# Glasnost Mafia **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [February 17, 2011, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757 "2011-02-17T23:58:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 34
**Author:** ![Gadarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Gadarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gadarene)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2011, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/661 "2011-02-28T18:30:34Z")
NETA: In fact, **ed** , not only did I expressly say what you suggest I didn’t say: > [@](#): > > Either Drain is third party/Deranged Bomber, in which case she has to go, or else MentalGuy is lying, in which case he’s an automatic lynch toMorrow if Drain flips town. …But I was specifically replying to, and agreeing with, a post of YOURS when I said it. _And_ I’ve already voted to lynch **Drain** , saying it was by far the best thing for us to do right now. So color me a bit confused why I’m pinging for you just because I remain somewhat provisionally skeptical of MentalGuy’s claim. ---
**Author:** ![special\_ed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@special\_ed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/special_ed)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2011, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/662 "2011-02-28T18:43:19Z")
> [@Gadarene](#): > > Yeah, I’m not sure how much there really is to discuss right now, because this (and what **special ed** said above about the glass of WiFoM) pretty much nails it: > > Either **Drain** is third party/Deranged Bomber, in which case she has to go, or else **MentalGuy** is lying, in which case he’s an automatic lynch toMorrow if **Drain** flips town. > > To be honest, I trust **Drain** waaaay more than I do **MentalGuy** at this point, because the circumstances of his claim yesterday were extremely convenient and I find it really odd that he survived the night both unscathed and unjailed, so I’m loath to vote to lynch, but I don’t see a different solution at this point. Does anyone else? Underlining is mine. This is what caused me to be suspicious. I see no reason why a Townie would be trusting drain more than Mental Guy. I see reasons why a Scum would want people to trust Drain more than mental Guy, however. While you may have agreed with me, a Scum really would have no choice but to agree with me, since lynching drain is the obvious pro-Town move to make today, it really seemed like you didn’t want to agree with me. ---
**Author:** ![sachertorte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sachertorte/32/3727_2.png) [@sachertorte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sachertorte)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2011, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/663 "2011-02-28T18:44:44Z")
Not that it is going to matter either way, but I’ll also point out that late Yesterday, Drain Bead offered a bit that I disagreed with that in retrospect makes Drain Bead look less Town. She said that it was unlikely that that the simulpostings jumping on MentalGuy were scum-driven, implying that it was Town driven. (She might have explicitly said Town-driven, but I’m too lazy to look it up). Anyway I pointed out that was nonsense as the simulpost in and of itself proved nothing (both Town and Scum would happily vote for a Townie MentaGuy but Scum would be hesitant to vote for a scummy MentalGuy). Now that Drain Bead is accused of being third party, her comments make more sense to me. It could have been a “hey look at me, I’m so Townie!” kind of deal. I think that Drain Bead got caught up in a situation that she thought made her look like Town and didn’t think through the situation fully. Otherwise I still can’t make sense of her proclamation Yesterday. ---
**Author:** ![Gadarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Gadarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gadarene)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2011, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/664 "2011-02-28T18:54:38Z")
> [@special\_ed](#): > > Underlining is mine. > > This is what caused me to be suspicious. > > I see no reason why a Townie would be trusting drain more than Mental Guy. I see reasons why a Scum would want people to trust Drain more than mental Guy, however. > > While you may have agreed with me, a Scum really would have no choice but to agree with me, since lynching drain is the obvious pro-Town move to make today, it really seemed like you didn’t want to agree with me. I don’t know how much more clearly I can say this, **ed** : I want **Drain** to get lynched toDay. I think her lynch is a win/win for Town _ **provided that** _ we immediately lynch MentalGuy toMorrow if it turns out that **Drain** is town. If **Drain** flips as third party, I will certainly trust **MentalGuy** , as he will be essentially confirmed as the cop. The fact that, as it stands, **MentalGuy’s** play so far doesn’t quite sit well with me has no bearing on whether I think we should test his claim by lynching **Drain** toDay. Not only that, my position has been completely consistent the whole way through. And recalibrate your tone detector: you’re reading intonations/intentions into my posts that simply aren’t there. I “didn’t want” to agree with you? C’mon. ---
