# Gobb is Pitted **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 2, 2025, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gobb-is-pitted/1023604 "2025-10-02T16:46:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2025, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gobb-is-pitted/1023604/61 "2025-10-02T23:02:49Z")
> [@WalterBishop](#): > > He’s not posted anything that isn’t accepted by tens of millions of Americans as simple common sense. > [@WalterBishop](#): > > What, specifically, has he said that isn’t believed by millions of Americans? Please quote him. I’m genuinely curious. > [@WalterBishop](#): > > In fact, judging by what he’s _actually posted_, he’s just an ordinary guy. If you believe I’m wrong then by all means quote the post(s) which you find most objectionable. > [@WalterBishop](#): > > To the best of my knowledge, the guy hasn’t said anything that’s not mainstream. What he’s saying isn’t the problem, it’s that he’s refusing to provide cites for anything, and he’s doing in forums that demand them. Just like how you asked for cites multiple times in this thread (in the form of quoting his posts). Granted this is the pit so no one has to do that for you, but in P&E, you can’t make claims without cites. ---
**Author:** ![WalterBishop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/aeb1de/32.png) [@WalterBishop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WalterBishop)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2025, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gobb-is-pitted/1023604/62 "2025-10-02T23:06:54Z")
> [@DMC](#): > > Yeah, but you thought magellan01 was worth thousands of the rest of us, so I’m going to take your opinion on their value with a few square meters of Lake Bonneville. I went back to the thread you’re referencing and checked what I’d posted. I originally wrote: “Of those posters, there are a couple who habitually do _almost nothing else_ [but post snark], no matter what thread they’re in. They’re maladjusted wastes of space, and **magellan01** is worth a thousand of them” I was only referring to a couple of specific posters. One of those posters was **Chingon** , who has since been banned, who was a miserable sack of shit who wasn’t worth the steam off a child molester’s piss, and who was far more of a troll than **Gobb** seems to be, so I stand by that assessment. The other poster I was referring to (unfortunately) hasn’t been banned yet so I won’t mention him. Those were the only posters I was referring to. I wasn’t referring to you or anyone else in this thread. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2025, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gobb-is-pitted/1023604/63 "2025-10-02T23:08:56Z")
Here’s the quotes. All of these are in P&E. > Paramilitary groups tend to be conservative-leaning. That is not something that needs to be cited. Vibes, optics alone should tell you that. > You should know that police and military are right-leaning. That has been the norm since the 50s. This is common knowledge > There does not need to be citations on that. Most athletes are MAGA. > Most athletes are very MAGA. People should know that. ---
**Author:** ![WalterBishop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/aeb1de/32.png) [@WalterBishop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WalterBishop)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2025, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gobb-is-pitted/1023604/64 "2025-10-02T23:17:01Z")
I agree it’s nice to provide cites when asked, but do we _really_ need a _cite_ for the claim that cops, soldiers and _militias_ tend to be right leaning? I mean, **Gobb’s** right. That _is_ common knowledge. You can argue (often justifiably) that refusing to provide cites is a sign of bad faith, but so is demanding cites for the absolute bleeding obvious. The claim about athletes is different, IMO. I don’t think that’s common knowledge in the same way his claims about cops and soldiers were. ---
**Author:** ![DMC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dmc/32/18049_2.png) [@DMC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DMC)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2025, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gobb-is-pitted/1023604/65 "2025-10-02T23:18:09Z")
> [@WalterBishop](#): > > I agree it’s nice to provide cites when asked, but do we _really_ need a _cite_ for the claim that cops and soldiers tend to be right wing? In GD and P&E (which follows the same basic rules), yes, we really do need cites when requested. Hell, we often ask for cites over there for things that we hope to be accurate. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2025, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gobb-is-pitted/1023604/66 "2025-10-02T23:19:08Z")
> [@WalterBishop](#): > > I agree it’s nice to provide cites when asked, but do we _really_ need a _cite_ for the claim that cops and soldiers tend to be right wing? I mean, **Gobb’s** right. That _is_ common knowledge. You can argue (often justifiably) that refusing to provide cites is a sign of bad faith, but so is demanding cites for the absolute bleeding obvious. If he were truly a brand-new poster, and not familiar with board rules and culture, then a mod note – “cites are expected for claims like that in this forum” – would certainly be appropriate, at least once. He then proceeded to argue with the mod who told him that, and continued with the same behavior. Magic 8-Ball says “Trock.” ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2025, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gobb-is-pitted/1023604/67 "2025-10-02T23:19:22Z")
