# Ginger. What was IT? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [May 26, 2002, 8:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ginger-what-was-it/110898 "2002-05-26T08:09:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![honkytonkwillie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/3da27b/32.png) [@honkytonkwillie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/honkytonkwillie)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2002, 8:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ginger-what-was-it/110898/1 "2002-05-26T08:09:20Z")
Rather than bumping up [this](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=54669&highlight=bottled+and+hype) ancient link, I thought it better to start a new thread. So, what was IT? IT was some new revolutionary invention from Dean Kamen code named Ginger. The thread was hot for just two days and there was plenty of speculation on what IT was, focusing on Stirling engines, small fuel cells, or personal flying devices. What did I miss? ---
**Author:** ![Astroboy14](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/df705f/32.png) [@Astroboy14](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astroboy14)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2002, 9:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ginger-what-was-it/110898/2 "2002-05-26T09:02:17Z")
IT was a nifty little [device](http://www.segway.com.edgesuite.net/) for scooting about… I want one!🙂 ---
**Author:** ![istara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e79b87/32.png) [@istara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/istara)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2002, 10:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ginger-what-was-it/110898/3 "2002-05-26T10:54:59Z")
As yet, no major world cities have been planned around IT. Not even a village cycle path that I am aware of. ---
**Author:** ![Erroneous](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/71c47a/32.png) [@Erroneous](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Erroneous)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2002, 1:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ginger-what-was-it/110898/4 "2002-05-26T13:00:44Z")
Yeah, it was the Segway. It looks like a neat little thing, but we’ll just have to wait and see how revolutionary it is. Seems like it would be suited to rental, especially in places like zoos or museums (i.e. contained areas that are already built to accomodate wheelchairs). Dunno about every man and his dog actually owning one, though. Kamen’s still working on [stirling cycle engines](http://www.dekaresearch.com/coreTech.html). There’s a forum for discussing Kamen and Segway stuff over at [The It Question](http://www.theitquestion.com), but it seems to have gone pretty quiet recently. ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2002, 1:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ginger-what-was-it/110898/5 "2002-05-26T13:10:40Z")
I saw one of these things at the NY Auto Show, pretty neat, though the guy wasn’t really scooting around much. I could see these being used in lots of places where golf cart types of vehicles are used today. People often use golf carts to go from place to place because it’s too far to walk, too close to drive a car, perfect for Ginger. Around factories, security guards, even mail carriers could use them, especially if they can be fitted with a storage area. ---
**Author:** ![Beastal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a183cd/32.png) [@Beastal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beastal)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2002, 1:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ginger-what-was-it/110898/6 "2002-05-26T13:57:58Z")
How much are they? And how does IT keep its center of balance? ---
**Author:** ![yabob](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yabob/32/2821_2.png) [@yabob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yabob)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2002, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ginger-what-was-it/110898/7 "2002-05-26T14:26:20Z")
Heard a news item the other day that somebody had become the first person injured while riding a Segway. They appear to have been talking about this: [http://www.accessatlanta.com/ajc/metro/0502/03segway.html](http://www.accessatlanta.com/ajc/metro/0502/03segway.html) I’m not sure it really signifies anything, since some people are klutzy enough to wrench their knee tripping over the kitchen linoleum, but legislators are already in the act considering where and how these gadgets should be allowed. ---
**Author:** ![Una\_Persson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/una_persson/32/346_2.png) [@Una\_Persson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Una_Persson)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2002, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ginger-what-was-it/110898/8 "2002-05-26T14:40:05Z")
Great God, why was that news? A person hit a bump and fell off. So it warrants a whole article, including a dramatically-posed picture to go with it? I mean Jesus, you look at the pic, and it looks like they’re treating a gunshot wound. I hope, out of journalistic fairness, they now devote the same effort to reporting every bicycle, skateboard, and roller-blade accident. I knew this would happen with the Segway; I predicted it months ago. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2002, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ginger-what-was-it/110898/9 "2002-05-26T15:00:40Z")