**Author:** ![special\_ed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@special\_ed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/special_ed)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2011, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/665 "2011-02-28T19:48:55Z")
> [@Gadarene](#): > > I don’t know how much more clearly I can say this, **ed** : I want **Drain** to get lynched toDay. I think her lynch is a win/win for Town _ **provided that** _ we immediately lynch MentalGuy toMorrow if it turns out that **Drain** is town. If **Drain** flips as third party, I will certainly trust **MentalGuy** , as he will be essentially confirmed as the cop. The fact that, as it stands, **MentalGuy’s** play so far doesn’t quite sit well with me has no bearing on whether I think we should test his claim by lynching **Drain** toDay. Not only that, my position has been completely consistent the whole way through. > > And recalibrate your tone detector: you’re reading intonations/intentions into my posts that simply aren’t there. I “didn’t want” to agree with you? C’mon. Yes, I did infer that from your comment that you trusted drain “waaaay more” than you trusted Mental. I stand by my thought than any Town player, given the information you had at the time, should be trusting Mental “waaaay more” than they are trusting Drain if for no other reason than Mental Guy went out on a limb fingering Drain as the bomber. Did you notice how the other who have voted Drain have pointed out that if she’s not 3rd party, we’ll lynch Mental toMorrow, but no one expressed significant doubt of him given the information we currently have? yes, some have pointed out that if he’s wrong, they’ll vote for him, but no one is doubting him given what we currently know. ---
**Author:** ![special\_ed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@special\_ed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/special_ed)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2011, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/666 "2011-02-28T19:56:23Z")
NETA: that should end with “No one is doubting him more than they are doubting Drain.” Which is to say, it appears that everyone is trusting him more than they are trusting Drain. Given the same information yo had when you made your comment. ---
**Author:** ![Gadarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Gadarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gadarene)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2011, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/667 "2011-02-28T20:04:01Z")
> [@special\_ed](#): > > Which is to say, it appears that everyone is trusting him more than they are trusting Drain. Given the same information yo had when you made your comment. Well, then, let me just parrot the opinions of everyone else rather than expressing my own, so I don’t have to participate in these inane dissections of my phrasing time and time again. :rolleyes: We’re all just twiddling our thumbs until **Drain** gets lynched anyway, so I understand the impulse to find some red meat to chew over in the meantime, but poking at me because I don’t immediately fall at **MentalGuy’s** feet upon his pronouncement of **Drain’s** guilt seems somewhat unfruitful to me, and it’s lurching perilously close to a lynch the loud strategy on your part. But yeah, next time I want to add more than the bare minimum to my posts, I’ll certainly think twice because I wouldn’t want to be misapprehended AGAIN by you. ---
**Author:** ![sachertorte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sachertorte/32/3727_2.png) [@sachertorte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sachertorte)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2011, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/668 "2011-02-28T20:12:03Z")
> [@special\_ed](#): > > Did you notice how the other who have voted Drain have pointed out that if she’s not 3rd party, we’ll lynch Mental toMorrow, but no one expressed significant doubt of him given the information we currently have? yes, some have pointed out that if he’s wrong, they’ll vote for him, but no one is doubting him given what we currently know. Ed, I’m not sure what you’re getting at. Are you saying that Gadarene is acting scummy? I suppose you can make a case in a “one of these things is not like the others” way, but I’m not sure that casting doubt on MentalGuy is really all that scummy. If anything, the fact that Gadarene is willing to fly in the face of the current state seems more Town to me than scum, especially if MentalGuy is Town. In other words a scummy Gadarene is unlikely to want to zig when everyone else is zagging and cast doubt on a Townie MentalGuy. The situation is clear, Drain Bead is getting lynched. Gadarene’s suspicions will not change that. And if MentalGuy is scum, why would a scummy Gadarene be pushing the point? ---
**Author:** ![GuiriEnEspana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bc79bd/32.png) [@GuiriEnEspana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuiriEnEspana)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2011, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/669 "2011-02-28T20:33:57Z")
> [@Astral\_Rejection](#): > > Overall, I’m leaning quite scum on Guiri. However, Drain Bead is still a much better lynch target for toDay. /snip I agree that **Drain** needs to be lynched toDay, if she is the bomber we can’t even leave her for the Vig as someone else will die too. I was away over the weekend so I’ll also agree that I’ve not contributed to the recent discussions. However I will not attempt to refute your other accusations a second time - you’ve linked to my original post and so others can read and judge for themselves what I was saying about **Pleo** ’s stances in the game and who’s been misrepresenting whom. I believe that anti-town opinions are not strong indicators of a player’s scumminess. I vote for players I believe likely to be scum or, on occasions like toDay, 3rd party threats to Town. More later, I need to re-read. ---
**Author:** ![ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2011, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/670 "2011-02-28T20:40:52Z")
> [@GuiriEnEspana](#): > > I believe that anti-town opinions are not strong indicators of a player’s scumminess. I vote for players I believe likely to be scum or, on occasions like toDay, 3rd party threats to Town. > > More later, I need to re-read. When you come back with the pie, I’m hoping that you’ll elaborate on this rather vague statement that from where I’m sitting says absolutely nothing. ---
