometimes, generally populated by bright shiny people (not a plus, but tolerable) and then I can just stay off of Nextdoor to avoid being discouraged by the ignorance and self-obsessions of my neighbors.

I mentioned in other posts at the time that I spent 12 months volunteering for the Civil Grand Jury in San Francisco, where we labored exploring various aspects of city government and recommending changes for the improvement of efficiency and effectiveness. All I discovered is how much I dislike the purposely byzantine labyrinth of departments and codes, the sole object of which is to frustrate meaningful citizen participation. Maybe a small town will be different.

[TroutMan]

If money was no object and I had the same priorities as you, I’d move to San Luis Obispo in a heartbeat. Perfect weather year-round, big enough to have some culture but not huge, and you can pee in the waterfall at the Madonna Inn.

[DrDeth]

@Roderick_Femm

…

I mentioned in other posts at the time that I spent 12 months volunteering for the Civil Grand Jury in San Francisco, where we labored exploring various aspects of city government and recommending changes for the improvement of efficiency and effectiveness. All I discovered is how much I dislike the purposely byzantine labyrinth of departments and codes, the sole object of which is to frustrate meaningful citizen participation. .

I did the same for Santa Clara county, and my experience was quite different. Once difference being is that SF politics are completely corrupt. Which is why I dont trust Newsom or Harris.

[Roderick_Femm]

@TroutMan

If money was no object and I had the same priorities as you, I’d move to San Luis Obispo in a heartbeat. Perfect weather year-round, big enough to have some culture but not huge, and you can pee in the waterfall at the Madonna Inn.

To be perfectly accurate, I said “pretend the cost of living is no object,” not that money was no object.

Having said that, a quick lookup on Zillow for homes for sale in SLO shows the home prices there are lower than here. I did drive through there once and stopped at a coffee shop for a driving break, and it seemed pretty mellow. Isn’t that a college town? Any “town vs. gown” conflict going on?

[TroutMan]

@Roderick_Femm

To be perfectly accurate, I said “pretend the cost of living is no object,” not that money was no object.

Having said that, a quick lookup on Zillow for homes for sale in SLO shows the home prices there are lower than here. I did drive through there once and stopped at a coffee shop for a driving break, and it seemed pretty mellow. Isn’t that a college town? Any “town vs. gown” conflict going on?

You’re right, SLO is cheaper than SF. It’s expensive compared to most other places.

I haven’t spent a lot of time there other than a couple day trips and stopping for lunch while passing through. The people I knew who went to school there loved the town and said they’d have stayed if there was a bigger job market. It is definitely mellow.

Cal Poly is right on the edge of town. I gather that the town vs. gown relations are like you’d expect in most college towns - some people are happy at what it does for the economy, some are pissed at what it does to housing prices and availability, and some just want those damn kids and their parties off their lawns. It didn’t feel like the university dominated the town, but I probably wouldn’t live on the side of town nearest the U.

I seem to remember a Doper who lives there now or did in the past. Assuming such a Doper exists, they could provide better info than my cursory knowledge.

[Gray_Ghost]

@TroutMan

You’re right, SLO is cheaper than SF. It’s expensive compared to most other places.

I haven’t spent a lot of time there other than a couple day trips and stopping for lunch while passing through. The people I knew who went to school there loved the town and said they’d have stayed if there was a bigger job market. It is definitely mellow.

Cal Poly is right on the edge of town. I gather that the town vs. gown relations are like you’d expect in most college towns - some people are happy at what it does for the economy, some are pissed at what it does to housing prices and availability, and some just want those damn kids and their parties off their lawns. It didn’t feel like the university dominated the town, but I probably wouldn’t live on the side of town nearest the U.

I seem to remember a Doper who lives there now or did in the past. Assuming such a Doper exists, they could provide better info than my cursory knowledge.

SLO—or really anyplace in coastal CA not on the water—is going to be warmer than downtown Ess Eff. Not hard to drive to the fog zone, but it does get toastier in the valleys. They grow wine grapes there. They don’t and really can’t in SF. Mountain tops are different and sunnier. See, e.g., Ridge Vineyards, So that might be an adjustment in a way that say, Cambria, San Simeon, or Morro Bay might not be.

What do you like about SF besides the gay-friendly atmosphere and the weather, Roderick? What hobbies and interests do you have? That might help us narrow things down.

[Spectre_of_Pithecanthropus]

@Two_Many_Cats

My last two bedroom apartment was less than that. And Chicago is ten times as desirable a city as San Francisco.

As much as I enjoy visiting the Metropolis of the Midwest, I’m going to have to disagree with you there!

[Roderick_Femm]

@Gray_Ghost

SLO—or really anyplace in coastal CA not on the water—is going to be warmer than downtown Ess Eff. Not hard to drive to the fog zone, but it does get toastier in the valleys. They grow wine grapes there. They don’t and really can’t in SF. Mountain tops are different and sunnier. See, e.g., Ridge Vineyards, So that might be an adjustment in a way that say, Cambria, San Simeon, or Morro Bay might not be.

What do you like about SF besides the gay-friendly atmosphere and the weather, Roderick? What hobbies and interests do you have? That might help us narrow things down.

A couple of things. First, thanks for the info about SLO. Second, gay-friendly atmosphere was one of my original reasons, it’s not so important any more. There are places I wouldn’t want to live because of that, but they are getting fewer, I think.