The Segway may be one of the most over-hyped inventions of all time. It looks like something that would be useful in some niche markets, but as general transportation it’s horribly flawed. I won’t be replacing the car or the bicycle, and I predict that you’ll see more people on Roller Blades than you’ll see on Segways. I’ve heard that the factory is gearing up to crank out something like 40,000 Segways a month. If that’s true, then the company will go bankrupt, because they aren’t going to sell anywhere near that many of them. ---
**Author:** ![yabob](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yabob/32/2821_2.png) [@yabob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yabob)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2002, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ginger-what-was-it/110898/10 "2002-05-26T15:07:42Z")
To be fair, it probably rated some local reportage in Atlanta since a small number of the things were being used for city employees as an experiment, and the experiment had been well publicized. The fact that one such city employee had managed to injure himself falling off one is worth noting as a followup to the experiment. Over-dramatization of the incident is both unfortunate and inevitable. As to why it was picked up on the wires and noted on news radio in another area of the country? Well, do the words “slow news day” mean anything to you? ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2002, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ginger-what-was-it/110898/11 "2002-05-26T15:12:32Z")
For some reason (probably because I’m not fully awake yet) I got the mental image of fat Americans in Bermuda shorts, plaid shirts and straw hats, and with cameras hanging from their necks, riding Segways on hiking trails and forcing hikers out of their way. Probably influenced by this: > [@](#): > > _From “actual comments made by wilderness backpackers on U.S. Forest Service comment cards”_ > [ul] > [li]“Escalators would help on steep uphill sections.”[/li][li]“Trails need to be reconstructed. Please avoid building trails that go uphill.”[/li][li]“Chairlifts need to be in some places so that we can get to the wonderful views without having to hike to them.”[/ul][/li] ---
**Author:** ![Billy\_Rubin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/billy_rubin/32/3622_2.png) [@Billy\_Rubin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Billy_Rubin)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2002, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ginger-what-was-it/110898/12 "2002-05-26T15:28:13Z")
The 40,000 a month figure is a tad overinflated, by a few orders of magnitude. The company may go bankrupt, but not due to lack of sales; the major problem it is facing right now is the legality of powered vehicles on sidewalks. Nobody seems to want to let them share space with pedestrians, and that is the one major stumbling block Mr. Kamen is fighting right now. When that gets straightened out, look to see a lot of the little suckers. You will be able to see them in action in several places in the near future; a bunch of them will be used at the IMTS show in Chicago late this summer. ---
**Author:** ![evilhanz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ba8739/32.png) [@evilhanz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/evilhanz)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2002, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ginger-what-was-it/110898/13 "2002-05-26T15:28:13Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Johnny L.A. \* > \*\*Probably influenced by this: > \*\* Three comments by fools is hardly representative of actual wilderness backpackers who’d rather climb the steepest talus slope than stroll along a paved bicycle path. It’s more likely that those comments were made by yokels who can barely lug a cooler full of beer to the nearest roadside picnic area. About Segway. I live in the same town as Dean Kamen. The factory isn’t too far from here. We have police and mail carriers on Segways as well as a few greens downtown who ride them to work. There was a news article a few weeks ago about the local PD’s first Segway “bust”. Apparently a couple of officers were on parking enforcement detail to pay for our new civic center when they caught a couple of homeless drunks behind a prominent law firm. $6000 machines for this? The local authorities are always ready to bend over backwards for Kamen’s latest project. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2002, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ginger-what-was-it/110898/14 "2002-05-26T15:38:05Z")
> [@](#): > > Three comments by fools is hardly representative of actual wilderness backpackers who’d rather climb the steepest talus slope than stroll along a paved bicycle path. I think **evilhanz** has been [whooshed](http://rinkworks.com/said/forest.shtml)! 😛 The mental image I had lampooned people who would buy a Segway; not hikers. ---