**Author:** ![Gadarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Gadarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gadarene)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2011, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/671 "2011-02-28T20:56:12Z")
**Can we have a vote count soon?** ---
**Author:** ![GuiriEnEspana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bc79bd/32.png) [@GuiriEnEspana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuiriEnEspana)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2011, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/672 "2011-02-28T22:14:48Z")
> [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](#): > > When you come back with the pie, I’m hoping that you’ll elaborate on this rather vague statement that from where I’m sitting says absolutely nothing. No pie yet. The statement was in reference to **Astral** ’s accusations. I did not vote **Pleo** despite finding his opinions anti-town because I believe anti-town != scummy. ---
**Author:** ![Red\_Skeezix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/aca169/32.png) [@Red\_Skeezix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Red_Skeezix)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2011, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/673 "2011-02-28T22:19:59Z")
Day 2 Vote Tally Drain Bead(9) :Mental Guy[610], Zeriel[611], peekercpa[613], Mahaloth[614], [del]special ed[627-633][/del], pedescribe[628], ComeToTheDarksideWeHaveCookies[634], Suburban Plankton[636], Idle Thoughts[647], Gadarene[652] Mental Guy(1) : Drain Bead[617] Idle Thoughts(0) :[del]Mahaloth[605-614][/del] Did Not Vote:Wolverine,Manwich,Astral Rejection,storyteller0910,One and Only Wanderers,septimus,special ed,guiri,sachertorte With these votes, Drain Bead would be lynched. ---
**Author:** ![Astral\_Rejection](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/258eb7/32.png) [@Astral\_Rejection](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astral_Rejection)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2011, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/674 "2011-02-28T22:28:57Z")
Remember, 12 to hammer. IIRC, we have three people who have said they _would_ vote for Drain so far, putting us at the hammer. I’d suggest we hold off until everybody gets a chance to stop by and weigh in, however. ---
**Author:** ![Manwich](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e480ec/32.png) [@Manwich](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Manwich)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2011, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/675 "2011-02-28T22:50:56Z")
Who are we waiting for? And is there any advantage to holding of the vote for more discussion, given that scum get a night kill after we lynch? ---
**Author:** ![Astral\_Rejection](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/258eb7/32.png) [@Astral\_Rejection](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astral_Rejection)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2011, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/676 "2011-02-28T22:54:56Z")
I’m not 100% sure if everybody has gotten a chance to stop by and voice their opinions. I’d be pretty bummed if the whole day happened before I could check in. ---
**Author:** ![Gadarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Gadarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gadarene)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2011, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/677 "2011-02-28T23:11:57Z")
Random thought: since scum can strategize during the day, does it hurt Town at all to stretch things out when the lynch is a foregone conclusion? Again, I haven’t played in games with day strategizing in the past, so I’m not sure how we should take it into account in a situation like this. ---
**Author:** ![sachertorte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sachertorte/32/3727_2.png) [@sachertorte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sachertorte)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2011, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/678 "2011-02-28T23:16:36Z")
> [@Manwich](#): > > Who are we waiting for? And is there any advantage to holding of the vote for more discussion, given that scum get a night kill after we lynch? Looking at the list, I think we are waiting for storyteller and One and Only Wanderers. I don’t really know what they would say that would change the lynch, but since we can’t talk at Night, they should at least have the opportunity to speak up in case they have something to say. ---
**Author:** ![Astral\_Rejection](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/258eb7/32.png) [@Astral\_Rejection](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astral_Rejection)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2011, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/679 "2011-02-28T23:19:03Z")
One and Only has (briefly) chimed in, so I guess that would just leave Storyteller. I believe we should wait until he gets a chance to speak, even if it’s just to toss a vote on Drain. ---
**Author:** ![special\_ed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@special\_ed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/special_ed)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2011, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/680 "2011-02-28T23:33:30Z")
> [@Gadarene](#): > > Well, then, let me just parrot the opinions of everyone else rather than expressing my own, so I don’t have to participate in these inane dissections of my phrasing time and time again. :rolleyes: > > We’re all just twiddling our thumbs until **Drain** gets lynched anyway, so I understand the impulse to find some red meat to chew over in the meantime, but poking at me because I don’t immediately fall at **MentalGuy’s** feet upon his pronouncement of **Drain’s** guilt seems somewhat unfruitful to me, and it’s lurching perilously close to a lynch the loud strategy on your part. > > But yeah, next time I want to add more than the bare minimum to my posts, I’ll certainly think twice because I wouldn’t want to be misapprehended AGAIN by you. Are you asking me to not comment on things that I find suspicious? I will poke as I feel appropriate. And it would be quite ironic if I were to espouse a lynch the loud strategy. The alternative to me pointing out things I find suspicious is to not point out things I find suspicious. If we all did that, this would be a very quiet game. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757.md?page=33) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757.md?page=35)