# Ghosts!?!?!? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [December 22, 2002, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghosts/144391 "2002-12-22T16:03:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![LennyG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/df788c/32.png) [@LennyG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LennyG)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2002, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghosts/144391/1 "2002-12-22T16:03:00Z")
I’ve heard that the Public Records Office of Great Britain has only one ghost Story accepted as authentic. It’s got something to do with a battle in the sky in the 1600’s. Can any body give me more info on this ---
**Author:** ![CC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f1d935/32.png) [@CC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CC)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2002, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghosts/144391/2 "2002-12-22T17:28:22Z")
Oh, please. There can be no ghost stories accepted as authentic as ghosts do not exist. Perhaps someone’s claim that they thought they saw something, etc. was accepted by some office. And by the way, in case anyone asks, angels don’t exist, either. ---
**Author:** ![Duck\_Duck\_Goose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/50afbb/32.png) [@Duck\_Duck\_Goose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duck_Duck_Goose)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2002, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghosts/144391/3 "2002-12-22T17:34:14Z")
Er, the Public Records office can probably have a ghost story registered as “authentic”–it may mean that it’s an “authentic ghost story”, meaning, it’s an actual ghost story stemming from the collective unconscious of a particular community and collected by a folklorist, as opposed to a ghost story written by an author somewhere. However, it certainly doesn’t mean that’s it’s registered as being “true”, or as “actually having happened”, because as CC points out, there are no such things as ghosts. I am not familiar with the factoid to which you refer. Got any other details? ---
**Author:** ![elfkin477](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a9a28c/32.png) [@elfkin477](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elfkin477)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2002, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghosts/144391/4 "2002-12-22T17:41:06Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by CC \* > \*\*Oh, please. There can be no ghost stories accepted as authentic as ghosts do not exist. Perhaps someone’s claim that they thought they saw something, etc. was accepted by some office. And by the way, in case anyone asks, angels don’t exist, either. \*\* Cite? ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2002, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghosts/144391/5 "2002-12-22T17:46:28Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Duck Duck Goose \* > **meaning, it’s an actual ghost story stemming from the collective unconscious of a particular community and collected by a folklorist, as opposed to a ghost story written by an author somewhere.** From the collective unconscious? Are you being serious? ---
**Author:** ![mister\_me](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/cdc98d/32.png) [@mister\_me](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mister_me)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2002, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghosts/144391/6 "2002-12-22T17:56:14Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by CC \* > \*\*Oh, please. There can be no ghost stories accepted as authentic as ghosts do not exist. Perhaps someone’s claim that they thought they saw something, etc. was accepted by some office. And by the way, in case anyone asks, angels don’t exist, either. \*\* You may want to re-think that. I’m not saying that I DO believe in ghosts (or angels), but they can be authenticated. Who has the power to do this, you ask? The Vatican. ---
**Author:** ![C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b2d939/32.png) [@C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/C_K_Dexter_Haven)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2002, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghosts/144391/7 "2002-12-22T17:58:29Z")
I think DDG is trying to distinguish (1) a story that has been passed down as tradition within a community, from long-forgotten sources, from (2) a story that has a clear and identifiable author. However, this is DDG’s interpretation of what an “authenticated” ghost story is. We’d need more info on what the UK Public Records viewed as “authenticated” at the time they accepted this story. And, of course, it would be interesting if someone could satifsy the OP’s question and determine what that story is. CC: \<\< And by the way, in case anyone asks, angels don’t exist, either. \>\> But angelology DOES exist, and has existed for over 2000 years, at least. (Consider this a plug for next week’s Staff Reports on angelology.) ---
**Author:** ![silverfish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e480ec/32.png) [@silverfish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silverfish)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2002, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghosts/144391/8 "2002-12-22T20:28:24Z")
I’ve had a look at the Public Records Office website, and it seems doubtful that authentification means anymore than that a record is a genuine historical document, rather than a forgery, rather than that it described a real event. The description of their function in the ‘about us’ bit, says: ---
**Author:** ![silverfish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e480ec/32.png) [@silverfish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silverfish)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2002, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghosts/144391/9 "2002-12-22T20:35:51Z")
I didn’t mean to post there. The quote should have been: > [@](#): > > The Public Record Office is the national archive of England, Wales and the United Kingdom. It brings together and preserves the records of central government and the courts of law, and makes them available to all who wish to consult them. This suggests their job is really to keep archives of historical documents (government and legal ones in particular) rather than to check whether they are true. This is only my interpretation though, the website is here, if you want to have a look for yourself: [http://www.pro.gov.uk/default.htm](http://www.pro.gov.uk/default.htm) ---
