# Ghost in the Shell (2017) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [November 15, 2016, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghost-in-the-shell-2017/772055 "2016-11-15T15:09:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2017, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghost-in-the-shell-2017/772055/21 "2017-03-31T23:13:33Z")
Saw it. I give it 8/10 stars. I thought it was very faithful to the original film. I thought the biggest problem it has is the overly obvious and ham-fisted dialogue at the beginning letting us know what themes are going to be explored. It’s a problem with the original too, tho, so not unexpected. I thought Scarlett Johannson was okay in the role, but just okay. I didn’t realize she was so tiny before this. I thought Pilou Asbæk did a great job as Batou, as did Takeshi Kitano as Aramaki. The rest of the cast was adequate. The bad spot in the film was the terrible CGI work done during the spider tank battle, specifically the part where Major runs up falling concrete slabs. The sequence shows us the superhuman effort only she is capable of making, but the CGI is terribly done: it looks like a bad video game sequence and is reminiscent of the terrible work done in both _The Matrix Reloaded_ and _Blade 2_. It’s necessary footage but I’m sure the director will regret to the end of his days paying the people who did the work and having to include it in his final cut. Other than that, I thought this was a solid translation of the subject matter. They nailed the look perfectly and I thought the story was told well enough that it may interest people who don’t know much other than “Scarlett Johannson movie” that they will see more worth in the viewing and find things to talk about and so return to it again. I don’t think there’s much for a fan to be disappointed in with this live action movie; I know I’m not. ---
**Author:** ![eunoia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eunoia/32/97_2.png) [@eunoia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eunoia)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2017, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghost-in-the-shell-2017/772055/22 "2017-04-01T03:00:59Z")
Mo **to** ko. 😉 That said, I’m not a rabid fan but I saw it last night with lowered expectations and was pleasantly surprised. Some changes to the backstory or chronology bring up interesting speculation about the sequels, which I’m guessing are already planned so the changes should have some resolution. It was reasonably loyal to the source material and theme, so aside from one small special effect fail early on, I bought in. Avoiding the “whitewashing” controversy, Scarlett Johanssen is plenty enough attractive, heterochthonous, powerful (though a bit T-1000 in parts :D) and credible to carry this new franchise. Interested to hear what both superfans and GITS newbs have to say about this picture. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2017, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghost-in-the-shell-2017/772055/23 "2017-04-02T00:23:25Z")
And the Major… …is really Japanese after all, not that the reveal was that big of a surprise. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2017, 4:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghost-in-the-shell-2017/772055/24 "2017-04-02T04:33:17Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > The bad spot in the film was the terrible CGI work done during the spider tank battle, specifically the part where Major runs up falling concrete slabs. The sequence shows us the superhuman effort only she is capable of making, but the CGI is terribly done: it looks like a bad video game sequence and is reminiscent of the terrible work done in both _The Matrix Reloaded_ and _Blade 2_. It’s necessary footage but I’m sure the director will regret to the end of his days paying the people who did the work and having to include it in his final cut. I commented that to my Brother almost word by word. But yeah, I also do agree that otherwise it was a very good movie. And I am a big fan of the original work by Masamune Shirow. ---
**Author:** ![TYphoonSignal8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e99b99/32.png) [@TYphoonSignal8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TYphoonSignal8)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 3:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghost-in-the-shell-2017/772055/25 "2017-04-03T03:39:24Z")
Vanity Fair seems displeased with another example of Hollywood white-washing: [Is Ghost in the Shell the Nail in the Coffin of Hollywood Whitewashing? | Vanity Fair](http://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/2017/04/ghost-in-the-shell-box-office-whitewashing-bad-for-business) ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 4:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghost-in-the-shell-2017/772055/26 "2017-04-03T04:06:14Z")
