# Gods sabbath day SAVED! **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 25, 2009, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gods-sabbath-day-saved/518937 "2009-11-25T19:07:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2009, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gods-sabbath-day-saved/518937/21 "2009-11-25T21:18:09Z")
1. No, I’m an atheist 2. I was raised a protestant Christian, so I was taught Sunday was the Sabbath, and it really didn’t mean much except that was the day I had to go to church, which I mostly hated. ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2009, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gods-sabbath-day-saved/518937/22 "2009-11-25T21:37:42Z")
> [@FlyingDoDo](#): > > Do you believe that Christians must observe to keep Gods sabbath day (friday sundown till saturday sundown) in order to be saved to the kingdom? The scriptures say yes you do. What have you been taught? The law is spiritual, not physical: > [@](#): > > Romans 7:14 > We know that the law is spiritual; but I am unspiritual, sold as a slave to sin. The violation is not of the physical sabbath, as we see that both King David and Jesus both violated the physical sabbath but held blameless in the eyes of God. The law was basically ‘training wheels’ that we try to obey in the physical, once we get the Holy Spirit, He instructs us, and one is given grace and can on occasion violate the law. A good way to put it is under grace don’t let the law (written code) get in the way of doing the will of God. There are times when God will give us rest, other times we will work for Him, other times suffer for Him. This is in the personal relationship we get with our Father. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2009, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gods-sabbath-day-saved/518937/23 "2009-11-25T21:59:50Z")
> [@FlyingDoDo](#): > > Lets take a look at the “tree of life” [Al Pacino as John Milton] Take a look… but don’t touch! Touch… but don’t taste! Taste… but don’t swallow! Ah ha ha ha ha!!! [/Al Pacino as John Milton] ---
**Author:** ![FlyingDoDo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e68b1a/32.png) [@FlyingDoDo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlyingDoDo)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2009, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gods-sabbath-day-saved/518937/24 "2009-11-25T22:26:14Z")
Twas a good movie ---
**Author:** ![FlyingDoDo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e68b1a/32.png) [@FlyingDoDo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlyingDoDo)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2009, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gods-sabbath-day-saved/518937/25 "2009-11-25T22:29:08Z")
> [@The\_Hamster\_King](#): > > Ah, but which written word? > > Just the Torah? > The full Bible? > The Koran? > The Book of Mormon? The full bible ---
**Author:** ![The\_Hamster\_King](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8edcca/32.png) [@The\_Hamster\_King](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Hamster_King)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2009, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gods-sabbath-day-saved/518937/26 "2009-11-25T22:33:34Z")
> [@FlyingDoDo](#): > > The full bible Do you have any particular reason for preferring that written word over the others? ---
**Author:** ![FlyingDoDo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e68b1a/32.png) [@FlyingDoDo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlyingDoDo)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2009, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gods-sabbath-day-saved/518937/27 "2009-11-25T22:34:05Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > The law is spiritual, not physical: Yes it is kanicbird 2 COR. 3 [6] WHO ALSO HATH MADE US ABLE MINISTERS OF THE NEW TESTAMENT; NOT OF THE LETTER, BUT OF THE SPIRIT: FOR THE LETTER KILLETH, BUT THE SPIRIT GIVETH LIFE. [7] BUT IF THE MINISTRATION OF DEATH, WRITTEN AND ENGRAVEN IN STONES, WAS GLORIOUS, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away: [8] HOW SHALL NOT THE MINISTRATION OF THE SPIRIT BE RATHER GLORIOUS? [9] For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory. [10] For even that which was made glorious had no glory in this respect, by reason of the glory that excelleth. [11] FOR IF THAT WHICH IS DONE AWAY WAS GLORIOUS, MUCH MORE THAT WHICH REMAINETH IS GLORIOUS. As we can see in above scripture we are now to walk in the spirit of the law. If we walk in only the letter of the law this will lead to death, but if we walk in the spirit of the law this leads to life. ROMANS 7 [6] But now we are DELIVERED FROM THE LAW, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should SERVE IN NEWNESS OF SPIRIT, AND NOT IN THE OLDNESS OF THE LETTER. In Romans youll find the same thing being said. Keep the law in newness of spirit and be delivered from the (curse) of the letter. Did Jesus explain how we are to walk in newness of the spirit? Sure did. MATTHEW 5 [20] For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven. [21] Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, THOU SHALT NOT KILL; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment: [22] BUT I SAY UNTO YOU, THAT WHOSOEVER IS ANGRY WITH HIS BROTHER WITHOUT A CAUSE SHALL BE IN DANGER OF THE JUDGMENT: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire. OLD LETTER- Thou shalt not kill NEW SPIRIT- Don’t even get angry. Call no man a fool. Love one another in thought, word and