# Give the guy a break! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 23, 2006, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-the-guy-a-break/349620 "2006-03-23T18:36:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2006, 1:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-the-guy-a-break/349620/81 "2006-03-24T13:33:50Z")
“Coon” apparantly used to be a very common racial slur. But even 40 some odd years ago, when I first ever heard it, it had to be explained to me. Because already by that time it wasn’t as common, at least not where I lived. (While the N word was common enough to be used in kid’s games.) When I asked my grandma why she called the black guy a coon, she answered that they were both black and they stole your stuff at night. Thanks, Grandma :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2006, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-the-guy-a-break/349620/82 "2006-03-24T15:07:16Z")
> [@This space intentionally blank](#): > > I call this “The Number Three” effect. (note: “Number Three” has a huge mole on his face) > > I think that this is exactly what happened to **Dave Lenihan**. He shouldn’t be fired for it. I think I understand where you’re coming from, but that particular defense doesn’t really put Lenihan in the best light. Why would “coon” be something that he is trying hard not to say? Doesn’t that reveal some kind of ugliness inside of him? ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2006, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-the-guy-a-break/349620/83 "2006-03-24T15:20:06Z")
> [@Hentor the Barbarian](#): > > This is what I was getting at above. It’s like the “don’t look at his mole” phenomenon (moley moley moley). I remember having an awkward discussion with a guy in a wheelchair about an ethical lapse of his. I was suggesting a potential way of handling the matter that would result in his being in a more defensible position, and so of course I said, “…and then you’ll definitely have a leg to stand on.” In fact, I was having difficulty mentally avoiding such turns of phrase the whole time. I have several blind friends and they say things like “oh, now I see it” (for ‘understand’) the whole time. There’s a limit between being PC and castrating the language. ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2006, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-the-guy-a-break/349620/84 "2006-03-24T15:53:10Z")
> [@you with the face](#): > > I think I understand where you’re coming from, but that particular defense doesn’t really put Lenihan in the best light. Why would “coon” be something that he is trying hard not to say? Doesn’t that reveal some kind of ugliness inside of him? Yeah, do we really want one of _those_ people working for us? They’re all right _in their place_, is all I’m saying. Nobody here is advocating violence. Just basic, common sense. Absolutely nothing wrong with them. ---
**Author:** ![descamisado](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e480ec/32.png) [@descamisado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/descamisado)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2006, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-the-guy-a-break/349620/85 "2006-03-24T16:12:53Z")
> [@Otto](#): > > Reminds me of my very own personal racial mental meltdown. I was about 14, playing a game of chess with the African-American boyfriend of a friend of my mom’s. He reneged on a move and I good-naturedly called him on it but let him take it back. A couple minutes later my mom came up and asked who was winning and I said “the reneger,” which came out sounding like something much nastier. > > Tim Dorsey is a gi-normous pussy. This didn’t really happen, that’s such a white lie, errr, I mean lie, I mean . . . Oh, never mind, it was funny anyway. 😃 I’m black and I don’t think the incident as described merited his being fired. We all do it, say the thing that mentally we’re admonishing outselves not to say. Reminds of the episode of “The Golden Girls” in which Blanche had a blind date, I with a blind man, I mean a _date_ with a blind man. All three, Blanche, Rose and Dorothy, kept making remarks that you know they had been telling themselves not to make. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2006, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-the-guy-a-break/349620/86 "2006-03-24T16:25:22Z")
Assuming this is all what it appears to be and not a guy who got himself fired on purpose… > [@Excalibre](#): > > Does the guy not see the logical problem here? How can something be both reprehensible and accidental? It’s not a direct contradiction, but I agree with you. Dorsey’s comments are stupid, but that might be just because he’s exoected to say that. “Unacceptable?” The guy knew that and apologized. “Reprehensible?” Racism is reprehensible. Saying the wrong thing, not necessarily quite so much. “Unforgivable?” You’ve got to be kind of a douche not to forgive somebody for what you know was a slip of the tongue. ---
