# Give Me an Example of Conservative Political Fiction **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 7, 2013, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-me-an-example-of-conservative-political-fiction/646397 "2013-01-07T21:21:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Icerigger](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/icerigger/32/432_2.png) [@Icerigger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Icerigger)\ **Post date:** [January 7, 2013, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-me-an-example-of-conservative-political-fiction/646397/21 "2013-01-07T23:46:22Z")
[QUOTE=smiling bandit] Geez, I dunno. Maybe Lord of the Rings? Maybe? [/QUOTE] David Brin agrees. > **[J.R.R. Tolkien -- enemy of progress](https://www.salon.com/2002/12/17/tolkien_brin/)** > > "The Lord of the Rings" is lovingly crafted, seductive -- and profoundly backward-looking. Why not look at things through the Dark Lord's eye for a change? ---
**Author:** ![gaffa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e68b1a/32.png) [@gaffa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gaffa)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2013, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-me-an-example-of-conservative-political-fiction/646397/22 "2013-01-08T00:13:41Z")
> [@Lynn\_Bodoni](#): > > What what what? Read most of Heinlein’s works, specifically _The Moon is a Harsh Mistress_, which is worth reading no matter what your politics are. Read Pournelle’s works, if you can. There are any number of speculative fiction writers who are conservative and write about how the world would be better if everyone was conservative, and the Evils of Liberalism. I wouldn’t call either of them conservative, if we use Goldwater’s definition of the term. Heinlein was a libertarian, and Pournelle - shit, I don’t know _what_ Pournelle’s rather pathetic brand of chicken-hawk militarism could be termed. Update: I checked. His Wikipedia article says he served, but there are not references to confirm it. ---
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2013, 12:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-me-an-example-of-conservative-political-fiction/646397/23 "2013-01-08T00:14:58Z")
[Just remembered a really good example that I already ranted about.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=581616) ---
**Author:** ![YogSothoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/8edcca/32.png) [@YogSothoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YogSothoth)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2013, 12:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-me-an-example-of-conservative-political-fiction/646397/24 "2013-01-08T00:24:54Z")
This will end well. ---
**Author:** ![Grey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b782af/32.png) [@Grey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grey)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2013, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-me-an-example-of-conservative-political-fiction/646397/25 "2013-01-08T00:39:38Z")
Typical liberal thinking. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2013, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-me-an-example-of-conservative-political-fiction/646397/26 "2013-01-08T00:56:57Z")
Pretty much anything by John Ringo. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2013, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-me-an-example-of-conservative-political-fiction/646397/27 "2013-01-08T01:06:19Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > **astorian** , to argue that _1984_ is an example, you’d have to first argue that the society depicted is a liberal one. I would tend to argue the opposite, if anything. I think Huxley’s _Brave New World_ is a better example of a liberal dystopia (i.e. closer to what conservatives would think liberalism run amok would look like). ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2013, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-me-an-example-of-conservative-political-fiction/646397/28 "2013-01-08T01:18:08Z")
> [@pravnik](#): > > [Agenda 21](http://www.amazon.com/dp/1476716692) and [The Overton Window](http://www.amazon.com/The-Overton-Window-Glenn-Beck/dp/1451625286/ref=pd_sim_b_6/183-7604297-5920303) by Glenn Beck. Or not. I know _The Overton Window_ [was ghostwritten](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/chris-kelly/glenn-becks-new-novel-abo_b_613861.html) – not only that, but the ghostwriter simply took a book he had recently self-published and changed the political POV around. > [@](#): > > But mostly _The Overton Window_ resembles a pretty feeble self-published 2005 techno-thriller called _Circumference of Darkness._ > > Except for one thing: In _Circumference of Darkness,_ the villains planning the next 9/11 are an ultra-right militia movement. In Overton Window, the right wing nuts are the _heroes._ > > \ > > So why – except for the completely inverted politics – does _The Overton Window_ read so much like _Circumference of Darkness?_ Because they were written by the same guy, a 52-year-old computer programmer named Jack Henderson. > > He gets sole credit on _Circumference._ (And why shouldn’t he? He published it himself.) On _Overton,_ he gets thanked by Beck for “pouring his heart and soul into this project.” > > And, apparently, his leftover plot. [_The Overton Window_](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Overton_Window) [_Circumference of Darkness_](http://www.amazon.com/Circumference-Darkness-Jack-Henderson/dp/0553589806/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1357607635&sr=1-1&keywords=circumference+of+darkness) Turns out [_Agenda 21_ was ghostwritten too,](http://www.popsci.com/environment/article/2012-12/what-does-climate-scientist-think-glenn-becks-environmental-conspiracy-novel) by one Harriet Parke – but, at least this time the ghostwriter [got her name on the cover.](http://www.amazon.com/Agenda-21-Glenn-Beck/dp/1476716692/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1357607718&sr=1-1&keywords=harriet+parke) ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2013, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-me-an-example-of-conservative-political-fiction/646397/29 "2013-01-08T01:23:49Z")
