# Goblins webcomic discussion **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [March 3, 2010, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goblins-webcomic-discussion/531075 "2010-03-03T02:04:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2010, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goblins-webcomic-discussion/531075/161 "2010-11-01T21:11:31Z")
> [@](#): > > 4th Edition allows for paladins of any alignment - though I think they need to be the same alignment as the deity they serve. Well, no, 4th edition doesn’t allow for, say, Lawful Evil paladins, or Chaotic Neutral ones. ---
**Author:** ![Mister\_Rik](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mister_rik/32/491_2.png) [@Mister\_Rik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mister_Rik)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2010, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goblins-webcomic-discussion/531075/162 "2010-11-01T22:15:46Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Well, no, 4th edition doesn’t allow for, say, Lawful Evil paladins, or Chaotic Neutral ones. Only because there are at this time no LE or CN deities in the core rules. I don’t think either of those even _exist_ as alignments in 4th Ed. You’ve got Lawful Good and Good on one side, and Chaotic Evil and Evil on the other, with “Unaligned” in the middle. Five alignments in 4th Ed. vs. nine in previous editions. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2010, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goblins-webcomic-discussion/531075/163 "2010-11-01T23:00:02Z")
Right, exactly. In 4th edition, apparently, it’s impossible to be lawful without being good, and impossible to be chaotic without being evil. ---
**Author:** ![Mister\_Rik](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mister_rik/32/491_2.png) [@Mister\_Rik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mister_Rik)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goblins-webcomic-discussion/531075/164 "2010-11-02T00:00:57Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Right, exactly. In 4th edition, apparently, it’s impossible to be lawful without being good, and impossible to be chaotic without being evil. I got the impression, back when 4E launched, that a large part of the reason for doing away with “Chaotic Neutral” was that there were entirely too many 3.5 players who interpreted that alignment to mean “My character can do whatever the !@#$ they want to do! Ha-HAH!” Judging by the posts I read on the official forums, as well as the group I played with, that observation wasn’t too far off. Basically, anybody who wasn’t a paladin (LG) or a wizard (Lawful-Something) or dual-scimitar-wielding drow ranger (CG) picked CN. Chaotic Neutral had become the refuge of those unable or unwilling to roleplay. CN became an excuse for any and all in-character behavior. “I’m just roleplaying my alignment!” “No you’re not, you’re being a dick.” 😛 I can sort of understand rolling all the various Neutral alignments into “Unaligned”, but I don’t really get why we couldn’t keep LE and CG. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goblins-webcomic-discussion/531075/165 "2010-11-02T00:26:29Z")
nm ---
**Author:** ![Lynn\_Bodoni](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e47c2d/32.png) [@Lynn\_Bodoni](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lynn_Bodoni)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goblins-webcomic-discussion/531075/166 "2010-11-02T00:40:10Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > I’m all for having divine champions of all alignments, but I don’t like them all being paladins. I’d rather see completely different powers and abilities for champions of different causes. Most Chaotic Neutral champions, for instance, should probably be roguelike, not fighter-like. A CN champion of war, of course, would still be fighter-like, but would probably be even more like a barbarian than like a fighter. > > For the current strip, I see three outcomes: > 1: Chief slows down Kore enough for the others to escape, and dies heroically in the process. > 2: Chief fights Kore, and through the miracle of Santa Clause DMing, manages to actually defeat him. > 3: Chief doesn’t even attempt to fight Kore, but instead convinces him to go after the greatest evil in the world first (possibly assisted by use of Detect Alignment-type spells). > > Of these three, I think the first is by far the most likely, since the strip needs villains, and two of the three main villains are already defeated. I had an awesome DM once who had paladins/gods’ champions for all the alignments. This DM also allowed clerics of certain gods to use certain sharp, pointy weapons. Clerics of war gods were allowed to use any weapon they felt like, and were considered to have at least some proficiency in any weapon. His reasoning was that the blunt weapon restriction was on clerics in some Christian sects, and it made no sense at all for a champion of Mars to NOT know how to use a sword, spear, or any other weapon. Mars would certainly approve of his champions knowing how to use these weapons, and using them as effectively as possible. As for the outcome…THunt has shown that he WILL kill off his characters, even main characters, if the story calls for it. I fully expect Kin to be killed off. I mean, I want a happy ending for her, but I think that the story will call for her tragic death. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 1:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goblins-webcomic-discussion/531075/167 "2010-11-02T01:12:10Z")
My favorite outcome would be for Kore to see that Ears has the axe, and is wielding it in the manner of a paladin. And then his head assplodes. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2010, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goblins-webcomic-discussion/531075/168 "2010-11-02T02:57:17Z")
> [@Lynn\_Bodoni](#): > > I had an awesome DM once who had paladins/gods’ champions for all the alignments. There was actually a Dragon Magazine article about that way back in the 80s. A different “champion” for each alignment. ---
**Author:** ![One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/838e76/32.png) [@One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/One_And_Only_Wanderers)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2010, 8:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goblins-webcomic-discussion/531075/169 "2010-11-04T08:56:08Z")
Huh. hadn’t seen that coming > **[Goblins -](https://www.goblinscomic.com/11022010-2/)** > > Goblins is the story of a fantasy rpg through the eyes of the low-level monsters. Good luck chief! ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2010, 9:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goblins-webcomic-discussion/531075/170 "2010-11-04T09:22:10Z")
