# Going to Germany this summer. How much Neo-Naziism will we encounter? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [June 19, 2014, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/going-to-germany-this-summer-how-much-neo-naziism-will-we-encounter/691146 "2014-06-19T15:11:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![rowrrbazzle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rowrrbazzle/32/414_2.png) [@rowrrbazzle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rowrrbazzle)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2014, 5:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/going-to-germany-this-summer-how-much-neo-naziism-will-we-encounter/691146/61 "2014-06-22T05:30:07Z")
> [@Dangerosa](#): > > Especially compared to the U.S. Where almost every business flies a U.S. Flag, every government building, and many many private homes year round. Where in the USA do you live? I live in Chicago, and I know a lot of car dealerships display the flag, but other than that offhand I can’t recall seeing any, so they’re relatively rare. I definitely know of exactly one home that flies a flag, and I happen to know that because it’s across the street from a public library I often go to. Under the USA flag it also flies a flag of another country but I can’t remember which one. ---
**Author:** ![Green\_Bean](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/green_bean/32/1760_2.png) [@Green\_Bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Green_Bean)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2014, 5:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/going-to-germany-this-summer-how-much-neo-naziism-will-we-encounter/691146/62 "2014-06-22T05:32:16Z")
> [@rowrrbazzle](#): > > Where in the USA do you live? I live in Chicago, and I know a lot of car dealerships display the flag, but other than that offhand I can’t recall seeing any, so they’re relatively rare. I definitely know of exactly one home that flies a flag, and I happen to know that because it’s across the street from a public library I often go to. Under the USA flag it also flies a flag of another country but I can’t remember which one. My kid went through a phase where he pointed out every single American flag he saw. Trust me, there are a LOT out there that you’re not noticing. And this is central Jersey – not exactly a hotbed of jingoistic patriotism. ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2014, 6:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/going-to-germany-this-summer-how-much-neo-naziism-will-we-encounter/691146/63 "2014-06-22T06:10:14Z")
Yeah, I did that once, too. I used to think there weren’t that many, and then I decided to actually count. In several parts of town, it’s difficult to go 200 feet without being in sight of a flag. They’re so common, you don’t really notice anymore. They just blend in. ---
**Author:** ![Accidental\_Martyr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ce7236/32.png) [@Accidental\_Martyr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Accidental_Martyr)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2014, 6:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/going-to-germany-this-summer-how-much-neo-naziism-will-we-encounter/691146/64 "2014-06-22T06:20:01Z")
> [@rowrrbazzle](#): > > Where in the USA do you live? I live in Chicago, and I know a lot of car dealerships display the flag, but other than that offhand I can’t recall seeing any, so they’re relatively rare. I definitely know of exactly one home that flies a flag, and I happen to know that because it’s across the street from a public library I often go to. Under the USA flag it also flies a flag of another country but I can’t remember which one. It’s very common in the south. My FIL has a flag flying in his front yard. I also know of at least 3 houses within a couple of miles of mine that have Confederate flags flying in the front yard. ---
**Author:** ![NinjaChick](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/71c47a/32.png) [@NinjaChick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NinjaChick)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2014, 11:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/going-to-germany-this-summer-how-much-neo-naziism-will-we-encounter/691146/65 "2014-06-23T11:36:56Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > My brother lived in Manheim for 3 years. Not only did he see no evidence of neo or regular Nazis, but he was tut-tuted for a very mild joke that made some reference to Nazis. I’m an American Jew who spent two and a half years in rural Bavaria. Never once saw the slightest indication of any Neo-Nazism at all, whatsoever. Similar to your brother, I did once get an absolute death-stare for making a really mild (and admittedly lame) Nazi joke\*. I’d go and get drunk and wander around Berlin alone at ungodly hours, and I think it’s the safest I’ve ever felt in a major city on any possible scale. \*What sort of weather did the Nazis love the most? Heil! So yeah, I deserved the death stare regardless, but my friend’s German girlfriend was _really_ not amused. ---
**Author:** ![Cartooniverse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cartooniverse/32/3084_2.png) [@Cartooniverse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cartooniverse)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2014, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/going-to-germany-this-summer-how-much-neo-naziism-will-we-encounter/691146/66 "2014-06-23T15:09:34Z")
All of the replies that stick to the OP query and inform me as to the mood of the country are most appreciated and of great use. I’ll be all over the country, to answer the question as to where I’m going. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2014, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/going-to-germany-this-summer-how-much-neo-naziism-will-we-encounter/691146/67 "2014-06-23T15:26:51Z")
