# "Goodbye, Farewell and Amen" **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [November 29, 2008, 6:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goodbye-farewell-and-amen/474897 "2008-11-29T06:20:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2008, 6:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goodbye-farewell-and-amen/474897/1 "2008-11-29T06:20:43Z")
I just watched the finale of M_A_S\*H, for the first time since it first aired in 1983. There were only two things that I remembered over those 25 years: The woman on the bus with the “chicken,” and the five musicians who played Mozart’s Clarinet Quintet . . . the two most heartbreaking parts of the episode. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2008, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goodbye-farewell-and-amen/474897/2 "2008-11-29T14:47:47Z")
Truly a great episode and a great finale to an amazing show. My favorite moment: When Hawkeye says “Goodbye” to BJ at the end and BJ refuses to do the same, it looks like it’s heading for an unresolved ending. Hawk gets in the helicopter and sees that BJ has written “Goodbye” in stones. Two good friends, who will most likely never see each other again. ---
**Author:** ![aldiboronti](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@aldiboronti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aldiboronti)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2008, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goodbye-farewell-and-amen/474897/3 "2008-11-29T17:33:08Z")
I guess I’m in the minority. For me MASH finished when Trapper John and Colonel Blake left and it became the Alan Alda Show. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2008, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goodbye-farewell-and-amen/474897/4 "2008-11-29T19:30:05Z")
> [@aldiboronti](#): > > I guess I’m in the minority. For me MASH finished when Trapper John and Colonel Blake left and it became the Alan Alda Show. It definitely changed then, but I don’t think it totally became the Alan Alda show until later. It was never as funny as it was in the first three seasons, but it added some depth to characters. It has some great episodes, most of which aren’t too preachy. Col. Potter is one of the best characters in television history, IMHO. Harry Morgan played him so naturally, it was just amazing. ---
**Author:** ![jali](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ecae2f/32.png) [@jali](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jali)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2008, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goodbye-farewell-and-amen/474897/5 "2008-11-29T19:44:11Z")
I loved MASH when it originally aired, but I’ve come to really dislike Alan Alda and I can’t watch the show anymore. All I remember from the finale was the lady with the “chicken” on the bus. I cried. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2008, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goodbye-farewell-and-amen/474897/6 "2008-11-29T19:45:39Z")
I watched this when it was originally broadcast. Almost. Halfway through the cable went out and stayed out. It was probably 15 years later before I finally saw it. ---
**Author:** ![Alias](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a88e4f/32.png) [@Alias](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alias)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2008, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goodbye-farewell-and-amen/474897/7 "2008-11-30T01:11:20Z")
I really love MASH, but I’ve also grown to hate Alan Alda. I’ve never understood how he came to have so much control on that show. Hawkeye was a great character, but not the greatest character ever. MASH was at it’s best when it was an ensemble cast. Too many episodes were Hawkeye-centric as the show progressed. I will say though, that Goodbye, Farewell, and Amen is WAY better than many of the episodes that preceded it. It’s a near-perfect finale. ---
**Author:** ![UncleRojelio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/unclerojelio/32/3160_2.png) [@UncleRojelio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleRojelio)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2008, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goodbye-farewell-and-amen/474897/8 "2008-11-30T01:21:58Z")
> [@jali](#): > > All I remember from the finale was the lady with the “chicken” on the bus. I cried. Somebody please remind me about the lady and the chicken. I’m missing whole decades from my life and the MASH finale occurred during one of them. ---
**Author:** ![usar\_jag](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/f0a364/32.png) [@usar\_jag](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/usar_jag)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2008, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goodbye-farewell-and-amen/474897/9 "2008-11-30T01:30:52Z")
Hawkeye starts out the episode in a mental ward of an Army hospital. He remembers leaving some R&R on a bus. While heading back to the 4077th, they pick up wounded soldiers, and some Korean refugees. The bus is forced to pull off the road to avoid a Chinese patrol. Everyone on the bus has to be quiet, but one of the refugees has a chicken that was making noise. The refugee killed the chicken to ensure their safety. However, it comes to light that Hawkeye was suppressing the fact that the refugee killed her own baby and not a chicken to protect everyone. ---
**Author:** ![freckafree](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/freckafree/32/3050_2.png) [@freckafree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/freckafree)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2008, 1:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goodbye-farewell-and-amen/474897/10 "2008-11-30T01:40:53Z")
> [@panache45](#): > > I just watched the finale of M_A_S\*H, for the first time since it first aired in 1983. There were only two things that I remembered over those 25 years: The woman on the bus with the “chicken,” and the five musicians who played Mozart’s Clarinet Quintet . . . the two most heartbreaking parts of the episode. I didn’t see the rerun, and those two incidents are the only thing I remember, too. In fact, whenever I hear the Mozart clarinet quintet, I always think of the M_A_S\*H finale. ---
**Author:** ![UncleRojelio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/unclerojelio/32/3160_2.png) [@UncleRojelio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleRojelio)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2008, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goodbye-farewell-and-amen/474897/11 "2008-11-30T02:22:02Z")
> [@usar\_jag](#): > > Hawkeye starts out the episode in a mental ward of an Army hospital. He remembers leaving some R&R on a bus. While heading back to the 4077th, they pick up wounded soldiers, and some Korean refugees. The bus is forced to pull off the road to avoid a Chinese patrol. Everyone on the bus has to be quiet, but one of the refugees has a chicken that was making noise. The refugee killed the chicken to ensure their safety. > > However, it comes to light that Hawkeye was suppressing the fact that the refugee killed her own baby and not a chicken to protect everyone. See, that’s just weird. I remember the scene but I don’t associate it with the finale. And in my version, there was no chicken, it was a baby all along. Bizarre. ---