> [@Mister\_Rik](#): > > I haven’t seen him demonstrate _any_. Even his “Detect Evil” seems to be more “Is it a ‘monster’? EVIL!” All his “powers” seem to be just fancy gadgets. He(?) _did_ use some kind of Speak With Dead magic pellets with the goblin lady [way back when](http://www.goblinscomic.com/03252006/). That’s more than a mechanical gadget; I’m not sure if that spell uses a material component or if Kore just has a huge supply of Speak-With-Dead magic pellets from…somewhere. Which would bring up the question of who Kore’s supplier is… Interestingly I note that she refers to Kore as “cursed”. As for alignment, I could see Kore as Lawful Neutral rather than evil. “Kill everything vaguely resembling evil or that comes into contact with it” is a very Lawful attitude; Kore has a procedure, and follows that procedure regardless of consequences. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2010, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goblins-webcomic-discussion/531075/171 "2010-11-04T20:08:28Z")
> [@](#): > > I had an awesome DM once who had paladins/gods’ champions for all the alignments. This DM also allowed clerics of certain gods to use certain sharp, pointy weapons. Clerics of war gods were allowed to use any weapon they felt like, and were considered to have at least some proficiency in any weapon. His reasoning was that the blunt weapon restriction was on clerics in some Christian sects, and it made no sense at all for a champion of Mars to NOT know how to use a sword, spear, or any other weapon. Mars would certainly approve of his champions knowing how to use these weapons, and using them as effectively as possible. Sure, absolutely, as long as you put in other similarly-minor restrictions instead. I had a 2nd edition gnome cleric-thief who was restricted by his vows to only the thief base weapon list, who could thus use a short sword or dagger but who was not allowed to use a morningstar. He never could understand why the clerics who gleefully splattered brains with holy abandon got all squeamish about a nice clean dagger through the ribs. And yes, there are some folks who insist on playing as Chaotic Crazy, just like there are some who insist on playing Lawful Stupid, but they’ll play that way whether there’s a label for it or not. To the extent that it’s the game designer’s job at all to curtail it, you do it by giving better examples of what the different alignments are or can be. Someone like Jayne from Firefly, for instance, is a pretty good example of CN, but he doesn’t act variable-speed corn muffins randomly. ---
**Author:** ![One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/838e76/32.png) [@One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/One_And_Only_Wanderers)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2010, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goblins-webcomic-discussion/531075/172 "2010-11-06T18:18:39Z")
I’m hoping the others come back and save Chief!! > **[Goblins -](https://www.goblinscomic.com/11052010-2/)** > > Goblins is the story of a fantasy rpg through the eyes of the low-level monsters. ---
**Author:** ![Yllaria](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yllaria/32/3452_2.png) [@Yllaria](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yllaria)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2010, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goblins-webcomic-discussion/531075/173 "2010-11-08T22:42:42Z")
> [@One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](#): > > Huh. hadn’t seen that coming > > [Goblins -](http://www.goblinscomic.com/11022010-2/) > > Good luck chief! I keep forgetting how short the goblins are. Chief looks tiny next to a dwarf. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Controvert](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/dec6dc/32.png) [@The\_Controvert](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Controvert)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2010, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goblins-webcomic-discussion/531075/174 "2010-11-12T16:37:10Z")
A new Tempts Fate is out. How long before we get the showdown between Tempts Fate and Kore that the fans have been clamoring for? ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2010, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goblins-webcomic-discussion/531075/175 "2010-11-12T21:06:21Z")
I’m not sure I’ve decoded it correctly If I’m correct it reads ‘This door is not the real door email [noparse]goblins@dccnet.com[/noparse] for the real door’ but I’ve yet to receive a response from that email address ---
**Author:** ![Snifit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/5fc32e/32.png) [@Snifit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snifit)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2010, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goblins-webcomic-discussion/531075/176 "2010-11-12T21:47:42Z")
I read it a little differently, as: [spoiler]“This door is an illusion email [goblins@dccnet.com](mailto:goblins@dccnet.com) for the real door”, but same idea. I sent an email out 5 hours ago, still no reply.[/spoiler] ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2010, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goblins-webcomic-discussion/531075/177 "2010-11-12T22:07:40Z")
Sorry, you’re correct. Not sure why I typed the first part so wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2010, 8:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goblins-webcomic-discussion/531075/178 "2010-11-13T08:52:02Z")
Seems I was correct. I think the key for the top of the broken tower is 6+4+19. I think the key for the sword is 16+10+20 I think the key for the keyhole looped by the dragon’s tail is 12+2+1 But I’ve yet to spot the 4th keyhole. I think it’s behind the plain shield bottom left (same orange border as the visible keyholes) and the only matching set left is 8+15+21. ---
**Author:** ![Finagle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/b19c9b/32.png) [@Finagle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Finagle)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2010, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goblins-webcomic-discussion/531075/179 "2010-11-17T01:01:45Z")
> [@Quartz](#): > > When did Kore actually demonstrate any paladin powers? Sure he calls himself a paladin… In today’s strip, he does a “Lay on hands”. Although the special effects are as far from representing a benevolent deity as one could imagine. So the mystery remains… ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2010, 1:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goblins-webcomic-discussion/531075/180 "2010-11-17T01:12:51Z")
> [@Quartz](#): > > Seems I was correct. > > I think the key for the top of the broken tower is 6+4+19. > I think the key for the sword is 16+10+20 > I think the key for the keyhole looped by the dragon’s tail is 12+2+1 > > But I’ve yet to spot the 4th keyhole. I think it’s behind the plain shield bottom left (same orange border as the visible keyholes) and the only matching set left is 8+15+21. Sorry, but I don’t understand anything about that post. Is this still Tempts Fate 10 you’re talking about? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goblins-webcomic-discussion/531075.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goblins-webcomic-discussion/531075.md?page=10)