# Glasnost Mafia **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [February 17, 2011, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757 "2011-02-17T23:58:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 46
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2011, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/901 "2011-03-07T13:36:26Z")
> [@peekercpa](#): > > almost like he had his mind made up on a target and then just kind of fabricated something to justify his conclusion. Exactly what I said. Exactly. I think Manwich and Pedescribe have done the same, but not as obviously. ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2011, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/902 "2011-03-07T14:08:16Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > (If it did, I’d think you all Scum with me the only Townie in the game. 😃 ) \ this is how i approach every game i play. and when i first read through the whole **mg** blow up i kind of had the same impression that **drain** had. namely that it was almost simulposting with folks coming to the same conclusion so, therefore, it wasn’t driven by scum trying to gang tackle an “oh whoops” moment. well now we know two of the four. a town and a 3rd party. so now i spin a little differently (i think it was **sach** that pointed out that it didn’t mean squat). well we know it wasn’t a gang tackle but does it make sense that a scum would hop all over it like stink on poo? yaknow, it really does. **vote gad** ---
**Author:** ![Manwich](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e480ec/32.png) [@Manwich](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Manwich)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2011, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/903 "2011-03-07T14:29:23Z")
> [@Mahaloth](#): > > Exactly what I said. Exactly. I think Manwich and Pedescribe have done the same, but not as obviously. You still haven’t told us why your reasoning for voting Wolverine developed over four posts. Go back and read your posts and you will see you gradually offer more, but you have not admitted it. You keep misreading me as saying that I think you offered \*\*no \*\*explanation when I have been saying you didn’t \*\*fully \*\*explain at first, which is true. You seemed to have avoided the question. Why was your vote a good day one vote while votes against you were “lazy”? Your night fluff comment was “nothing” but Gadarene’s was suspicious? I think that your describing your own play as a “very solid, pro-Town game” while fingering others who have done similar or equally scummy things is suspicious. ---
**Author:** ![sachertorte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sachertorte/32/3727_2.png) [@sachertorte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sachertorte)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2011, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/904 "2011-03-07T15:01:19Z")
> [@peekercpa](#): > > \ > > i really don’t like this post. and maybe this is too meta but what the hey. > > i don’t think i have ever seen **sach** use this type of reasoning for a vote. a Night fluff post that he doesn’t feel expresses honest emotions as the lynchpin of his case. crap that’s the kind of reasoning i would use. which is definitely not in **sach** ’s wheelhouse, so to speak. seriously, coming from any host of characters it might be just x being x but coming from **sach** it seems really out of character. almost like he had his mind made up on a target and then just kind of fabricated something to justify his conclusion. First of all, I think you have an overly idealized view of how I think or play. Secondly, I think you are over-complicating my being. I simply don’t believe Mahaloth is being genuine. Seriously, what _else_ am I supposed to based my vote on? You are free to agree or disagree with the validity of my conclusions, but to say it is fabricated is off the mark. Furthermore, why would I need to fabricate _anything at all_ to vote for Mahaloth? Others have posted theories (theories that I don’t put a whole lot of stock into by the way), that I could easily have used to justify an arbitrary conclusion about Mahaloth. Isn’t it more reasonable that I said what I said about Mahaloth simply because I think it is true and therefore worth posting publically? ---
**Author:** ![sachertorte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sachertorte/32/3727_2.png) [@sachertorte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sachertorte)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2011, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/905 "2011-03-07T15:09:31Z")
> [@peekercpa](#): > > \ > > this is how i approach every game i play. > > and when i first read through the whole **mg** blow up i kind of had the same impression that **drain** had. namely that it was almost simulposting with folks coming to the same conclusion so, therefore, it wasn’t driven by scum trying to gang tackle an “oh whoops” moment. well now we know two of the four. a town and a 3rd party. so now i spin a little differently (i think it was **sach** that pointed out that it didn’t mean squat). well we know it wasn’t a gang tackle but does it make sense that a scum would hop all over it like stink on poo? yaknow, it really does. This type of reasoning I could get behind. I should re-read the MentalGuy Train. Note the should; I’m not sure if I’ll have time. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2011, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/906 "2011-03-07T15:11:01Z")