> [@Cartooniverse](#): > > I’ll be all over the country, to answer the question as to where I’m going. Then it appears you’ll be fine, since “all over the country” is where neo-Nazis are overwhelmingly not a problem. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2014, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/going-to-germany-this-summer-how-much-neo-naziism-will-we-encounter/691146/68 "2014-06-23T15:38:20Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > Then it appears you’ll be fine, since “all over the country” is where neo-Nazis are overwhelmingly not a problem. If you are looking for it everyone with short hair turns into a skinhead. ---
**Author:** ![qubed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f07891/32.png) [@qubed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/qubed)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2014, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/going-to-germany-this-summer-how-much-neo-naziism-will-we-encounter/691146/69 "2014-06-23T19:33:01Z")
[An amusing article out today.](http://www.rollingstone.com/culture/news/heil-hipster-the-young-neo-nazis-trying-to-put-a-stylish-face-on-hate-20140623) But, finally, some stats: > [@](#): > > In their latest 2013 report, the Bundesverfassungschutz concluded that there are approximately 22,000 members of the extreme right in Germany, including 9,600 who are “willing to engage in violence.” According to official statistics,they committed 473 violent crimes against foreigners last year — a shocking 20 percent rise over the previous year. ---
**Author:** ![Mops](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mops/32/16494_2.png) [@Mops](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mops)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2014, 12:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/going-to-germany-this-summer-how-much-neo-naziism-will-we-encounter/691146/70 "2014-06-24T12:14:19Z")
A breakdown on numbers of extremists can be found on this summary (PDF) of the 2013 report of the Office for the Protection of the Constitution (_Bundesamt für Verfassungsschutz_) Graphics on politically-motivated crimes of violence in 2012/2013 [Right-wing violence](http://img.welt.de/img/deutschland/crop129218307/4300716520-ci3x2l-w580-aoriginal-h386-l0/DWO-POL-Links-Rechtsextreme-Gewalt-Teaser.jpg) Translation of bar captions, with the 2013 numbers: - Total (801) - Xenophobic violent crimes (473) - Violent crimes against left-wing extremists or supposed left-wing extremists (146) - Violent crimes against other political opponents (52) - anti-semitic violent crimes (45) [Left-wing violence](http://img.welt.de/img/deutschland/crop129218308/9190716520-ci3x2l-w580-aoriginal-h386-l0/DWO-POL-Links-Rechtsextreme-Gewalt-Aufm-Kopie.jpg) Translation of bar captions, with the 2013 numbers - Total (1110) - Violent crimes against police/other security forces (632) - Violent crimes against right-wing extremists or supposed right-wing extremists: (566) - other (151) So, 473 xenophobic violent crimes against about 16 millions of immigrants and decendants of immigrants to Germany, 632 anti-right violent crimes against about 23,000 right-wing extremists. ---
**Author:** ![Mops](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mops/32/16494_2.png) [@Mops](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mops)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2014, 12:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/going-to-germany-this-summer-how-much-neo-naziism-will-we-encounter/691146/71 "2014-06-24T12:29:50Z")
Sorry, should read “566 anti-right violent crimes against about 23,000 right-wing extremists.” - I read from the wrong column. Anyway, **gracer** ’s comment upthread is pertinent. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Kobayashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4af34b/32.png) [@Mr.Kobayashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Kobayashi)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2014, 12:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/going-to-germany-this-summer-how-much-neo-naziism-will-we-encounter/691146/72 "2014-06-24T12:33:27Z")
If I may add a tangent for our more well-travelled dopers… How far do the ‘neo-’ ideas go in the other former Axis countries - Italy and Japan, specifically? Never been to Japan, but in Italy I never came across any hints of neo-Fascism (nor did I see any trace of neo-Nazism in Germany). However, Mussolini isn’t treated with the near universal disgust that Hitler is in Germany despite the fact that he dragged Italy into a bloody, destructive war that could have been avoided. That said at least he wasn’t a racist shithead like Hitler was, probably why he has a tomb and Hitler doesn’t. What about Japan - how deep does the WWII nationalism/bushido still go? ---