**Author:** ![Drastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Drastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drastic)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2002, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ginger-what-was-it/110898/15 "2002-05-26T15:55:27Z")
I saw a light news article a few weeks back about a city (Atlanta, I think) who was going to try out Segways for beat cops–that’s a niche that makes a lot of sense to me. Hype is interesting stuff. ---
**Author:** ![evilhanz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ba8739/32.png) [@evilhanz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/evilhanz)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2002, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ginger-what-was-it/110898/16 "2002-05-26T15:55:38Z")
Consider me whooshed. 🙂 I’m always a little blinded when my favorite pasttime is maligned. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2002, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ginger-what-was-it/110898/17 "2002-05-26T16:32:17Z")
Like I said, the Segway is a decent product for a niche market. I can see them being useful in large factories, on military bases and campuses, for police foot patrols, and for mail carriers. But as general transportation? Never. First of all, they will NOT be allowed on sidewalks for long unless their speed is limited to walking speed. Kamen has tried to claim that being his by a Segway is like being hit by a pedestrian - yeah, it’s like being hit by a pedestrian going a full run with a 65 lb steel bar held out in front of him, and with a steel plate at ankle-breaking height. If you put these things on sidewalks in large amounts, and let them go significantly faster than walking speed, there will be carnage. Then they’ll be banned, or governor-limited to walking speed, in which case they will be useless other than for handicapped people. Then there’s the liability. People will fall off of these things. And if they are used as general transportation some of those falls will be off of narrow paths, stairwells, and other places. I’m just waiting for the first person to drag one up a flight of stairs, get on it at the top, accidentally lean back, and go backwards right down the stairs again with their Segway on top of them. And where are you going to keep your Segway at work? Good rule of thumb: If your employer won’t let you drag your bicycle into your office, he probably won’t let you drag your Segway in. How about theft? Is there anyone here who wants to ride a $6000 Segway through just about any neighborhood late at night? How about shopping, or restaraunts? How can you stop for a bite to eat on your Segway? Going to leave a $6000 machine outside while you eat? I guarantee you the restaraunt won’t let you park it at your table. How about elevators? Yes, a Segway can be ridden into an elevator. But how do you manoever one in and out in a crowd? how many ankles have to get banged or toes driven over before buildings start putting up signs saying, “No Segways in elevator”? Then the things are useless in the most congested places. The Segway is a perfect example of a piece of equipment that is brilliantly engineered, but designed with a complete lack of regard for the mundane details that will make it impractical as general transportation. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2002, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ginger-what-was-it/110898/18 "2002-05-26T16:33:21Z")
That should have said, “Being HIT by a Segway”, not “Being his by a Segway” ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2002, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ginger-what-was-it/110898/19 "2002-05-26T21:20:45Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Johnny L.A. \* > For some reason (probably because I’m not fully awake yet) I got the mental image of fat Americans in Bermuda shorts, plaid shirts and straw hats, and with cameras hanging from their necks, riding Segways on hiking trails and forcing hikers out of their way. So, **Johnny,** having fun driving your SUV down to the neighborhood supermarket this weekend? 😉 Personally, I think the Segway has promise. I wouldn’t use one for commuting or long trips, but I can easily see myself using one on weekends, which often consist of running a half-dozen errands at stores that are within a three-mile radius of my house. Biggest problem right now is the price. ---
**Author:** ![GeorgeAECF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9f8e36/32.png) [@GeorgeAECF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GeorgeAECF)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2002, 4:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ginger-what-was-it/110898/20 "2002-05-27T04:39:36Z")
Not only sharing sidewalk space is a concern, but, sharing road space is another… who want to get stuck behind some dude pullin’ 15MPH? The niche market for this thing is so niche you’ll need a niche place for it to be useful. I don’t see why someone would buy this thing when they could buy a motorcycle or a motor-scooter. It would be cheaper, easier to get parts, and, most models can even attain satisfactory highway speeds. Or, hey, even a moped! Certainly cheaper, can do upto 35MPH, no license (usually), and you can take it on to local roads. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ginger-what-was-it/110898.md?page=2)