> [@Manwich](#): > > You still haven’t told us why your reasoning for voting Wolverine developed over four posts. Go back and read your posts and you will see you gradually offer more, but you have not admitted it. You keep misreading me as saying that I think you offered \*\*no \*\*explanation when I have been saying you didn’t \*\*fully \*\*explain at first, which is true. You seemed to have avoided the question. > > Why was your vote a good day one vote while votes against you were “lazy”? > > Your night fluff comment was “nothing” but Gadarene’s was suspicious? I think that your describing your own play as a “very solid, pro-Town game” while fingering others who have done similar or equally scummy things is suspicious. 1. I initially did not explain more since I agreed with Zeriel’s original argument(I think it was Zeriel, anyway). 2. Votes against me were lazy because they consisted of reasons like “he was the 2nd to vote” and looked like they were just “lynch the loud” votes. 3. Gadarene’s sounded to me like it had knowledge behind it while mine was just expressing relief that Drain was who we thought. ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2011, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/907 "2011-03-07T15:34:45Z")
> [@peekercpa](#): > > for the early hamerer? is it an inconvenient vote for you becauase of who it was? Naw, it was irrelevant because it was apparent (to me) that we mostly had a consensus. It wasn’t like someone just dropped a random hammer with no discussion. ---
**Author:** ![Idle\_Thoughts](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/838e76/32.png) [@Idle\_Thoughts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Idle_Thoughts)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2011, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/908 "2011-03-07T17:19:14Z")
\*\*Vote Mahaloth \*\*since I still think he’s the most suspicious player right now. (sorry for being away a bit again, I’ve been having digestive problems and thus, many doctors appointments and ill-feeling times) ---
**Author:** ![sachertorte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sachertorte/32/3727_2.png) [@sachertorte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sachertorte)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2011, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/909 "2011-03-07T17:35:45Z")
I given it a bit of thought and unless the Vigilante comes up with a good read on scum, I think the Vigilante should kill me tonight. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2011, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/910 "2011-03-07T17:55:42Z")
> [@Idle\_Thoughts](#): > > \*\*Vote Mahaloth \*\*since I still think he’s the most suspicious player right now. Why? ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2011, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/911 "2011-03-07T17:56:57Z")
Again, Idle has just picked someone(me) and just decided that’s it, with no justification. Another “anyone but me” kind of vote. ---
**Author:** ![special\_ed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@special\_ed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/special_ed)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2011, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/912 "2011-03-07T17:58:10Z")
> [@sachertorte](#): > > I given it a bit of thought and unless the Vigilante comes up with a good read on scum, I think the Vigilante should kill me tonight. um…huh? ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2011, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/913 "2011-03-07T17:58:42Z")
> [@sachertorte](#): > > I given it a bit of thought and unless the Vigilante comes up with a good read on scum, I think the Vigilante should kill me tonight. Why? ---
**Author:** ![special\_ed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@special\_ed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/special_ed)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2011, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/914 "2011-03-07T17:59:14Z")
> [@Mahaloth](#): > > Again, Idle has just picked someone(me) and just decided that’s it, with no justification. > > Another “anyone but me” kind of vote. can you please explain to me the part of your defense where you state that you have played a very pro-Town game? ---
**Author:** ![Suburban\_Plankton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suburban_plankton/32/219_2.png) [@Suburban\_Plankton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Suburban_Plankton)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2011, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/915 "2011-03-07T18:16:09Z")
I’ve just managed to catch up with the Day’s posts now. I’m stiil fighing off whatever cold/flu bug I’ve come down with, and it’s really cutting into my Mafia time, so I apologize for that. My observations at this point… \*\*Mahaloth’s \*\*attitude Today is strangely reminiscent of \*\*Pleonast’s \*\*on Day 1: “I’m obviously Town, and all the votes against me are crap, and those people are off their rockers”. Of course, considering how well that approach worked out for **Pleo** , I’m not so sure Scum would resort to that defense a second time. Then again, I’m not so sure they wouldn’t, either… I