# Give your opinion on something (mom wants to pass out "church cards" at Halloween) \[update\] **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [October 18, 2016, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-your-opinion-on-something-mom-wants-to-pass-out-church-cards-at-halloween-update/768908 "2016-10-18T01:19:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![Doctor\_Jackson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doctor_jackson/32/32_2.png) [@Doctor\_Jackson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doctor_Jackson)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2016, 1:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-your-opinion-on-something-mom-wants-to-pass-out-church-cards-at-halloween-update/768908/141 "2016-10-28T13:43:11Z")
It seems to me that parents today have the same choice as I did when my kids were ToT age: 1. let your kids go to the houses of strangers and accept that they may hand out stuff that doesn’t meet your approval; or 2. only let your kids go to the houses of people you know and trust to only hand out things that you approve of. Not everyone in the world (or, most likely, in your neighborhood) sees things the way you do. Use those experiences as teaching moments and get on with life. ---
**Author:** ![Corry\_El](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ecae2f/32.png) [@Corry\_El](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Corry_El)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2016, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-your-opinion-on-something-mom-wants-to-pass-out-church-cards-at-halloween-update/768908/142 "2016-10-28T14:12:30Z")
> [@The\_King\_of\_Soup](#): > > I’m an atheist, and not pro-church in the least, but unless your mother’s church has some hidden agenda I don’t have a problem with this. A lot of the responses seem to assume that, like it’s a ‘free presentation with gift’ by somebody selling time share condo’s and they basically aren’t going to let you out of the room till you buy one. But that’s speculative, highly unlikely IME of ‘church’, which is pretty much strictly Catholic. I’m as ignorant as a lot of atheists are about what really goes on at Protestant churches but at least I admit I am, rather than making stuff up or basing it on fictional TV or movies from my subconscious. 🙂 When there’s a movie night at our parish, they just show a movie, some regular G/PG type movie; sometimes they show a particular classic movie in which the church building appears, sometimes it might have a religious theme but some well known flick where everyone knows that. There is in fairness an ‘agenda’ in the non-negative sense, of showing a friendly community: perhaps people might at some point think further about joining (or rejoining) it. But somebody getting up and telling non-believers they are going to hell…probability zero. I have to think in the vast majority of cases the same would apply for a Protestant church’s movie night, even the ‘evangelical’ kind, and can’t see it as reasonable to just assume it would be some high pressure sales pitch. But part of Christian belief is to spread the Word, though with differences in method and emphasis (and always accounting for the particularly vast differences in what Protestants believe AFAICT, which seems can down almost to what any particular person wants to believe that they say is based on Christianity, but fine with me). I don’t see how that can be directly compared to people who don’t believe anything, where by definition there’s no directive within the non-existent belief to do anything about it. I used to work with a guy who actually brought literature to work that was not only pro-Protestant but explicitly anti-Catholic, not a bad guy, just had it there, I leafed through a few from curiosity, the big deal is what exactly? So hard to see, just from my POV, somebody really justified in getting bent out of shape about a flyer for a church movie night. But we live now in a _very_ touchy society, and I personally would not hand out movie night flyers from my home. ---
**Author:** ![muldoonthief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muldoonthief/32/3188_2.png) [@muldoonthief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/muldoonthief)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2016, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-your-opinion-on-something-mom-wants-to-pass-out-church-cards-at-halloween-update/768908/143 "2016-10-28T14:22:18Z")
If a 59 year old in costume showed up, I’d think “What the hell” and give her candy. No costume, I might give her something just to not make a scene and get her to leave, but it would be the crappiest candy I could find in the bowl, like a mini roll of Necco wafers. ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2016, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-your-opinion-on-something-mom-wants-to-pass-out-church-cards-at-halloween-update/768908/144 "2016-10-28T16:16:19Z")
> [@Dangerosa](#): > > So, how would you guys feel about Amway flyers being dropped into the bag along with candy? Or “Hey kids, give this flyer to Mom and Dad and I can help them plan for college. Your neighbor, Edward Jones salesperson?” I mean, do the kids really care? I remember sorting my candy into piles and anything that wasn’t candy went straight to the trash. As a parent (which I’m not), I might be sort of rolly-eyes about it, but I don’t think it would be but a blip on my radar. Like most people here, I am also an atheist. I feel vaguely irritated by religious proselytizing, but not threatened or outraged. I’d do the same thing I do when someone puts a religious pamphlet in my mailbox - look it over, out of sheer curiosity, and then toss it. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2016, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-your-opinion-on-something-mom-wants-to-pass-out-church-cards-at-halloween-update/768908/145 "2016-10-28T16:58:19Z")