**Author:** ![samarm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/4da419/32.png) [@samarm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samarm)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2002, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghosts/144391/10 "2002-12-22T20:48:50Z")
> [@](#): > > ## Originally posted by elfkin477 quote: > > ## Originally posted by CC Oh, please. There can be no ghost stories accepted as authentic as ghosts do not exist. Perhaps someone’s claim that they thought they saw something, etc. was accepted by some office. And by the way, in case anyone asks, angels don’t exist, either. > > Cite? How can you expect CC to prove a negative - this doesn’t make sense. > [@](#): > > Originally posted by Mister me > I’m not saying that I DO believe in ghosts (or angels), but they can be authenticated. > > Who has the power to do this, you ask? > > The Vatican. Cite? **C K Dexter** : Does the fact that there is a area of study called Angelology therefore prove the existence of said Angels? (I’m ingorant to Angelology I admit, and I will read up on it, so don’t jump on me please). ---
**Author:** ![Dravin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/da6949/32.png) [@Dravin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dravin)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2002, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghosts/144391/11 "2002-12-22T21:36:30Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by CC \* > **Oh, please. There can be no ghost stories accepted as authentic as ghosts do not exist.** Actually even something false can be accepted as authentic. Note the word accepted in there? ---
**Author:** ![Duck\_Duck\_Goose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/50afbb/32.png) [@Duck\_Duck\_Goose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duck_Duck_Goose)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2002, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghosts/144391/12 "2002-12-22T21:42:04Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Revtim \* > \*\*From the collective unconscious? Are you being serious? \*\* Yeah. You got a problem with that? ---
**Author:** ![CC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f1d935/32.png) [@CC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CC)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2002, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghosts/144391/13 "2002-12-22T21:49:02Z")
elfkin - your post was a joke, right? ---
**Author:** ![Motog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85e7bf/32.png) [@Motog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Motog)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2002, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghosts/144391/14 "2002-12-22T23:28:15Z")
I think the points go to **Silverfish** on this one for doing the legwork ---
**Author:** ![Fuel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/df705f/32.png) [@Fuel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fuel)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2002, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghosts/144391/15 "2002-12-22T23:36:13Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by CC \* > \*\*Oh, please. There can be no ghost stories accepted as authentic as ghosts do not exist. Perhaps someone’s claim that they thought they saw something, etc. was accepted by some office. And by the way, in case anyone asks, angels don’t exist, either. \*\* would you bet your entire living families’ life on that statement? could you share this indisputable proof you have with us? ---
**Author:** ![samarm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/4da419/32.png) [@samarm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samarm)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2002, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghosts/144391/16 "2002-12-22T23:46:10Z")
(apologies to CC for stepping in here) > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Fuel \* > \*\*would you bet your entire living families’ life on that statement? could you share this indisputable proof you have with us? \*\* Why would CC want to bet his family on it? That’s not the point, surely. It happens that I agree with CC that ghosts and angels don’t exist. So, how can you expect proof that something doesn’t exist? Proving a negative is impossible. That’s like saying “Prove that pink and green stripey elephants don’t walk the streets at night”. I would ask you to prove your theory that they do exist - if they do exist then you should be able to provide evidence. ---
**Author:** ![Motog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85e7bf/32.png) [@Motog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Motog)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2002, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghosts/144391/17 "2002-12-22T23:51:46Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Fuel \* > \*\*would you bet your entire living families’ life on that statement? \*\* My family can make their own decisions. But I’d bet my own life on it any day. Already have in some respects - Don’t believe in angels, gods, heaven and hell so if I’m wrong I’m going to spend eternity with my arse on fire. \*\* > [@](#): > > could you share this indisputable proof you have with us? \*\* As already stated, it’s difficult to prove a negative. It is incumbent upon those who make the claim that there are ghosts and angels to prove that they exist. So far they have failed to do so. ---
**Author:** ![elfkin477](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a9a28c/32.png) [@elfkin477](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elfkin477)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2002, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghosts/144391/18 "2002-12-22T23:53:42Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by CC \* > \*\*elfkin - your post was a joke, right? \*\* No. It’s rather arrogant to completely dismiss something this controversal based on your opinion alone. So give us some cites that show how people concluded beyond a shadow of a doubt that ghosts don’t exist or allow people to speculate that they do without putting down their question. Nothing is added to the discussion if you only post to dismiss the possiblity out of hand. ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2002, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghosts/144391/19 "2002-12-23T00:21:07Z")
Though it may be impossible to prove the negative, it should be reasonably easy to post a good reason for your view, whatever that view may be. Credulity works both ways. I, for one, do not believe in green stripey elephants walking the streets around here because _previous experience and existing evidence_ leads me to this conclusion. But, they could just be hiding. At the PRO website **Silverfish** posted, afew searches based on words and dates in the OP have given me nothing. So far. Maybe I’m wording it wrong. ---
**Author:** ![stockton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5a626/32.png) [@stockton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/stockton)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2002, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghosts/144391/20 "2002-12-23T01:21:53Z")
I can categorically confirm that the ghost of a pink-and-green stripey elephant lives in my attic. I hope this helps, and feel free to cite me. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ghosts/144391.md?page=2)