> [@WalterBishop](#): > > The claim about athletes is different, IMO. I don’t think that’s common knowledge in the same way his claims about cops and soldiers were. Why do you get to make those decisions? Where are you drawing the line? Also, when taken in context, it wasn’t that he refused to cite something that he feels is common knowledge, it was a pattern of doing it (and a pattern of disregarding mod directions as well). ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2025, 11:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gobb-is-pitted/1023604/68 "2025-10-02T23:24:09Z")
> [@WalterBishop](#): > > I agree it’s nice to provide cites when asked, but do we _really_ need a _cite_ for the claim that cops, soldiers and _militias_ tend to be right leaning? I mean, **Gobb’s** right. That _is_ common knowledge. You can argue (often justifiably) that refusing to provide cites is a sign of bad faith, but so is demanding cites for the absolute bleeding obvious. Cops and soldiers tend to be right-wing? That seems like begging the question. Sure, cops and soldiers tend to align with ideologies that favour cops and soldiers, but is that what totally defines “right wing” in today’s political climate? Might there not be many who are actual patriots, believers in the Constitution and the rule of law, who are disgusted by the violations of all those rights and norms and the rampant corruption by the current gang of thugs occupying the highest political offices? US military leadership certainly seemed markedly unimpressed by the Trump and Hegseth dog and pony show, which turned the concept of military honour into a farcical unintended parody. ---
**Author:** ![DMC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dmc/32/18049_2.png) [@DMC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DMC)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2025, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gobb-is-pitted/1023604/69 "2025-10-02T23:25:59Z")
> [@WalterBishop](#): > > I agree it’s nice to provide cites when asked, but do we _really_ need a _cite_ for the claim that cops, soldiers and _militias_ tend to be right leaning? This is why we need cites: > **[Trump’s popularity slips in latest Military Times poll — and more troops say...](https://www.militarytimes.com/news/pentagon-congress/2020/08/31/as-trumps-popularity-slips-in-latest-military-times-poll-more-troops-say-theyll-vote-for-biden/)** > > About half of troops surveyed for the poll said they have an unfavorable view of the commander in chief. Opinions change, then change back, and change again. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2025, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gobb-is-pitted/1023604/70 "2025-10-02T23:26:02Z")
Like actual knowledge, perhaps? ---
**Author:** ![WalterBishop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/aeb1de/32.png) [@WalterBishop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WalterBishop)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2025, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gobb-is-pitted/1023604/71 "2025-10-02T23:27:30Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > Why do you get to make those decisions? Where are you drawing the line? I can’t draw a bright dividing line between claims that definitely _do_ require cites and claims that definitely _don’t,_ but surely the claim that cops and soldiers tend to be right leaning falls in the “don’t” category. It’s just one of those things that everyone knows, same as “People in big cities tend to lean liberal” or “Candidates tend to move to the center after winning their primaries”. I mean, am I crazy? Don’t we all just _know_ that soldiers tend to vote Republican? ---
**Author:** ![DMC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dmc/32/18049_2.png) [@DMC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DMC)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2025, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gobb-is-pitted/1023604/72 "2025-10-02T23:29:35Z")
> [@WalterBishop](#): > > I mean, am I crazy? You tell us. > [@](#): > > Don’t we all just _know_ that soldiers tend to vote Republican? It doesn’t matter what we just “know”, cites still matter, like the one that I posted a couple of posts back. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2025, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gobb-is-pitted/1023604/73 "2025-10-02T23:30:57Z")
> [@WalterBishop](#): > > It’s just one of those things that everyone knows, same as “People in big cities tend to lean liberal” or “Candidates tend to move to the center after winning their primaries”. I mean, am I crazy? Don’t we all just _know_ that soldiers tend to vote Republican? In P&E, you’d absolutely have to cite every one of those claims. ETA, and to be very clear, I’m neither agreeing or disagreeing with anything, I’m only saying that you’d have to back it up if you want to have a decent discussion. ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2025, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gobb-is-pitted/1023604/74 "2025-10-02T23:35:27Z")