> [@Dangerosa](#): > > So, how would you guys feel about Amway flyers being dropped into the bag along with candy? Or “Hey kids, give this flyer to Mom and Dad and I can help them plan for college. Your neighbor, Edward Jones salesperson?” > > And as for a 59 year old woman Trick or Treating because she likes candy - I have issues when the teenagers show up. At 59 the way to get candy is to go to Target and buy it. Even the parents of the little kids, who have to stand outside on cold Minnesota fall nights and go door to door with their little ones don’t hold out their own pillowcases (some of the teen moms do). Edward Jones is going too far. ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2016, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-your-opinion-on-something-mom-wants-to-pass-out-church-cards-at-halloween-update/768908/146 "2016-10-28T18:08:09Z")
> [@muldoonthief](#): > > If a 59 year old in costume showed up, I’d think “What the hell” and give her candy. No costume, I might give her something just to not make a scene and get her to leave, but it would be the crappiest candy I could find in the bowl, like a mini roll of Necco wafers. I love Necco wafers! ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2016, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-your-opinion-on-something-mom-wants-to-pass-out-church-cards-at-halloween-update/768908/147 "2016-10-28T18:29:29Z")
We had a neighbor down the street that would give out Chick Tracts and a single piece of old hard Christmas candy. ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2016, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-your-opinion-on-something-mom-wants-to-pass-out-church-cards-at-halloween-update/768908/148 "2016-10-28T18:35:00Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > We had a neighbor down the street that would give out Chick Tracts and a single piece of old hard Christmas candy. Okay, I’d probably have an issue with pamphlets telling my kid he’s going to burn in hell. But one piece of stale candy? That’s beyond the pale. ---
**Author:** ![ivylass](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/9de053/32.png) [@ivylass](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivylass)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2016, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-your-opinion-on-something-mom-wants-to-pass-out-church-cards-at-halloween-update/768908/149 "2016-10-28T18:49:24Z")
> [@Idle\_Thoughts](#): > > Neither. She seriously sees nothing wrong with it and is planning to do it because she likes candy. Well hell, I like candy too. That’s why I go buy it in the store. This is pinging my weirdness meter. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2016, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-your-opinion-on-something-mom-wants-to-pass-out-church-cards-at-halloween-update/768908/150 "2016-10-28T19:20:25Z")
I have mixed feelings about this. On the one hand, let’s not be disingenuous here: the end game of “move night” is to proselytize to the kids, even if it’s soft proselytizing. Certainly, if somebody knocked on my door and started talking to my (young) kids and pushing religion on them in _any_ way, “movie night” invitation or otherwise, I would not be happy about it. But this is not that situation. If I knock on the door to somebody else’s home, or give my kids permission to do so, it seems to me that I surely must take that person as I find them. That person has every right to interact with my kids in any reasonable way at that point, and church is a large part of the beliefs and social life of many US neighborhoods. It is not reasonable for me to _initiate_ contact between my kids and other people _in their own homes_ and then expect those people to act precisely in accord with _my_ beliefs. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2016, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-your-opinion-on-something-mom-wants-to-pass-out-church-cards-at-halloween-update/768908/151 "2016-10-28T19:25:07Z")
Oh, and a 59-year-old person knocking on my door asking for candy? Unless their mental age seemed under 15, I’d probably call the cops, just as would on any other night… ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2016, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-your-opinion-on-something-mom-wants-to-pass-out-church-cards-at-halloween-update/768908/152 "2016-10-28T19:42:43Z")
You make excellent points, **Rie** (can I call you **Rie**?), but I’m still struck by the fact that if I told every little tyke that I gave a candy bar to on Halloween that God didn’t exist - even in the most pleasant, off-the-cuff, sort of way - there is no way I’d be tolerated. I would expect at least one angry parent to knock on my door to give me a piece of their mind, if not a bat to my melon. ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2016, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-your-opinion-on-something-mom-wants-to-pass-out-church-cards-at-halloween-update/768908/153 "2016-10-28T19:46:30Z")
> [@Jack\_Batty](#): > > You make excellent points, **Rie** (can I call you **Rie**?), but I’m still struck by the fact that if I told every little tyke that I gave a candy bar to on Halloween that God didn’t exist - even in the most pleasant, off-the-cuff, sort of way - there is no way I’d be tolerated. > > I would expect at least one angry parent to knock on my door to give me a piece of their mind, if not a bat to my melon. Part of the reason for this is inherent to atheism itself. It’s a lack of belief, not a promulgation of one’s own belief system, so it’s virtually impossible to discuss without criticizing someone’s religion. Someone can explain Christianity to me without attacking atheism, but it’s virtually impossible for me to explain why I’m an atheist without challenging the fundamental tenets of Christianity. Yes, I think discrimination against atheists is a problem. But it’s different than religion. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2016, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-your-opinion-on-something-mom-wants-to-pass-out-church-cards-at-halloween-update/768908/154 "2016-10-28T19:52:45Z")
Fair point, well made. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2016, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-your-opinion-on-something-mom-wants-to-pass-out-church-cards-at-halloween-update/768908/155 "2016-10-28T20:17:12Z")
