# Given that earth is rounded, why there is no quick flights from Japan to America? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [January 31, 2012, 6:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/given-that-earth-is-rounded-why-there-is-no-quick-flights-from-japan-to-america/611282 "2012-01-31T06:30:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![brittekland](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/aeb1de/32.png) [@brittekland](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brittekland)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2012, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/given-that-earth-is-rounded-why-there-is-no-quick-flights-from-japan-to-america/611282/21 "2012-01-31T18:08:22Z")
> [@standingwave](#): > > Here’s a [Google Earth plot](http://i40.tinypic.com/108fo8y.png) looking straight down on the great circle route from LA to Tokyo. You can’t get any shorter than that without boring through the Earth as already noted upthread. The distance is almost 5500 miles (about a quarter of the way around the Earth). I think people forget (or don’t realize) how freaking huge the Pacific is, thinking that flying to Japan is like flying to London. Makes sense, ie, if you draw the line from, say, Chicago you would be flying over Bering Sea and Northeastern Japan. BTW, I hope it’s nothing I did; I did link the larger map. I have no real issue here either with my OS nor with any of browers: Safari, Chrome normally & sometimes Firefox as well. . ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2012, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/given-that-earth-is-rounded-why-there-is-no-quick-flights-from-japan-to-america/611282/22 "2012-01-31T18:21:24Z")
> [@standingwave](#): > > Here’s a [Google Earth plot](http://i40.tinypic.com/108fo8y.png) looking straight down on the great circle route from LA to Tokyo. You can’t get any shorter than that without boring through the Earth as already noted upthread. The distance is almost 5500 miles (about a quarter of the way around the Earth). I think people forget (or don’t realize) how freaking huge the Pacific is, thinking that flying to Japan is like flying to London. Right, but someone in Japan, or the US, is likely to be looking at the conventional view of the earth centered on the equator, and that straight line would look like a big arc. ---
**Author:** ![lawbuff](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/13edae/32.png) [@lawbuff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lawbuff)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2012, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/given-that-earth-is-rounded-why-there-is-no-quick-flights-from-japan-to-america/611282/23 "2012-01-31T18:26:46Z")
> [@Tota](#): > > Hi All, > > Here is a question that I couldn’t find an answer to yet !! Please help !! > > 😕 > Given that earth is rounded, why there is no quick flights from Japan to America? _From the east coast of Japan to the west coast of America_ without the need to travel around the whole world ? > > Cheers, The Earth spins East to west. While you are flying to the US from Japan, the earth is still spinning west, against you. If you travel west to the US, the earth is spinning with you. ---
**Author:** ![brittekland](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/aeb1de/32.png) [@brittekland](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brittekland)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2012, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/given-that-earth-is-rounded-why-there-is-no-quick-flights-from-japan-to-america/611282/24 "2012-01-31T18:34:34Z")
It takes a couple hours longer to fly to Japan than returning to US. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2012, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/given-that-earth-is-rounded-why-there-is-no-quick-flights-from-japan-to-america/611282/25 "2012-01-31T18:38:55Z")
> [@lawbuff](#): > > The Earth spins East to west. The earth rotates from west to east. ---
**Author:** ![Duckster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duckster/32/1244_2.png) [@Duckster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duckster)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2012, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/given-that-earth-is-rounded-why-there-is-no-quick-flights-from-japan-to-america/611282/26 "2012-01-31T18:39:02Z")
The OP has a serious misunderstanding of [great circle routes](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_circle#Derivation_of_shortest_paths). Try it yourself with a [Great Circle Mapper](http://www.gcmap.com/). ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2012, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/given-that-earth-is-rounded-why-there-is-no-quick-flights-from-japan-to-america/611282/27 "2012-01-31T18:41:55Z")
> [@lawbuff](#): > > The Earth spins East to west. While you are flying to the US from Japan, the earth is still spinning west, against you. If you travel west to the US, the earth is spinning with you. Also, that is largely irrelevant unless you leave Earth’s atmosphere (which you certainly don’t in an airplane.) It’s the direction of the prevailing winds that matters the most to whether an eastward or westward flight is faster for the same distance. ---
**Author:** ![ctnguy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@ctnguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ctnguy)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2012, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/given-that-earth-is-rounded-why-there-is-no-quick-flights-from-japan-to-america/611282/28 "2012-01-31T18:42:58Z")
> [@Quintas](#): > > Jesus Christ!! Whats wrong with that Wikipedia pic? It was just a picture, but it turned my computer into a useless paperweight. I couldn’t even get to task manager to kill it. I had to manually power off my computer, then when it came back up, Firefox restored the last session and I went through the whole thing again. :mad: > [@leahcim](#): > > It’s noticeably slowing my firefox, too (although not to the crashing point). Probably a heavyweight SVG renderer and a complex SVG. Yeah, it’s because the link is directly to the original vector image. [Here’s the pre-rendered version.](http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/9c/KAL007.svg/1000px-KAL007.svg.png) ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2012, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/given-that-earth-is-rounded-why-there-is-no-quick-flights-from-japan-to-america/611282/29 "2012-01-31T18:44:18Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > I am baffled by the OP: is he imagining going **through** the earth somehow? The OP is referencing string theory. ---
**Author:** ![brittekland](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/aeb1de/32.png) [@brittekland](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brittekland)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2012, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/given-that-earth-is-rounded-why-there-is-no-quick-flights-from-japan-to-america/611282/30 "2012-01-31T18:48:55Z")
> [@ctnguy](#): > > Yeah, it’s because the link is directly to the original vector image. [Here’s the pre-rendered version.](http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/9c/KAL007.svg/1000px-KAL007.svg.png) Apology. I didn’t know it would cause any problem for some of you guys. :smack: ---