> [@gnoitall](#): > > Sometimes, it’s OK to concede that ignorance fights back and refuses to learn. Truly. Stupid’s forever but ignorance can be fixed – except willful ignorance. Then you’re getting into teaching a pig to sing territory. ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2025, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gobb-is-pitted/1023604/75 "2025-10-02T23:48:26Z")
And here’s the thing about backing statements up with cites: You also need to state the limits of your knowledge. Not just give a cite but where possible assess its reliability, and include that assessment in your post if appropriate. For example, stating that so-and-so said such-and-such and I learned it from the Washington Post in a news article gives your readers information from which to judge how much credibility to give to the statement itself and the reliability of the source in getting the quote accurately, as opposed to taking the same quote from, say, the Washington Times. You can (I have, anyway) say I believe I read this in a news article/heard it on the radio, but can’t recall where and can’t vouch for its accuracy, but it seems reasonable given what we do know, based on such-and-such. That tells the reader how much weight (if any) to give to the statement, based in part on the person posting’s reputation in general. But just flatly stating such-and-such is true without more, as Gobb was doing, isn’t acceptable. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2025, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gobb-is-pitted/1023604/76 "2025-10-02T23:55:35Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > When Gobb announced that firefighters were right-wing paramilitary groups, however, that was a deliberate derailment in progress and an excellent point at which to lock the thread IMO. Yeah, but I’d question whether that’s an issue of trolling or an issue that he freaked out, when he started to get some serious answers that didn’t match what he’d been told would be the response he’d expect. People say some crazy shit when they panic. ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2025, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gobb-is-pitted/1023604/77 "2025-10-03T00:12:25Z")
> [@WalterBishop](#): > > To the best of my knowledge, about half the country would most likely agree with every single word **Gobb** posted Cite, please? (Yes, I know we’re in the Pit. I’m not really expecting one.) And, even if true, it’s irrelevant. > [@WalterBishop](#): > > It’s just one of those things that everyone knows Oh, good grief. “Everyone knows” lots of things that ain’t so. It’s if anything more important to check cites on something you think is common knowledge; because the more you think it’s common knowledge the less likely you are to have actually thought about it. ---
**Author:** ![Spoons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spoons/32/3141_2.png) [@Spoons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoons)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2025, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gobb-is-pitted/1023604/78 "2025-10-03T00:25:48Z")
Good points @thorny_locust . I frequently see the “everyone knows” argument on a predominantly right-wing message board that I look in on from time to time. Somebody posts something obviously wrong, claiming that “everyone knows” it to be true. Example: Poster A: “Everyone knows that the moon is made of green cheese.” Poster B: “Got a cite for that?” Poster A: “I don’t need one. Everyone knows that.” Thankfully, that doesn’t work here. (Aside: Was anybody else confused by Gobb’s use of the word, “paramilitary”? At first, I was, because I thought he was referring to groups like the Proud Boys.) ---
**Author:** ![DMC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dmc/32/18049_2.png) [@DMC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DMC)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2025, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gobb-is-pitted/1023604/79 "2025-10-03T00:42:55Z")
> [@Spoons](#): > > Aside: Was anybody else confused by Gobb’s use of the word, “paramilitary”? I believe that his definition for the word is something along the lines of “A rigidly-hierarchically-organized killing machine that favors straight MAGA men of a caucasian persuasion” or something similar. ---
**Author:** ![robby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robby/32/11048_2.png) [@robby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robby)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2025, 12:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gobb-is-pitted/1023604/80 "2025-10-03T00:47:48Z")
> [@Spoons](#): > > (Aside: Was anybody else confused by Gobb’s use of the word, “paramilitary”? At first, I was, because I thought he was referring to groups like the Proud Boys.) Yes, especially when he then said he was including _fire departments_ in that group. I had the same reaction to that as I did when in the original _Red Dawn_ movie, the Boy Scouts were described as an “elite paramilitary organization.” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gobb-is-pitted/1023604.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gobb-is-pitted/1023604.md?page=5)