> [@gaffa](#): > > I wouldn’t call either of them conservative, if we use Goldwater’s definition of the term. Heinlein was a libertarian, and Pournelle - shit, I don’t know _what_ Pournelle’s rather pathetic brand of chicken-hawk militarism could be termed. Having read nearly everything he has written, and having heard him speak on political topics at SF cons (mainly about how Americans no longer live in a “republic” because the federal government has grown so intrusive), and having occasionally perused his [blog,](http://www.jerrypournelle.com/) I would characterize Pournelle as [paleoconservative.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paleoconservative) In fact, he appears to be that rarest of all creatures, a paleocon with a brain. (Which brain recently had a cancerous tumor, BTW, but apparently it has responded to treatment.) He **was** paleocon, anyway – I recall him espousing isolationism to the point of America pulling out of NATO. He seems to have turned in a more neocon direction since 9/11, though. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2013, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-me-an-example-of-conservative-political-fiction/646397/30 "2013-01-08T01:24:31Z")
> [@gaffa](#): > > I would think that conservatives, by definition, wouldn’t be writing speculative fiction about their political ideal, assuming that they think that what we have, or had in the not too distant past, is ideal. That would just mean that they’d write about society being dragged back to their ideal. Although in reality despite the name conservatives aren’t about conserving anything; they are about drastic change. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2013, 1:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-me-an-example-of-conservative-political-fiction/646397/31 "2013-01-08T01:31:46Z")
I haven’t read Orson Scott Card’s [_Empire_](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Empire_(2006_novel)) or [_Hidden Empire,_](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hidden_Empire) but I have read the jacket-blurbs and, going by that, I think they might fit the OP’s bill. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2013, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-me-an-example-of-conservative-political-fiction/646397/32 "2013-01-08T01:33:51Z")
> [@gaffa](#): > > I would think that conservatives, by definition, wouldn’t be writing speculative fiction about their political ideal, assuming that they think that what we have, or had in the not too distant past, is ideal. You would be mistaken. The present, or the past, distant or recent, is not what **modern American** conservatism [is about.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=15873414&postcount=22) ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2013, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-me-an-example-of-conservative-political-fiction/646397/33 "2013-01-08T01:38:14Z")
> [@](#): > > Quoth **Boozahol Squid, P.I.** : > > The society depicted [in _1984_] is a hypersocialized state dedicated to fairness by means of reduction to the lowest common denominator. Are you sure you’re thinking of the same book? The state in _1984_ is quite explicitly dedicated to _unfairness_, and society is by design rigidly stratified. ---
**Author:** ![Spoke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e57/32.png) [@Spoke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoke)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2013, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-me-an-example-of-conservative-political-fiction/646397/34 "2013-01-08T01:46:08Z")
_The Dark Knight_. An apologia for the Bush administration’s war on terror. _The Incredible_s. Syndrome is like a conservative caricature of liberal thought. “When everyone is super, no one will be!” ---
**Author:** ![PatriotGrrrl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/9dc877/32.png) [@PatriotGrrrl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatriotGrrrl)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2013, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-me-an-example-of-conservative-political-fiction/646397/35 "2013-01-08T01:46:45Z")
[Lipidleggin’](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lipidleggin%27) ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2013, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-me-an-example-of-conservative-political-fiction/646397/36 "2013-01-08T02:12:24Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Are you sure you’re thinking of the same book? The state in _1984_ is quite explicitly dedicated to _unfairness_, and society is by design rigidly stratified. Well, it’s a parody on Stalinism, not on anything we would now call “liberalism” or even “socialism.” ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2013, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-me-an-example-of-conservative-political-fiction/646397/37 "2013-01-08T02:15:04Z")
> [@PatriotGrrrl](#): > > [Lipidleggin’](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lipidleggin%27) Sounds much like the plot in “The Contraband Cow,” by L. Sprague de Camp (1942). (A democratic international federation, including the U.S. and the old British Empire, is politically dominated by India by sheer force of numbers, so beef is illegal (sacred cows, y’know) and a black market emerges.) ---
**Author:** ![smiling\_bandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2013, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-me-an-example-of-conservative-political-fiction/646397/38 "2013-01-08T02:33:57Z")
Ooh, ooh I suppose you could count Terry Goodkind under the “Randian” heading. It depends on what you mean by Conservative, but still. ---
**Author:** ![Reyemile](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/46a35a/32.png) [@Reyemile](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reyemile)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2013, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-me-an-example-of-conservative-political-fiction/646397/39 "2013-01-08T02:38:56Z")
The character Honor Harrington never struck me as particularly conservative, but every novel I’ve read in the series has had at least one strawman liberal giving her trouble. And I recall one of the massive plots she foiled be ultimately motivated by an intergalactic empire needing more money to pay for its welfare system. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2013, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-me-an-example-of-conservative-political-fiction/646397/40 "2013-01-08T02:39:16Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Well, it’s a parody on Stalinism, not on anything we would now call “liberalism” or even “socialism.” Well, not anything _I_ would call liberalism, but I’ve heard plenty of rightwingers try to equate liberals and communists. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-me-an-example-of-conservative-political-fiction/646397.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-me-an-example-of-conservative-political-fiction/646397.md?page=3)