deed. MATTHEW 5 [27] Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, THOU SHALT NOT COMMIT ADULTERY: [28] BUT I SAY UNTO YOU, THAT WHOSOEVER LOOKETH ON A WOMAN TO LUST AFTER HER HATH COMMITTED ADULTERY WITH HER ALREADY IN HIS HEART. OLD LETTER- Thou shalt not commit adultery NEW SPIRIT- Do not look on a woman to lust. Keep the law in our mind and spirit. Even in our eyes. So you can see that Jesus did not do away with the letter of the law. Common sense will tell ya in order to walk in the spirit of the law you must also be walking in the letter. Can you commit the very act of adultry and then claim you have not sinned because you did not lust after her with your eyes because they were closed. Jesus made the commandments even harder to keep and more honorable. ISAIAH 42 [20] Seeing many things, but thou observest not; opening the ears, but he heareth not.[21] The LORD is well pleased for his righteousness’ sake; HE WILL MAGNIFY THE LAW, and make it honourable. Yes, Jesus magnified the law. He took the letter of the law (which leads to death) and magnified the law to a spiritual level (which leads to life). Aint the WORD of God great ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2009, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gods-sabbath-day-saved/518937/28 "2009-11-25T22:35:17Z")
> [@FlyingDoDo](#): > > Aint the WORD of God great Eh. It’s okay I guess. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Kobayashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4af34b/32.png) [@Mr.Kobayashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Kobayashi)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2009, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gods-sabbath-day-saved/518937/29 "2009-11-25T22:35:29Z")
So, if a child curses their parents they should be put to death, right? Exodus 21:17. ---
**Author:** ![FlyingDoDo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e68b1a/32.png) [@FlyingDoDo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlyingDoDo)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2009, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gods-sabbath-day-saved/518937/30 "2009-11-25T22:42:32Z")
> [@Mr.Kobayashi](#): > > Probably a point worth mentioning, one that’s probably been mentioned over and over again; if you give credence to what scriptures say you are on a slippery slope of either immorality or creating your own custom religion by ‘picking and choosing’ which bits of scripture you want to follow. Thing is Mr. K because i follow no worldly religion i need not pick and choose bits of certain scriptures that fit their doctrines nor do a song and dance around any of the scriptures. I just read em and believe them. They all do fit together as a great puzzle if you do so. ---
**Author:** ![FlyingDoDo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e68b1a/32.png) [@FlyingDoDo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlyingDoDo)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2009, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gods-sabbath-day-saved/518937/31 "2009-11-25T22:47:31Z")
> [@Mr.Kobayashi](#): > > So, if a child curses their parents they should be put to death, right? Exodus 21:17. When Adam and Eve ate of the forbiden peach tree in the midst of the garden they were also told they would die. They did not die. Physical, no. Spiritual, yes? I wreck n sow. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2009, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gods-sabbath-day-saved/518937/32 "2009-11-25T22:49:48Z")
> [@FlyingDoDo](#): > > Thing is Mr. K because i follow no worldly religion i need not pick and choose bits of certain scriptures that fit their doctrines nor do a song and dance around any of the scriptures. Everyone picks and chooses. Some are unable to admit it to themselves or others, however. > [@](#): > > I just read em and believe them. Do you think everybody here is going to do the same with your posts? > [@FlyingDoDo](#): > > peach tree in the midst of the garden they were also told they would die. They did not die. Physical, no. Spiritual, yes? I wreck n sow. There you have it: that’s picking and choosing. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2009, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gods-sabbath-day-saved/518937/33 "2009-11-25T22:52:11Z")
> [@Polycarp](#): > > If you’re going to witness based on “what the Scriptures say,” proof is useful. In point of fact, Paul specifies what is required to “be saved”: “if you confess with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you confess and are saved. As the Scripture says, ‘Anyone who trusts in him will never be put to shame.’” (Romans 10:9-11) > > In this context, Paul is very explicit that obedience to the Law is not salvific. What is, is taking Jesus as Lord, confessing Him aloud, and keeping His commandments. And what those commandments are, is made quite clear in the Gospels, cf. Matthew 7:12 and 22:34-40. In fact, Paul makes it clear in Galatians that attempting to save onesel by keeping the Law is making the Atonement void. > > Now, you were saying…? I’m going to print this out, stick it to the reverse side of my ACLU “What to do when you’re stopped by the police” card, and I’ll be ready for anything. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Kobayashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4af34b/32.png) [@Mr.Kobayashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Kobayashi)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2009, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gods-sabbath-day-saved/518937/34 "2009-11-25T22:52:24Z")