> [@Jack\_Batty](#): > > You make excellent points, **Rie** (can I call you **Rie**?), but I’m still struck by the fact that if I told every little tyke that I gave a candy bar to on Halloween that God didn’t exist - even in the most pleasant, off-the-cuff, sort of way - there is no way I’d be tolerated. > > I would expect at least one angry parent to knock on my door to give me a piece of their mind, if not a bat to my melon. Ok, but the US privileged position of Christianity and intolerance of atheism does not mean that the correct resolution is that to compensate, nobody should talk about their religion in _any_ social setting. Sometimes, like school prayer, it’s a clear 1st Am issue and the resolution is that _nobody_ should be talking about religion or the absence of it in that time and place. But sometimes, it’s a private social setting where talking about religion or the absence of it should be ok either way. It’s a moot point whether Halloween candy fits into the latter category, but the reality of the asymmetric social treatment of atheism under similar circumstances does not _per se_ make the Christian proselytizing wrong in this social setting. In other words, I’m not going to be intolerant of other people just because they would be intolerant of me in a similar setting. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2016, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-your-opinion-on-something-mom-wants-to-pass-out-church-cards-at-halloween-update/768908/156 "2016-10-28T20:21:23Z")
What can I say? You’re a better man than I, Gunga Din. I remain chafed. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2016, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-your-opinion-on-something-mom-wants-to-pass-out-church-cards-at-halloween-update/768908/157 "2016-10-28T20:37:10Z")
> [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > Part of the reason for this is inherent to atheism itself. It’s a lack of belief, not a promulgation of one’s own belief system, so it’s virtually impossible to discuss without criticizing someone’s religion. Someone can explain Christianity to me without attacking atheism, but it’s virtually impossible for me to explain why I’m an atheist without challenging the fundamental tenets of Christianity. Meh, I really don’t accept that atheism attacks religion but not vice versa. Historically, intolerance of other beliefs is the defining characteristic of religion, not atheism: you must follow our way to God, or face the consequences (in this life or the next, depending how much political power we have). Most atheists, to the extent that they speak out at all, are only pushing back only against _this_ form of religion, especially when it occupies such a privileged position in society. I don’t think too many atheists have any beef with Unitarians. ---
**Author:** ![Nawth\_Chucka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c57346/32.png) [@Nawth\_Chucka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nawth_Chucka)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2016, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-your-opinion-on-something-mom-wants-to-pass-out-church-cards-at-halloween-update/768908/158 "2016-10-28T21:18:14Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > Oh, and a 59-year-old person knocking on my door asking for candy? Unless their mental age seemed under 15, I’d probably call the cops, just as would on any other night… For the crime of what, exactly? ---
**Author:** ![jnglmassiv](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f07891/32.png) [@jnglmassiv](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jnglmassiv)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2016, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-your-opinion-on-something-mom-wants-to-pass-out-church-cards-at-halloween-update/768908/159 "2016-10-28T21:22:08Z")
I’ll go so far as to say that trick or treating for someone who is almost old enough for a 15% discount at McDonald’s is straight up out of line. I want to jump in the ballpit at Chuck E Cheese’s. I want to splash around in the municipal baby pool. I want to enter the coloring contest at the library. I don’t get to because I’m far, far too old and it would be wrong to do so. I get a lot of TOTs at my house and I’ll even give a pass to the high school kids that are taller than me, if they’re costumed. The mom that approaches my door with her youngesters and an open bag gets to pick a piece or two out. A woman old enough to be my own mother ringing my bell, uncostumed, unaccompanied and just wanting a handout is just not going to fly. They have candy bowls at restaurant counters, hair salons, doctors’ offices and hotel lobbies. Is it ok, admirable, quirky for anyone to walk in and grab some? No, that is for customers and legitimate visitors just as Halloween door to door candy collecting is for children. I’m surprised this is even being considered otherwise. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2016, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-your-opinion-on-something-mom-wants-to-pass-out-church-cards-at-halloween-update/768908/160 "2016-10-28T21:37:27Z")
> [@Nawth\_Chucka](#): > > For the crime of what, exactly? Panhandling on private property (door-to-door), and after sunset. Both are violations where I live. > **[City officials propose panhandling rules](https://www.santafenewmexican.com/news/local_news/city-officials-propose-panhandling-rules/article_07ba8a8d-6100-5451-9d92-24a68bddc6e3.html)** > > Panhandlers would have to buy a license, keep changing locations and stay away from automated teller machines under a proposed ordinance making its way through Santa Fe city committees.Police Ch [www.santafenm.gov/archive\_center/document/8531](http://www.santafenm.gov/archive_center/document/8531) (pdf warning) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-your-opinion-on-something-mom-wants-to-pass-out-church-cards-at-halloween-update/768908.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/give-your-opinion-on-something-mom-wants-to-pass-out-church-cards-at-halloween-update/768908.md?page=9)