# Goddammit (Warhammer 40K) **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [February 9, 2012, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goddammit-warhammer-40k/612311 "2012-02-09T14:57:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2012, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goddammit-warhammer-40k/612311/41 "2012-02-13T21:23:21Z")
Of course what would be even better from an MBT perspective is a Land Raider that sacrificed carrying capacity to mount a battle gun on the front (plus two TLLC!). I know why they don’t from a balance perspective, but I don’t see any reason why it should be technically infeasible. ---
**Author:** ![mlees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@mlees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mlees)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2012, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goddammit-warhammer-40k/612311/42 "2012-02-13T21:51:48Z")
> [@Ludovic](#): > > Of course what would be even better from an MBT perspective is a Land Raider that sacrificed carrying capacity to mount a battle gun on the front (plus two TLLC!). I know why they don’t from a balance perspective, but I don’t see any reason why it should be technically infeasible. Reading some of the novels out there, it seems that the Space Marines are very very very very tied to tradition. Even to the point of religiosity. It seems that technology has essentially stagnated for millennia. (And there is always the worry about the taint of Chaos infecting even inanimate objects.) Magic is as real a force in their universe as technology is. ---
**Author:** ![Sierra\_Indigo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f0a364/32.png) [@Sierra\_Indigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sierra_Indigo)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2012, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goddammit-warhammer-40k/612311/43 "2012-02-13T21:53:38Z")
> [@CandidGamera](#): > > My codexes should get here today or tomorrow, I think, so let me review, but yeah, I might take you up on that. > > And I have to confess, one of the reasons Imperial Guard tempted me was because I’ve been reading on 1d4chan about the legends of Ursarkar Creed.. (AKA “Creeeeeeeeeeed!”) An excerpt from [Abaddon at the Therapist](http://1d4chan.org/wiki/Abaddon_at_the_Therapist) (Spoiler for Bigness)[spoiler] > [@](#): > > Abaddon chuckled. “Kharn’s one swell guy. Always sees the best in things.” > > The counselor was, for the first time in her life, speechless. She just didn’t know what to say to that tale. She leaned forwards, adjusting her glasses. > > “So yeah,” said Abaddon, “the stress. What was it you were asking me about ag…ain…” he trailed off as he noticed a glint in her eyes. Abruptly, he realized – the belching smoke, the grimy tracks, the slowly rotating turret- > > His psychotherapist was a Leman Russ Demolisher. > > Roaring, he leapt off the couch as a flurry of heavy bolter rounds tore it to shreds. Lightning wreathed the Talon of Horus, and he dropped into a crouch, cursing himself for not realizing it sooner. He dodged to the side as the turret fired, sending a demolisher shell straight through the window of the office. > > … > > To replace his counselor with a Leman Russ without him knowing could only have been pulled off by some kind of tactical genius- > > “CREEEEEEED!” bellowed Abaddon as he charged after the tank. > > … > > Using the Talon as a shovel, he dug his way through the tank until he came to the crew compartment. Instead of finding the smashed and ruined body of his nemesis, though… there was a note. Frowning, he picked it up. > > Dear Abaddon the Despoiler, If you thought this was good, wait until you see what I did to your flagship. > > Yours sincerely, > > Ursakar E. Creed > “CRREEEEEEEEEEEEED!” [/spoiler] > [@Ludovic](#): > > Of course what would be even better from an MBT perspective is a Land Raider that sacrificed carrying capacity to mount a battle gun on the front (plus two TLLC!). I know why they don’t from a balance perspective, but I don’t see any reason why it should be technically infeasible. Because that’s Heresy. Seriously. All equipment in the Imperium of Man is built to exacting specifications laid down either during or before the Dark Age of Technology, and things like Land Raiders are built from Standard Template Constructs, which are essentially great big 3 printers that make lego kits for tanks and such. To alter the form of something that is built from an STC is the direst form of tech-heresy, and the Techpriests of Mars are willing to go to war to destroy heretek. Plus altering the machine will offend its Machine Spirit, and you don’t want to know how many hours/days/months of prayer and ritual cleansing it requires to get a stroppy Machine Spirit back into line. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2012, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goddammit-warhammer-40k/612311/44 "2012-02-13T22:06:09Z")
All of that is BS. I know the supposed reasons for it, but the real reason is game balance. In a similar vein, everyone is fighting each other all the time, not because the authors think grimdark enhances the story, but because it gives people an excuse of why their forces can fight each other. ---
**Author:** ![Sierra\_Indigo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f0a364/32.png) [@Sierra\_Indigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sierra_Indigo)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2012, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goddammit-warhammer-40k/612311/45 "2012-02-13T22:09:41Z")
Yes, from an external standpoint it’s for game balance. But from an in-universe standpoint, that is the reason. ---
**Author:** ![smiling\_bandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2012, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goddammit-warhammer-40k/612311/46 "2012-02-13T23:16:42Z")
> [@Sierra\_Indigo](#): > > But from an in-universe standpoint, that is the reason. They’ve got dozens of official and unofficial modifications. The “in-game” reality varies from pag to page, let alone book to book. ---