> [@TYphoonSignal8](#): > > Vanity Fair seems displeased with another example of Hollywood white-washing: [Is Ghost in the Shell the Nail in the Coffin of Hollywood Whitewashing? | Vanity Fair](http://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/2017/04/ghost-in-the-shell-box-office-whitewashing-bad-for-business) Judging by the other articles, this is a particular area of concern for Vanity Fair. ---
**Author:** ![eunoia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eunoia/32/97_2.png) [@eunoia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eunoia)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 7:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghost-in-the-shell-2017/772055/27 "2017-04-03T07:39:57Z")
> [@TYphoonSignal8](#): > > [Is Ghost in the Shell the Nail in the Coffin of Hollywood Whitewashing? | Vanity Fair](http://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/2017/04/ghost-in-the-shell-box-office-whitewashing-bad-for-business) This article is a call to boycott to dumb people. Vanity Fair actually manufactures ignorance rather than fighting it. You can’t accept the article’s premise without being forced to agree that the Doctor Strange box office numbers indicate that movie fans are clamoring for **more** whitewashing. > **[Doctor Strange - Box Office Mojo](https://www.boxofficemojo.com/release/rl3076752897/)** Consider “What do _you_ think?”-type constructions a useful bullshit detector. Ghost In The Shell will certainly be profitable, which wouldn’t be anywhere as certain without Johanssen’s star power. ---
**Author:** ![eunoia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eunoia/32/97_2.png) [@eunoia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eunoia)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 7:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghost-in-the-shell-2017/772055/28 "2017-04-03T07:51:51Z")
If I haven’t succinctly made my case against Vanity Fair, consider the linked Box Office Mojo prediction being characterized as “conservative.” The author’s link is already broken, not realizing that BOM updates their pages. The pertinent prediction from March 30 is now here: ['Boss Baby' and 'Ghost in the Shell' Debut as 'Beauty and the Beast' Eyes Third Week at #1 - Box Office Mojo](http://www.boxofficemojo.com/news/?id=4279&p=.htm) and states: "As for the weekend’s two new releases, industry expectations project a mid-$20 million opening for Ghost in the Shell and a $30 million debut for Fox’s The Boss Baby, and while we aren’t expecting either to top Beauty, we are anticipating each will over perform against said expectations. There are three predictions in that sentence and the closest to how things turned out is the first one. There will be more Ghost In The Shell movies, that’s my prediction ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 8:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghost-in-the-shell-2017/772055/29 "2017-04-03T08:00:50Z")
> [@eunoia](#): > > Ghost In The Shell will certainly be profitable, which wouldn’t be anywhere as certain without Johanssen’s star power. But then, to the article writer’s point of view, giving non white actors opportunities to build that kind of “star power” is the entire point. ---
**Author:** ![eunoia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eunoia/32/97_2.png) [@eunoia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eunoia)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 8:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghost-in-the-shell-2017/772055/30 "2017-04-03T08:20:34Z")
> [@Leaper](#): > > But then, to the article writer’s point of view, giving non white actors opportunities to build that kind of “star power” is the entire point. I think it’s just envy. This certainly isn’t controversial in Japan, it’s an American thing and Americans aren’t the target market anymore. ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 8:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghost-in-the-shell-2017/772055/31 "2017-04-03T08:41:52Z")
> [@eunoia](#): > > I think it’s just envy. This certainly isn’t controversial in Japan, it’s an American thing and Americans aren’t the target market anymore. Exactly; if it is an American thing, then American cultural norms should be in play, and one side of that debate in America says that non white actors get few enough big role opportunities as it is without having roles originally written for their race being cast with white actors. Thus the discussion. ---
**Author:** ![TYphoonSignal8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e99b99/32.png) [@TYphoonSignal8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TYphoonSignal8)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 8:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghost-in-the-shell-2017/772055/32 "2017-04-03T08:42:50Z")
I entirely agree that there is no correlation between white actors case in Asian roles, and movies bombing at the box office. Vanity Fair has a thinly-veiled agenda which is not supported by facts. I do have sympathy for the argument that more up-and-coming Asian actors should be given a break in movies, true to the source material, by playing Asian characters. ---