As for the rest, pretty much all of my hobbies and interests could be pursued just about anywhere. I might like to be able to afford a little more room to spread out, where I can reach the back yard without having to go through the house, and like that. SLO and places like it seem to fill that bill OK. One other thing springs to mind about SF, I like the fact that so many people there are from other countries and speak other languages – Chinese, Spanish, Russian, Tagalog, Greek, others I don’t recognize. I would probably lose that in a smaller town.

[Aspenglow]

I lived 20 years in San Luis Obispo County near Morro Bay, worked in downtown SLO.

It’s a lovely area and just about any climate can be had within the county. If you like the heat, as Troutman and Gray Ghost have mentioned, stick to the inland areas like Paso Robles, Atascadero and San Luis Obispo itself. If you prefer the moderate climate of between 55-70F, you’ll like Cambria, Cayucos, Morro Bay, Avila Beach, Pismo Beach and so on. There are other issues with those areas, however, primarily to do with water availability. E.g., very few new builds in Cambria.

San Luis Obispo itself is a charming, pretty, boutique-ey town where growth is tightly controlled. You are right about the lack of diversity compared to SF. You will definitely lose that in SLO County except for Hispanics, whose culture is well integrated there.

I think public transportation there is adequate, but I can’t really speak to it since I had to “commute” on Highway 1 from Morro Bay to San Luis Obispo and required a car for that.

For such a cow county, there is a respectable amount of culture there. Theater, opera, ballet, the Thursday Farmer’s Market… you can find enough to do if you’re inclined toward those things. After San Francisco, though, you’d probably find it all quite quaint.

The wine industry exploded during my time there and continues to grow. It’s a major part of the economy as is tourism in general. You get used to the tourists (as I’m sure you already are!) and are grateful they mostly haven’t figured out that the best time to be there is in the winter.

Restaurant quality in the whole area is excellent. You wouldn’t lack for lots of wonderful choices.

In general, people are friendly and helpful. They love that they get to live there.

If you want specific information, just sing out. I did love the area and although I am delighted with my choice to live in Oregon, I probably would not have left SLO if my then-living husband wasn’t keen to put some acreage around us. Personally, I wouldn’t go back now – but I suspect I’m more suited to a rural life than you.

[Gray_Ghost]

@Roderick_Femm

A couple of things. First, thanks for the info about SLO. Second, gay-friendly atmosphere was one of my original reasons, it’s not so important any more. There are places I wouldn’t want to live because of that, but they are getting fewer, I think.

As for the rest, pretty much all of my hobbies and interests could be pursued just about anywhere. I might like to be able to afford a little more room to spread out, where I can reach the back yard without having to go through the house, and like that. SLO and places like it seem to fill that bill OK. One other thing springs to mind about SF, I like the fact that so many people there are from other countries and speak other languages – Chinese, Spanish, Russian, Tagalog, Greek, others I don’t recognize. I would probably lose that in a smaller town.

You’ll find this weird if you’re not already here, but Houston is one of the most diverse places in the US. Culturally, politically, and culinary. You are surrounded by Texas though. Though you said it’s not that important to you now, but Houston has a thriving GLBTQ community, one of the larger Pride celebrations, and we just had two terms of a lesbian mayor. Not that anyone cared about her orientation. Taking traffic lanes away from downtown to put bike lanes on the other hand… Solidly blue county, has been for awhile, and now has the critical mass that straight ticket Democratic Party voting rules the day for city and county offices.

Not a climate for those who can’t stand heat though. OTOH, snow days you can number on one hand over the last decade. Also not really a place for someone who likes a lot of hiking or especially biking. The usual major city cultural opportunities though. Amazing museums/opera/ballet/sports teams.

Until recently—though who am I kidding, the land prices still don’t come close to the SF Bay Area or Monterey/Pebble—you could buy a lot of house in a decent area for not much money. A lot of your brethren have moved to Houston and changed that.

I’m trying to think of really diverse areas in CA that aren’t SF or LA. Drawing some blanks. I mean, last I checked you could hear Hmong and a variety of other SE Asian languages in Fresno, along with Spanish, of course, but why would you want to live there? Maybe Carmel, but see, ‘made of money to live there’. I certainly saw all sorts of people, and heard many different languages when I worked in the Del Monte Forest, a long time ago.

I loved the feeling and weather when I visited Mendocino and the Anderson Valley. Rural, lots of trails, the ocean nearby. Someone upthread mentioned Point Arena. Beautiful area, I can’t imagine it’s that expensive compared to SF.

[Reply]

How about Fairfax, CA? Not very far from SF, but far enough that it feels very different and still suburban/borderline rural. Lots of open space nearby for driving or whatnot, but close enough to Lyft/Uber into town if you need to.

If you’re willing to move 5 hours north, Humboldt County, CA has great quality of life (especially in Arcata) if you’re well off enough to retire here. Very few careers, sadly, so most people leave after college. Similar climate to San Francisco, very gay-friendly, lots more culture than a town of this size deserves. Ashland, OR is another place to consider, but it’s very rapidly gentrifying.

Also, wherever you are, it’s a good time to start lobbying cities to subsidize Lyft/Uber rides for elderly passengers to fill that gap in transit.

[Dangerosa]

We have this conversation all the time. Our kids are young adults (in college) and we can both do our jobs from anywhere (my husband is supposed to actually LIVE in the U.S. or taxes are messy for his employer). He likes Portland. I like the Asheville N.C. area (my husband doesn’t like Southern politics at all). But I think we will end up staying in the Twin Cities (but not the downtowns where you can take advantage of the previous mentioned human habitrails).