**Author:** ![lawbuff](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/13edae/32.png) [@lawbuff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lawbuff)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2012, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/given-that-earth-is-rounded-why-there-is-no-quick-flights-from-japan-to-america/611282/31 "2012-01-31T18:50:23Z")
deleted ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2012, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/given-that-earth-is-rounded-why-there-is-no-quick-flights-from-japan-to-america/611282/32 "2012-01-31T18:50:39Z")
Actually, because the Earth is an oblate spheroid rather than an actual sphere, isn’t the northern route shorter than keeping the same latitude? ---
**Author:** ![lawbuff](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/13edae/32.png) [@lawbuff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lawbuff)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2012, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/given-that-earth-is-rounded-why-there-is-no-quick-flights-from-japan-to-america/611282/33 "2012-01-31T18:51:54Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > The earth rotates from west to east. Thanks that what I meant. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2012, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/given-that-earth-is-rounded-why-there-is-no-quick-flights-from-japan-to-america/611282/34 "2012-01-31T18:53:09Z")
> [@lawbuff](#): > > The Earth spins East to west. While you are flying to the US from Japan, the earth is still spinning west, against you. If you travel west to the US, the earth is spinning with you. > [@pulykamell](#): > > The earth rotates from west to east. The phrases ‘East to West’ and ‘West to East’ are kind of meaningless here. Hopefully one of our esteemed geographers knows an unambiguous description for earth’s rotation. I generally use the terms ‘earthwise’ and ‘counter-earthwise’. Guess which one the earth does 🙂 > [@pulykamell](#): > > Also, that is largely irrelevant unless you leave Earth’s atmosphere (which you certainly don’t in an airplane.) It’s the direction of the prevailing winds that matters the most to whether an eastward or westward flight is faster for the same distance. I assumed he was joking. If not, he and the OP should meet. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2012, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/given-that-earth-is-rounded-why-there-is-no-quick-flights-from-japan-to-america/611282/35 "2012-01-31T18:58:04Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > The phrases ‘East to West’ and ‘West to East’ are kind of meaningless here. Hopefully one of our esteemed geographers knows an unambiguous description for earth’s rotation. OK, [animated GIF here](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earth's_rotation) if it’s confusing. ---
**Author:** ![lawbuff](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/13edae/32.png) [@lawbuff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lawbuff)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2012, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/given-that-earth-is-rounded-why-there-is-no-quick-flights-from-japan-to-america/611282/36 "2012-01-31T18:59:15Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > I assumed he was joking. If not, he and the OP should meet. No, I wasn’t joking. I was watching an episode of Mr. wizard (Don herbert) one day and he was discussing the polar route of flights, and instead of a straight line flight, a flight would be more like a parabola. Now, that was a long time ago, so maybe I did not remember the facts as good. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2012, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/given-that-earth-is-rounded-why-there-is-no-quick-flights-from-japan-to-america/611282/37 "2012-01-31T19:02:33Z")
> [@lawbuff](#): > > No, I wasn’t joking. I was watching an episode of Mr. wizard (Don herbert) one day and he was discussing the polar route of flights, and instead of a straight line flight, a flight would be more like a parabola. > > Now, that was a long time ago, so maybe I did not remember the facts as good. It would look like a parabola (or some sort of arc) on a flat map, yes. If you look at a globe, find two points, and connect them with the shortest line, that’s straightforward and easy for pretty much anyone to do. The thing is, when that route is taken from a 3D sphere and put onto a 2D rectangle, it looks like the arc of a circle, because of the transformation from a round three-dimensional space to a spherical two-dimensional space. ---
**Author:** ![lawbuff](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/13edae/32.png) [@lawbuff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lawbuff)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2012, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/given-that-earth-is-rounded-why-there-is-no-quick-flights-from-japan-to-america/611282/38 "2012-01-31T19:05:45Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > It would look like a parabola (or some sort of arc) on a flat map, yes. If you look at a globe, find two points, and connect them with the shortest line, that’s straightforward and easy for pretty much anyone to do. The thing is, when that route is taken from a 3D sphere and put onto a 2D rectangle, it looks like the arc of a circle, because of the transformation from a round three-dimensional space to a spherical two-dimensional space. Thanks. I don’t claim to be a science major, I was just quoting from memory from Mr. Wizard, that was a great show. ---
**Author:** ![leahcim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/b4bc9f/32.png) [@leahcim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leahcim)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2012, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/given-that-earth-is-rounded-why-there-is-no-quick-flights-from-japan-to-america/611282/39 "2012-01-31T19:09:59Z")
> [@Quartz](#): > > Actually, because the Earth is an oblate spheroid rather than an actual sphere, isn’t the northern route shorter than keeping the same latitude? Even if the earth was a perfect sphere, taking a northern route would be shorter. Lines of latitude look like straight lines on the map, but (other than the equator) are not geodesics on the sphere. It helps to think of two points very near the north pole, but with very different latitude. Like have both of them be 89 degrees north, but one 90 degrees west and the other 90 degrees east. If draw a line between them on a standard map projection you’ll end up going around the world, but on a globe it would be pretty clear that the shortest route is to pop over the pole, which on the map looks like going straight up instead of towards your destination. Other routes are like that, but less so. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2012, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/given-that-earth-is-rounded-why-there-is-no-quick-flights-from-japan-to-america/611282/40 "2012-01-31T19:16:04Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > OK, [animated GIF here](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earth's_rotation) if it’s confusing. That’s the easiest way to describe it. Rotation is always relative to something, and can’t be unambiguously described as relative to points on the rotating object. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/given-that-earth-is-rounded-why-there-is-no-quick-flights-from-japan-to-america/611282.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/given-that-earth-is-rounded-why-there-is-no-quick-flights-from-japan-to-america/611282.md?page=3)