# God must be a sadist **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 25, 2012, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/god-must-be-a-sadist/645080 "2012-12-25T01:04:35Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2013, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/god-must-be-a-sadist/645080/141 "2013-01-14T23:53:57Z")
> [@Sitnam](#): > > Those are for drowning. No, [kittens are for huffing](http://uncyclopedia.wikia.com/wiki/Kitten_Huffing). ---
**Author:** ![pchaos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/258eb7/32.png) [@pchaos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pchaos)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2013, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/god-must-be-a-sadist/645080/142 "2013-01-14T23:54:02Z")
I would ignore God’s right hand man. I believe that evil Christians exist. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2013, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/god-must-be-a-sadist/645080/143 "2013-01-14T23:59:34Z")
> [@pchaos](#): > > Look, I do not respond to challenges posed by men, I only respond to challenges posed by God and by life. Then call it a question instead of a challenge. Nobody’s asking you to do anything, they’re posing an ethical dilemma. And I’ll do it again, possibly just for my own health: would you mind answering those questions I asked you a few posts ago? ---
**Author:** ![pchaos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/258eb7/32.png) [@pchaos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pchaos)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2013, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/god-must-be-a-sadist/645080/144 "2013-01-15T00:07:40Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Most of the people you are talking to - maybe all of them - don’t believe in God, so it stands to reason they don’t want God to do anything. They want you to explain your opinion. I assume you are talking about Islamic Extremists. I really don’t know enough about Islam to comment. However, I’m willing to venture that a religious war or a Jihad is only permitted in a limited context. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2013, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/god-must-be-a-sadist/645080/145 "2013-01-15T00:09:02Z")
Convenient to only have to answer to someone who is historically unlikely to ever call you onto the carpet… ---
**Author:** ![Razncain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/9d8465/32.png) [@Razncain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Razncain)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2013, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/god-must-be-a-sadist/645080/146 "2013-01-15T00:10:28Z")
> [@pchaos](#): > > Well, in that case, I will ignore it. > > Look, I do not respond to challenges posed by men, I only respond to challenges posed by God and by life. [God]Pchaos, listen here you sniveling little ingrate, that is my challenge. Go back and read my book because in I Thessalonians 5:21 my dear Paul instructs of you what I expect you to do. “Prove all things.” Don’t make me come down there! Make me look good, and I’ll let you sit in Jesus’ lap.[/God] ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2013, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/god-must-be-a-sadist/645080/147 "2013-01-15T00:12:06Z")
> [@pchaos](#): > > I assume you are talking about Islamic Extremists. I’m not. They’re one group of people that could be described that way, but I’m asking about any hypothetical group of people who believe God supports war, torture, bigotry, and killing people for believing the wrong thing. > [@](#): > > I really don’t know enough about Islam to comment. What you know about Islam doesn’t matter because I’m not asking about Islam. I am asking about your opinion of God and your opinion of people who think God supports things that you obviously think God does not support. > [@](#): > > However, I’m willing to venture that a religious war or a Jihad is only permitted in a limited context. Again, not the issue - are you looking for technicalities so you don’t have to answer? Or are you saying that killing innocent people or abusing women and children is OK if it’s only done in a limited context? That doesn’t jibe with what you’ve been saying. ---
**Author:** ![pchaos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/258eb7/32.png) [@pchaos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pchaos)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2013, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/god-must-be-a-sadist/645080/148 "2013-01-15T00:16:17Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > Convenient to only have to answer to someone who is historically unlikely to ever call you onto the carpet… I suppose you are referring to God. I don’t believe that at all. I believe that prayer is a two-way street. In other words, it’s not just me asking God to help me, through prayer God gives me guidance. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2013, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/god-must-be-a-sadist/645080/149 "2013-01-15T00:18:28Z")
> [@pchaos](#): > > I suppose you are referring to God. I don’t believe that at all. I believe that prayer is a two-way street. In other words, it’s not just me asking God to help me, through prayer God gives me guidance. And surprise, surprise, God just happens to agree with you about everything. That’s why God is so convenient as a guide. ---
**Author:** ![Meatros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Meatros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meatros)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2013, 12:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/god-must-be-a-sadist/645080/150 "2013-01-15T00:24:41Z")
> [@pchaos](#): > > I would ignore God’s right hand man. > > I believe that evil Christians exist. Joshua wasn’t a Christian (a quibble, I admit), however he was/is considered Holy. Further there are points in the narrative where God actively helps defeating Joshua’s enemies (at one point hurling boulders at them) while the people were running away. So do you think the book of Joshua is a Satanic interpolation? I actually find it rather consistent ith the Bible God - remember he killed everyone on earth (babies included) during the flood. Joshua, and his men, slaughtering innocents is completely in line with that. On what moral ground can you stand when you say you won’t listen to Gods champion? ---