**Author:** ![Green\_Bean](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/green_bean/32/1760_2.png) [@Green\_Bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Green_Bean)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2006, 3:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-the-guy-a-break/349620/87 "2006-03-25T03:41:02Z")
Another example of someone blurting out something that they’re trying really hard not to say–from Wayne’s World 2. Wayne and Garth are at city hall or someplace, trying to get a permit for their big concert. The guy at the desk has one weird looking eye. From IMDB: \*Jerry Segel: What? Is something wrong? Wayne: What do you mean? Jerry Segel: It’s my eye, isn’t it. Garth: Why would we want to look at your eye? Is there something wrong with that…weird…eye? Jerry Segel: There’s nothing wrong with my eye. This one just has no pigment. I’m what you call a partial ocular albino, but I’m fine with it. I have perfect 20/20 vision with both eyes. You’re serious about putting on a rock concert? Wayne: Are you kidding? I’d give my right eye. Jerry Segel: You realise there are certain jurisdictions you’ll need to follow. Garth: I’d like to think I have an eye for details. \* And my favorite: \*Wayne: We’ll be sure to cross our "t"s and dot our… lower case "j"s. \* ---
**Author:** ![LawMonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/d6d6ee/32.png) [@LawMonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LawMonkey)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2006, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-the-guy-a-break/349620/88 "2006-03-25T15:17:25Z")
> [@ultrafilter](#): > > Aren’t there new FCC rules that translate into major fines for broadcasting offensive material? Could this have something to do with that? To the best of my knowledge, and unless they’ve been changed recently, the FCC regs aren’t interested in racial slurs; their definition of ‘offensive’ is limited to references sexual and excretory. As an example, I know for a fact that the radio host ‘Lionel’ (who was ever so much more interesting before he went to the liberal talk format) has, in the context of discussing the word itself, used the n-word on air. So have a few of his callers, IIRC. His show does air after 10pm, though, so perhaps rules are more lax. As regards the poor schmuck who slipped on air–Condi ought to take advantage of this by publicly accepting the guy’s apology and forgiving him. It’d look very good politically… ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2006, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-the-guy-a-break/349620/89 "2006-03-25T16:05:26Z")
And later this summer, we see this billboard all over St. Louis: \*\*What will he say _this_ time? Talk show host Dave Lenihan Noon weekdays - 1420 KOON/AM\*\* Yeah, I’m just cynical… :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2006, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-the-guy-a-break/349620/90 "2006-03-25T16:35:22Z")
> [@Stephe96](#): > > Then again, I work in radio. It’s a brutal business. And it could be that the station managers didn’t like the guy and wanted to get rid of him anyway…a slip-up like this gives them a perfect cover. I listen to that station’s afternoon drive guy and from what I hear they’ve been doing some housecleaning lately. Mr. Lenihan just got himself added to the pile. ---
**Author:** ![Stratocaster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stratocaster/32/16393_2.png) [@Stratocaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stratocaster)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2006, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-the-guy-a-break/349620/91 "2006-03-25T17:05:02Z")
> [@Sequent](#): > > Reprehensible: deserving of rebuke or censure; blameworthy. Whether or not it’s intentional has nothing to do with it. If I shoot someone in the face by accident, would I escape blame or rebuke because it was an accident? If you shot someone in the face by accident, I’ll assume you weren’t as careful as you should have been. To deliberately behave in a manner that risks another person’s life certainly has a certain blame associated with it. Unlike, say, a slip of the tongue. Unless, of course, this guy deliberately took a pill that makes one prone to making racial slurs. In which case, your analogy holds up. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2006, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-the-guy-a-break/349620/92 "2006-03-25T17:50:36Z")
> [@Lute Skywatcher](#): > > > [@Stephe96](#): > > > > Then again, I work in radio. It’s a brutal business. And it could be that the station managers didn’t like the guy and wanted to get rid of him anyway…a slip-up like this gives them a perfect cover. > > I listen to that station’s afternoon drive guy and from what I hear they’ve been doing some housecleaning lately. Mr. Lenihan just got himself added to the pile. Correction: I listen to a competing station’s afternoon drive guy who used to be that station’s afternoon drive guy. ---