**Author:** ![eunoia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eunoia/32/97_2.png) [@eunoia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eunoia)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 9:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghost-in-the-shell-2017/772055/33 "2017-04-03T09:02:27Z")
I meant the \*\*controversy \*\* about Motoko Kusanagi is an American thing, and being stirred up by people who don’t seem to know the source material. The Vanity fair article focusses on box office, but casting Scarlet Johanssen is unarguably the best choice for the final worldwide gross. I understand the debate and I’d go even further and say non white actors get too few opportunities period. This isn’t the thread for that. What I’m saying that Ghost In The Shell is not the smartest terrain to battle on. The Vanity Fair article was probably shelved when Doctor Strange was a smash success, but has almost nothing to do with Ghost In The Shell. ---
**Author:** ![leahcim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/b4bc9f/32.png) [@leahcim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leahcim)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghost-in-the-shell-2017/772055/34 "2017-04-03T15:04:55Z")
> [@eunoia](#): > > The Vanity Fair article was probably shelved when Doctor Strange was a smash success, but has almost nothing to do with Ghost In The Shell. Of course, the Doctor Strange character that was replaced with Tilda Swinton was kind of a racist caricature unto itself. It would have been almost as controversial to include the “wise old ancient Chinese master giving his wisdom to the mighty white hero who can use it better” trope as to omit it. The Major didn’t have that problem. ---
**Author:** ![DCnDC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dcndc/32/2842_2.png) [@DCnDC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DCnDC)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghost-in-the-shell-2017/772055/35 "2017-04-03T15:42:14Z")
Trailer for this ran before **Logan**. My main reaction to it was a scene in my head of a bunch of producers and writers in a meeting, brainstorming ideas about “how to get Scarlett Johansson to run around fighting people naked _without her actually being naked_.” ---
**Author:** ![leahcim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/b4bc9f/32.png) [@leahcim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leahcim)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghost-in-the-shell-2017/772055/36 "2017-04-03T16:07:05Z")
> [@DCnDC](#): > > …“how to get Scarlett Johansson to run around fighting people naked _without her actually being naked_.” Did the original stuff actually have her naked? I thought she was wearing a (skin tight) camo suit… or are you thinking of a different scene? ---
**Author:** ![DCnDC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dcndc/32/2842_2.png) [@DCnDC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DCnDC)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghost-in-the-shell-2017/772055/37 "2017-04-03T16:14:38Z")
> [@leahcim](#): > > Did the original stuff actually have her naked? I thought she was wearing a (skin tight) camo suit… or are you thinking of a different scene? I don’t remember what it was in the anime, but the skin-tight camo suit is what I was referring to. I realize they are actually following the source material, but the “how to get Scarlett Johansson to run around fighting people naked…” thing was just a humorous thought I had at the time. I imagine this fictional meeting ending with someone standing up and exclaiming, “I’ve got it: _Ghost in the Shell_!” . ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghost-in-the-shell-2017/772055/38 "2017-04-03T17:30:13Z")
For an android, how much distinction is there, really, between running around naked (with a skin with camouflage capabilities) and running around wearing a separate skintight suit with camouflage capabilities? ---
**Author:** ![leahcim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/b4bc9f/32.png) [@leahcim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leahcim)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghost-in-the-shell-2017/772055/39 "2017-04-03T17:45:43Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > For an android, how much distinction is there, really, between running around naked (with a skin with camouflage capabilities) and running around wearing a separate skintight suit with camouflage capabilities? “Clothing” is anything that comes off without a screwdriver. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2017, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghost-in-the-shell-2017/772055/40 "2017-04-03T18:31:57Z")
So, the Lego robots I’ve been helping middle-schoolers build consist entirely of clothing? 😉 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghost-in-the-shell-2017/772055.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghost-in-the-shell-2017/772055.md?page=3)