> [@FlyingDoDo](#): > > Thing is Mr. K because i follow no worldly religion i need not pick and choose bits of certain scriptures that fit their doctrines nor do a song and dance around any of the scriptures. I just read em and believe them. They all do fit together as a great puzzle if you do so. Not sure what you mean by ‘worldly religion’ - I’m assuming you mean every other religion other than Christianity (which must, by necessity, be man made and ‘worldly’)? As to the song and dance and picking and choosing - you’re choosing to obey the Biblical commandment to keep the Sabbath holy. But you choose not to obey the Biblical commandment to put unruly children to death (and there’s a lot more I could have picked - that’s just one example of something I hope you, as a moral person, would never do). On what basis do you obey the former, but ignore the latter? I’m glad that you do, but let’s not pretend that it has anything do to with the scripture itself, since you’re wilfully ignoring bits of it. On the fruit of the garden (I don’t believe the type of fruit is ever mentioned, but I could be wrong), there you have one massive ‘gotcha!’ right at the start - with no knowledge of right and wrong (that was gained from eating the fruit) Eve could not possibly have known that disobeying God was wrong. ---
**Author:** ![FlyingDoDo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e68b1a/32.png) [@FlyingDoDo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlyingDoDo)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2009, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gods-sabbath-day-saved/518937/35 "2009-11-25T22:53:07Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > So, **FlyingDoDo** , out of all the commandments in Scripture, what made you focus on this one to start a thread about? Well Thudlow Boink, i guess its because its the one commandment that is ignored by all. If i was to start a thread on whether we would all be saved if we were all to kill our mother in laws…bad example. But you get my drift ---
**Author:** ![Strassia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e8c25b/32.png) [@Strassia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Strassia)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2009, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gods-sabbath-day-saved/518937/36 "2009-11-25T22:55:44Z")
> [@FlyingDoDo](#): > > When Adam and Eve ate of the forbiden peach tree in the midst of the garden they were also told they would die. They did not die. Physical, no. Spiritual, yes? I wreck n sow. As I understand the common interpretation, you have it backwards. Prior to eating the fruit A&E would have been physically unaging, and after were doomed to grow old and die physically. They were not soulless husks after leaving the garden and I believe they are considered to have gone to heaven. So I have to ask, do you eat pepperoni pizza? Have any undies that are a cotton poly blend? Eat pork or shrimp? Do you follow all of the commandants, or just some? Why is this one more important than the others? Jonathan ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2009, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gods-sabbath-day-saved/518937/37 "2009-11-25T23:06:20Z")
> [@FlyingDoDo](#): > > Well Thudlow Boink, i guess its because its the one commandment that is ignored by all. Not Seventh Day Adventists! ---
**Author:** ![The\_Hamster\_King](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8edcca/32.png) [@The\_Hamster\_King](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Hamster_King)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2009, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gods-sabbath-day-saved/518937/38 "2009-11-25T23:07:46Z")
> [@FlyingDoDo](#): > > Well Thudlow Boink, i guess its because its the one commandment that is ignored by all. Don’t be silly. Most orthodox Jews and even many conservative and reform Jews keep the Sabbath. It’s far more widely observed than many of the commandments. “Do you observe all the mitzvot?” “Not yet.” 😃 ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2009, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gods-sabbath-day-saved/518937/39 "2009-11-25T23:07:55Z")
> [@Strassia](#): > > As I understand the common interpretation, you have it backwards. Prior to eating the fruit A&E would have been physically unaging, and after were doomed to grow old and die physically. They were not soulless husks after leaving the garden and I believe they are considered to have gone to heaven. Last time I checked, Christian tradition held that Adam and Eve went to hell. They remained there til Jesus rescued them in the Harrowing Of Hell. Back To The Op I’ve been taught that all you gentiles are mistaken, but some of you are awfully nice people. ---
**Author:** ![Punoqllads](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/d2c977/32.png) [@Punoqllads](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Punoqllads)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2009, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gods-sabbath-day-saved/518937/40 "2009-11-25T23:13:55Z")
> [@FlyingDoDo](#): > > Well Thudlow Boink, i guess its because its the one commandment that is ignored by all. Actually, I’m pretty sure that Deuteronomy 22:22 is ignored more often. At least, I hope it is. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gods-sabbath-day-saved/518937.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gods-sabbath-day-saved/518937.md?page=3)