**Author:** ![Cartooniverse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cartooniverse/32/3084_2.png) [@Cartooniverse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cartooniverse)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2014, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/going-to-germany-this-summer-how-much-neo-naziism-will-we-encounter/691146/73 "2014-07-23T00:55:43Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > Then it appears you’ll be fine, since “all over the country” is where neo-Nazis are overwhelmingly not a problem. Opposed to [France.](http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2014/07/22/france-jewish-shops-riot_n_5608612.html). This isn’t The Pit. I wish it was. I’d be allowed to use language appropriate to this moment. However, it’s IMHO. So, IMHO, those of you who were so bemused at my queries regarding Anti-Jewish and Neo-Nazi sentiments in Germany- and within the EU- need to shush the heck up and read the real news. “Gas The Jews” isn’t some made-up paranoid froth. It’s a direct quote. I must only pray that Germany isn’t interested in entertaining the same level of Anti-Semitism. Despite precedent. ---
**Author:** ![Cartooniverse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cartooniverse/32/3084_2.png) [@Cartooniverse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cartooniverse)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2014, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/going-to-germany-this-summer-how-much-neo-naziism-will-we-encounter/691146/74 "2014-07-23T01:02:41Z")
[So much for praying. Germany is now hosting anti-Jewish rallies as well.](http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/israel-gaza-crisis-german-protesters-chant-gas-jews-anti-israel-rallies-1457714) [Video Proof.](http://www.tabletmag.com/scroll/179842/berlin-protesters-chant-jew-jew-cowardly-pig-come-on-out-and-fight) So. Either I am remarkably good at PhotoShop, or my OP- much derided and mocked- turns out to be a spot-on concern regarding travel in Germany. **Greenbean** , I’ll be happy to accept that apology whenever you get around to it. :dubious: This is gonna be a shitty overseas journey. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2014, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/going-to-germany-this-summer-how-much-neo-naziism-will-we-encounter/691146/75 "2014-07-23T01:30:46Z")
If you’re that worried, then why are you even going? ---
**Author:** ![Accidental\_Martyr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ce7236/32.png) [@Accidental\_Martyr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Accidental_Martyr)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2014, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/going-to-germany-this-summer-how-much-neo-naziism-will-we-encounter/691146/76 "2014-07-23T01:47:01Z")
If I was afraid of being killed or injured I would just stay at home. ---
**Author:** ![Cartooniverse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cartooniverse/32/3084_2.png) [@Cartooniverse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cartooniverse)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2014, 1:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/going-to-germany-this-summer-how-much-neo-naziism-will-we-encounter/691146/77 "2014-07-23T01:53:17Z")
Long-standing family commitment. ---
**Author:** ![Cartooniverse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cartooniverse/32/3084_2.png) [@Cartooniverse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cartooniverse)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2014, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/going-to-germany-this-summer-how-much-neo-naziism-will-we-encounter/691146/78 "2014-07-23T02:09:56Z")
> [@Accidental\_Martyr](#): > > If I was afraid of being killed or injured I would just stay at home. No. Nothing as dramatic as that. I started this thread because of my fears about going back to Germany- the nation that gleefully murdered a lot of my descendants. And how irrational that felt after all of these decades. The common theme of response in here has been that I was pretty much paranoid beyond belief. Kinda wondering what the fuck the response is now that “Gas The Jews” and “Jew Pigs” has been video recorded and spread for the globe to bear witness to. I am hopeful that the trip will be entirely uneventful for myself and my family. Then again, since my last name is one of the 12 Tribes of Israel, well… I’ll find out when a hotel manager or car rental agent takes a long look at me and decides to make use of their right to free speech… My concerns are meaningless. What is happening to citizens of Germany and France is of great meaning. ---
**Author:** ![jtur88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e9c0ed/32.png) [@jtur88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jtur88)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2014, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/going-to-germany-this-summer-how-much-neo-naziism-will-we-encounter/691146/79 "2014-07-23T03:59:35Z")
Since you’re going yourself, why not just go, and then when you get home, come back to this thread andn post your observations? Or are you afraid you might be affected by neo-nazism while you are visiting, and you’re wondering if you have to take any defensive precautions to insulate yourself from its harmful effects? ---
**Author:** ![Erdosain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/erdosain/32/7284_2.png) [@Erdosain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Erdosain)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2014, 4:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/going-to-germany-this-summer-how-much-neo-naziism-will-we-encounter/691146/80 "2014-07-23T04:12:13Z")
> [@Cartooniverse](#): > > I am hopeful that the trip will be entirely uneventful for myself and my family. Then again, since my last name is one of the 12 Tribes of Israel, well… I’ll find out when a hotel manager or car rental agent takes a long look at me and decides to make use of their right to free speech… I’m glad you’ve already planned out your persecution in your head. Just keep an eye out for any roving bands of masons; they’ll molest you as soon as look at you. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/going-to-germany-this-summer-how-much-neo-naziism-will-we-encounter/691146.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/going-to-germany-this-summer-how-much-neo-naziism-will-we-encounter/691146.md?page=5)