**Author:** ![GreedySmurf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a698b9/32.png) [@GreedySmurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreedySmurf)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2012, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goddammit-warhammer-40k/612311/47 "2012-02-14T01:30:14Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > Actually, that’s only GW’s second best game. The best is and always will be _Necromunda_. IIRC they made the rules open source a while back, too. > > ETA: yup, [there they are](http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/content/article.jsp?aId=5300010&_requestid=1817425). Nuh ah! 😉 I’ve played plenty of Necromunda to. But the old, “I can see enough of him”, “no you can’t” got a bit wearing after a while 😃 To me the biggest drawcard, and the main reason why I never bothered with 40k is the development aspect to BB & Necromunda. To those not in the know, in BB/Necro your gang/team develops, your players get new skills and abilities. It’s not a simple min/max exercise based upon how many points are fighting today. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2012, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goddammit-warhammer-40k/612311/48 "2012-02-14T01:39:41Z")
I’ve never played Necromunda, but yes, I prefer BB to WH40K not only due to the long-term-campaign possibilities of it but also because there is no arguing over measurements or LOS. ---
**Author:** ![smiling\_bandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2012, 2:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goddammit-warhammer-40k/612311/49 "2012-02-14T02:50:18Z")
Why are they so slow, anyway? Games Workshop manages to put out something like two codexes a year. Given the actual pagecount, that’s not very much actual game material, much of which is just the same unit reprinted multiple times. Why does it take them so long to move on anything? ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2012, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goddammit-warhammer-40k/612311/50 "2012-02-14T03:44:37Z")
Plastic marked up that high buys a lot of H. ---
**Author:** ![CandidGamera](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/candidgamera/32/2878_2.png) [@CandidGamera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CandidGamera)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2012, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goddammit-warhammer-40k/612311/51 "2012-02-14T15:49:31Z")
> [@FinnAgain](#): > > Plastic marked up that high buys a lot of H. 😃 It certainly does. Of course, GW will be pissed off when their dealers start giving them New Finecast Heroin instead of the old kind.. ---
**Author:** ![CandidGamera](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/candidgamera/32/2878_2.png) [@CandidGamera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CandidGamera)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2012, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goddammit-warhammer-40k/612311/52 "2012-02-14T16:11:33Z")
Checked UPS tracking - Orks, Blood Angels, and Space Marine codexes should arrive today. Whee! ---
**Author:** ![mlees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@mlees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mlees)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2012, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goddammit-warhammer-40k/612311/53 "2012-02-14T17:04:03Z")
> [@CandidGamera](#): > > Checked UPS tracking - Orks, Blood Angels, and Space Marine codexes should arrive today. Whee! Heh. Did you hold up a couple of pinwheels when you did that? ---
**Author:** ![CandidGamera](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/candidgamera/32/2878_2.png) [@CandidGamera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CandidGamera)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2012, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goddammit-warhammer-40k/612311/54 "2012-02-14T17:24:00Z")
> [@mlees](#): > > Heh. Did you hold up a couple of pinwheels when you did that? If I did, you can’t prove it. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2012, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goddammit-warhammer-40k/612311/55 "2012-02-14T19:21:40Z")
> [@Sierra\_Indigo](#): > > Plus altering the machine will offend its Machine Spirit, and you don’t want to know how many hours/days/months of prayer and ritual cleansing it requires to get a stroppy Machine Spirit back into line. Ah yes, the Litany of Percussive Maintenance 😛 > [@Greedy Smurf](#): > > I’ve played plenty of Necromunda to. But the old, “I can see enough of him”, “no you can’t” got a bit wearing after a while 😃 True. But in _Blood Bowl_, can you fling the other guy’s super expensive Heavy Bolter guy off a third floor catwalk with a shotgun slug ? No, no you can’t. Enjoy the trip down, bitch ! Crowd surfing Gutter Runners just doesn’t offer that kind of satisfaction :). Gang fouling War Dancers is close though. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2012, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goddammit-warhammer-40k/612311/56 "2012-02-14T19:23:04Z")
Watching treemen trip over their own roots and explode into splinters on impact can be pretty satisfying, too. ---
**Author:** ![Sierra\_Indigo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f0a364/32.png) [@Sierra\_Indigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sierra_Indigo)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2012, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goddammit-warhammer-40k/612311/57 "2012-02-14T21:41:41Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > Ah yes, the Litany of Percussive Maintenance 😛 There’s a running joke in my Rogue Trader group about the pending 40k MMO, and the potential of having a Techpriest class and the required four-hour litanies just to open a door or fire a weapon 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![CandidGamera](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/candidgamera/32/2878_2.png) [@CandidGamera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CandidGamera)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2012, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goddammit-warhammer-40k/612311/58 "2012-02-15T14:59:59Z")
Dammit. UPS handed it off to the Postal Service for the last leg of the delivery - so although it was two miles from my house yesterday morning, it won’t get there until today. That’s odd, though - I see a UPS truck near my house fairly frequently. I wonder why the hand-off? ---
**Author:** ![CandidGamera](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/candidgamera/32/2878_2.png) [@CandidGamera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CandidGamera)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2012, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goddammit-warhammer-40k/612311/59 "2012-02-15T15:06:53Z")
Incidentally, I finally opened my copy of Assault on Black Reach - and apparently, there’s at least one mistake. It came with two copies of the digest rulebook. Bonus? ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2012, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goddammit-warhammer-40k/612311/60 "2012-02-15T17:13:24Z")
One for you, one for your opponent maybe ? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goddammit-warhammer-40k/612311.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goddammit-warhammer-40k/612311.md?page=4)