**Author:** ![Meatros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Meatros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meatros)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2013, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/god-must-be-a-sadist/645080/151 "2013-01-15T00:32:38Z")
Do you approve of Gods actions with Joshua? Joshua 10:11 And it came to pass, as they fled from before Israel, and were in the going down to Bethhoron, that the LORD cast down great stones from heaven upon them unto Azekah, and they died: they were more which died with hailstones than they whom the children of Israel slew with the sword. So you would presumably deny Joshua, but what if God told you to do these things in the challenge? Then is it okay? ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2013, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/god-must-be-a-sadist/645080/152 "2013-01-15T00:34:55Z")
> [@pchaos](#): > > . . . I am not interested in God doing things my way. I am His servant and not the other way around. Fair enough, and I won’t make rules for you to follow. But I figure my way is better than God’s way, and if a mere mortal schlub like me can see that, then there’s something damn serious wrong with God if he can’t. Ever see a Ph.D. College Prof make a simple arithmetic mistake, or mess up a bit of geography, or misspell a word? God isn’t exempt from this kind of blunder. I may be a mere Freshman, but I can spot an error once in a while. “The Problem of Pain” is God’s big dork-headed blunder. (All subjunctively speaking; personally, I don’t believe in the big fat stupid lug, any more than I believe in Santa Claus, and for about the same reason.) ---
**Author:** ![pchaos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/258eb7/32.png) [@pchaos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pchaos)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2013, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/god-must-be-a-sadist/645080/153 "2013-01-15T00:57:47Z")
> [@Trinopus](#): > > But I figure my way is better than God’s way, and if a mere mortal schlub like me can see that, then there’s something damn serious wrong with God if he can’t. Fair enough, but if your grandson was accidentally shot by friendly fire in combat, what are you going to tell grieving parents. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2013, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/god-must-be-a-sadist/645080/154 "2013-01-15T01:00:28Z")
> [@pchaos](#): > > Fair enough, but if your son was accidentally shot by friendly fire in combat, what are you going to tell grieving parents. 😕 How many angers are in a banana? You tell them he was shot by friendly fire in combat because his command fucked up. What does this have to do with the sadism of God? ---
**Author:** ![pchaos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/258eb7/32.png) [@pchaos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pchaos)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2013, 1:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/god-must-be-a-sadist/645080/155 "2013-01-15T01:27:03Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > How many angers are in a banana? You tell them he was shot by friendly fire in combat because his command fucked up. What does this have to do with the sadism of God? Are you going to tell them God is sadistic. Are they going to be happier after you give them your explanation. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2013, 1:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/god-must-be-a-sadist/645080/156 "2013-01-15T01:31:59Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > **pchaos** says The Second Coming is just a metaphor, so taking the Eden story literally doesn’t make sense. And it doesn’t address the core issue anyway. He appears to think that Jesus is important in redeeming our supposed sins. If there is no Adam and Eve, there is no one to have made a choice to sin the first time. If God made us sinners at heart, then God would be a real dick to condemn us for it unless we believe in someone God sent to absolve the sins he made us have. So all of Christianity pretty much falls apart as a rational moral system without them. And he brought them up. ---
**Author:** ![Razncain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/9d8465/32.png) [@Razncain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Razncain)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2013, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/god-must-be-a-sadist/645080/157 "2013-01-15T02:11:00Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > He appears to think that Jesus is important in redeeming our supposed sins. If there is no Adam and Eve, there is no one to have made a choice to sin the first time. That’s a very good point. No literal Adam and Eve, then what is all this sin business about that got started in the first place? There are plenty of scriptures that indicate Jesus and the other writers give the impression Adam and Eve were real people. Also, in many places Adam is included in the genealogy lists. Elsewhere, Jesus gives impressions that Jonah and the whale (great fish) story actually happened as did Noah and the flood story too. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2013, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/god-must-be-a-sadist/645080/158 "2013-01-15T02:16:13Z")
> [@pchaos](#): > > Are you going to tell them God is sadistic. Most likely the subject won’t come up at all. About the only time I hear that sort of thing come up when in regards to grieving family member is when some believer starts going on about how their dead relative was gay or the wrong religion or such and is now burning in hell. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2013, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/god-must-be-a-sadist/645080/159 "2013-01-15T03:10:53Z")
Nobody is suggesting that grieving families be told “God is sadistic,” **pchaos**. We’re discussing the nature of a God that does or allows these kinds of things. ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2013, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/god-must-be-a-sadist/645080/160 "2013-01-15T03:21:55Z")
> [@pchaos](#): > > Fair enough, but if your grandson was accidentally shot by friendly fire in combat, what are you going to tell grieving parents. The truth. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/god-must-be-a-sadist/645080.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/god-must-be-a-sadist/645080.md?page=9)