**Author:** ![Stephe96](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Stephe96](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stephe96)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2006, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-the-guy-a-break/349620/93 "2006-03-25T18:14:02Z")
For what it’s worth, someone who has actually heard the broadcast in question says that there is no way it just a ‘slip of the tongue’ here. He says it’s obvious that the host is having a lot of fun with the ‘coon’ comment and sounds like he knows exactly what he’s saying. He says the transcript does not reflect the tone of his words. I have yet to hear the tape myself…but if this is true then I retract my previous comments. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2006, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-the-guy-a-break/349620/94 "2006-03-25T19:01:29Z")
[Here’s a blog with the clip that got Lenihan fired.](http://acephalous.typepad.com/) The bit that’s been quoted in the AP stories begins at about the 30 second mark. Something new to argue about, anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Stratocaster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stratocaster/32/16393_2.png) [@Stratocaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stratocaster)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2006, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-the-guy-a-break/349620/95 "2006-03-25T23:28:39Z")
Sounded like a slip of the tongue to me. And actually, it doesn’t make any sense otherwise. If he was pandering to racists, I think the apology–which has not the least bit of sarcasm, to my ear–would have been a bit of a non sequitur. Besides, if the man has no record of such nonsense, if says it was a slip of the tongue, why wouldn’t we believe him? ---
**Author:** ![GuanoLad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guanolad/32/42_2.png) [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2006, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-the-guy-a-break/349620/96 "2006-03-25T23:44:41Z")
Sounds like a genuine mistake to me. Though the laughing in his voice at the end wasn’t a good thing. ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2006, 1:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-the-guy-a-break/349620/97 "2006-03-26T01:59:17Z")
So obviously a slip of the tongue. As for the laughter at the end, it sounded like “I’m an idiot” nervous laughter, not anything spiteful or malicious. Firing him was a total over-reaction. > [@kunilou](#): > > Because sniggering idiots tie up the phone lines to radio talk shows and keep an innocent mistake going for hours or days. As opposed to firing him for no good reason, which has kept this going for days. > [@kunilou](#): > > No, I don’t have evidence and yes, I am repeating rumors which may or may not be baseless. That’s why I said “rumors.” This is The Pit, not Great Debates. But considering that the station participated in a publicity stunt a couple of weeks ago, I don’t put it past them, either. So because of the forum, it’s OK to spread rumors? Isn’t spreading rumors in any forum kind of not what these boards are about? ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2006, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-the-guy-a-break/349620/98 "2006-03-26T03:00:41Z")
> [@Otto](#): > > So because of the forum, it’s OK to spread rumors? Isn’t spreading rumors in any forum kind of not what these boards are about? I was adding a point of speculation that I had not seen discussed in the forum before. But rather than claim any particular point of view myself, I’ll just link to [this St. Louis blog](http://www.stltoday.com/blogs/news-talk-of-the-day/2006/03/a-slip-of-the-tongue-or-a-hint-to-a-belief/comment-page-1/#comments) so everyone can read what the locals are saying without it being filtered through me. ---
**Author:** ![Askia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/96bed5/32.png) [@Askia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Askia)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2006, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-the-guy-a-break/349620/99 "2006-03-26T21:02:05Z")
I see both the rationale of the station’s actions and the appeal for clemency. Based on what I’ve heard so far, I don’t believe this man was a bigot and I hope some intervention in his job prospects materializes. It’d be nice, if unlikely, if the station reversed its firing. It’d be nicer if Condoleeza got involved. (If even more unlikely.) ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2006, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-the-guy-a-break/349620/100 "2006-03-26T21:58:57Z")
> [@Askia](#): > > It’d be nice, if unlikely, if the station reversed its firing. > > It’d be nicer if Condoleeza got involved. (If even more unlikely.) The station has picked his replacement. It’s one of the announcers who was fired to make way for the new team. [http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/columnists.nsf/debpeterson/story/C7485894DA7C95618625713C00251D5A?OpenDocument](http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/columnists.nsf/debpeterson/story/C7485894DA7C95618625713C00251D5A?OpenDocument) And Rice has accepted the announcer’s apology. > **[Kansas City Breaking News & Sports | The Kansas City Star](https://www.kansascity.com/)** [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-the-guy-a-break/349620.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-the-guy-a-break/349620.md?page=6)