**Author:** ![Kamino\_Neko](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kamino_neko/32/34_2.png) [@Kamino\_Neko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kamino_Neko)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2008, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goodbye-farewell-and-amen/474897/12 "2008-11-30T02:41:13Z")
The finale’s been aired as several regular episodes at least occasionally. I’d assume you caught one of them. (I had the same ‘wait…’ moment before, myself. Although it was catching the finale as a whole and being confused by them doing that story ‘again’.) ---
**Author:** ![John\_DiFool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_difool/32/19543_2.png) [@John\_DiFool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_DiFool)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2008, 2:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goodbye-farewell-and-amen/474897/13 "2008-11-30T02:44:46Z")
I don’t really see a lot of this “Alda-centric” stuff in later seasons that the CW assumes dominated the latter run of the show. Each season might have a Potter ep., a Klinger ep., a Hot Lips ep., etc. The characters are less the cardboard cut outs they were early on, and more like real persons. And the show managed to pull off a lot of funny gags later in the run anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2008, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goodbye-farewell-and-amen/474897/14 "2008-11-30T03:22:40Z")
I really thought it became too Alda-centric in later seasons, and was running on fumes plot-wise. I think it was _60 Minutes_ which had a behind-the-scenes special on _M_A_S_H\* late in the show’s run. I remember they showed the writers’ bullpen, the bulletin board of which was filled with 3x5 cards of various story nuggets, some of which were incredibly picayune, like Alda’s ability to do a pretty convincing fake sneeze (which, sure enough, they built an episode around). The series finale was great, though. ---
**Author:** ![Moirai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/96bed5/32.png) [@Moirai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moirai)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2008, 4:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goodbye-farewell-and-amen/474897/15 "2008-11-30T04:02:39Z")
> [@UncleRojelio](#): > > See, that’s just weird. I remember the scene but I don’t associate it with the finale. And in my version, there was no chicken, it was a baby all along. Bizarre. IIRC, they cut back and forth between the “party scene” in Hawkeye’s mind (“pass that bottle back” and at first it was a wine bottle, then it was an IV bottle) and what was actually happening. Hawkeye was blocking out the horror of screaming at the woman to shut that “thing” up before they all got killed, and then seeing that she smothered her own baby to save them. It was stunningly well done. ---
**Author:** ![laughingboy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9f8e36/32.png) [@laughingboy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/laughingboy)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2008, 4:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goodbye-farewell-and-amen/474897/16 "2008-11-30T04:12:28Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > Alda’s ability to do a pretty convincing fake sneeze (which, sure enough, they built an episode around). Was that the one where Hawkeye has this psychosomatic illness with lots of sneezing and itching that was triggered by the smell of moldy clothes? That was actually one of my favorite episodes. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2008, 4:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goodbye-farewell-and-amen/474897/17 "2008-11-30T04:42:05Z")
> [@laughingboy](#): > > Was that the one where Hawkeye has this psychosomatic illness with lots of sneezing and itching that was triggered by the smell of moldy clothes?.. Yes, I think it was. ---
**Author:** ![cmkeller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmkeller/32/118_2.png) [@cmkeller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmkeller)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2008, 7:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goodbye-farewell-and-amen/474897/18 "2008-11-30T07:13:36Z")
The problem toward the end of M_A_S\*H was not that it became to Alda-centric, or even too preachy. The problem was that they forgot how to end with a decent punch line. I remember one episode - I think the framing device was one of the main characters writing a letter home - and one of the mini-plots was that Colonel Potter was trying to score 32 basketball free-throws in a row, and was continually getting frustrated. The last scene of the episode had Potter run into the room (Swamp? Mess? wherever) and happily shout “Thirty two!” Without context, it’s meaningless, and even with context, it doesn’t pack any punch. Not comedic, not tragic. It just is. That’s how most episodes from the last three seasons or so were. That said, the finale was amazing. ---
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2008, 11:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goodbye-farewell-and-amen/474897/19 "2008-11-30T11:14:30Z")
> [@freckafree](#): > > I didn’t see the rerun, and those two incidents are the only thing I remember, too. In fact, whenever I hear the Mozart clarinet quintet, I always think of the M_A_S\*H finale. I always cry when I hear it. I remember Charles smashing his recording after learning about the musicians’ deaths. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2008, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goodbye-farewell-and-amen/474897/20 "2008-11-30T18:22:12Z")
> [@panache45](#): > > I always cry when I hear it. I remember Charles smashing his recording after learning about the musicians’ deaths. “They weren’t soldiers. They were musicians.” David Ogden Stiers is a great actor. My favorite MASH moment of all time is post-Trapper. An ambulance leaves the 4077th to take the wounded elsewhere. It rolls over because it is going to fast and chaos breaks out. Potter comes out yelling at them. He says, “Where is that damn driver? It’s not his job to get them there the fastest. It’s his job to get them there alive! Where is he so I can tell him off!” Radar says, **“He’s dead, sir.”** The look on Harry Morgan’s face when he realizes the driver dead is priceless. He looks like he was hit with a ton of bricks. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goodbye-farewell-and-amen/474897.md?page=2)