didn’t like **septimus** ’ approach to the \*\*Pleonast \*\*lynch on Day 1 (“let’s let a claimed vanilla live”), and I don’t much like his justification for it Today. I think his theory on why it would have been a good idea is dead wrong, but I’m not sure yet whether I think it’s Scum-motivated. I’m not really seeing the case against **Astral** ; it seems like he’s comie under fire for being opinionated. I need to go back and look at his posts more closely. Looking back at the voting from Day 1, I saw something that has not been brought up so far. Much has been made of \*\*Astral \*\*creating the tie between \*\*Pleonast \*\*and **MentalGuy**. But what seems to have been missed is who first broke that tie. That was **special ed** , in Post 509. He had been voting for **Astral** when he cast the tie-breaking vote for **Mental** , but pointed out that he would “still be satisfied to see Astral lynched”. It was in the very next post that \*\*Mental \*\*claimed, causing \*\*ed \*\*to unvote him, and in Post 545 he revotes **Astral** , but mentions in that post “I also approve of the Pleonast lynch”. There’s nothing \*overtly \*Scummy there, but it was a rather opportune vote on **MentalGuy**. All of the other votes on him has come in a flurry immediately after his vote for **Pleo** , but \*\*ed \*\*waited until a tie had been created to flip his vote. If \*\*MentalGuy \*\*had been Vanilla Town (and thus hadn’t had a Cop claim to make in the next post), it’s quite likely that would have been the deciding vote. I don’t have enough of a feel on anyone to place a vote just yet, but I will try to do so before the end of the day today, so that we have enough time left for discussion before Nightfall. On preview, I see > [@sachertorte](#): > > I given it a bit of thought and unless the Vigilante comes up with a good read on scum, I think the Vigilante should kill me tonight. Am I missing something? I know I’ve spent most of the last week in a Dayquil-induced haze, but I don’t understand why this would be a good idea… ---
**Author:** ![sachertorte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sachertorte/32/3727_2.png) [@sachertorte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sachertorte)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2011, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/916 "2011-03-07T18:43:49Z")
I feel that the Vigilante is woefully under-utilizing a Town Power. With the bomber dead, additional town-directed Nightkills are a good thing. The only thing that needs to be avoided is killing other Town Powers. Thus, the Vigilante should kill me. You are correct that this won’t net scum, but it will move town closer to lynching scum. I feel that Town has control of this game, but we must act to maintain our advantage. I feel that we can maximize our position by having the Vigilante kill Vanilla Town. (e.g., me) Thought experiment: What would happen if all the Vanilla Town were dead right now? ---
**Author:** ![sachertorte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sachertorte/32/3727_2.png) [@sachertorte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sachertorte)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2011, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/917 "2011-03-07T18:47:29Z")
“woefully” oversells. I only think that a kill should have been performed the previous Night (after the Bomber was known to be dead). ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2011, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/918 "2011-03-07T18:55:46Z")
> [@special\_ed](#): > > can you please explain to me the part of your defense where you state that you have played a very pro-Town game? 1. I have talked regularly instead. 2. I have not “voted and disappeared” 3. I have justified my votes and had actual cases. My case on Idle was particularly strong, though I can not reconcile it with the fact he claimed “chicken” recruitment, so to speak(hence my unvote). 4. I voted early, even. I’ve put myself out there instead of hiding or trying to avoid attention all together. I suspect the scum are just laying low and flying along, confident that we will lynch louder players. ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2011, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/919 "2011-03-07T18:57:54Z")
Can we get an official count? ---
**Author:** ![Gadarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Gadarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gadarene)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2011, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757/920 "2011-03-07T18:57:55Z")
> [@sachertorte](#): > > I feel that the Vigilante is woefully under-utilizing a Town Power. With the bomber dead, additional town-directed Nightkills are a good thing. The only thing that needs to be avoided is killing other Town Powers. > Thus, the Vigilante should kill me. > You are correct that this won’t net scum, but it will move town closer to lynching scum. > > I feel that Town has control of this game, but we must act to maintain our advantage. I feel that we can maximize our position by having the Vigilante kill Vanilla Town. (e.g., me) > > Thought experiment: What would happen if all the Vanilla Town were dead right now? This is an interesting idea. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757.md?page=45) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/glasnost-mafia/571757.md?page=47)