# GOP still trending to win Senate **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [August 13, 2014, 10:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-still-trending-to-win-senate/695426 "2014-08-13T10:52:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 59
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2014, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-still-trending-to-win-senate/695426/1161 "2014-11-03T21:39:09Z")
> [@Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](#): > > I’ve got my popcorn ready. > > When Obama starts vetoing bills passed by Congress, will that make him an obstructionist? If Harry Reid filibusters a bill he sponsored (like Mitch McConnell did), that would make him an obstructionist. A Presidential veto is obstructionism? Really? Please. More generally, I suspect that in the event of a Republican Senate takeover, the Dems will be more obstructionist than they were the last time they were in the minority. To do otherwise would be immoral: you shouldn’t pussyfoot with those who cavalierly break norms. No: you punch back. Hard. The question is whether the Republicans will embrace the system that the Founding Fathers bequeath us: compromise is an underlying assumption. If McConnell is the majority leader, I seriously doubt it. ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2014, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-still-trending-to-win-senate/695426/1162 "2014-11-03T21:42:26Z")
I wouldn’t expect anything to get done with the Republicans (or Democrats) in charge of the Senate (which is fine with me, frankly). The real question is Obama appointments which need Senate confirmation. I would expect the SCOTUS ruling on recess appointments and the Democratic “Nuclear Option” manuever will make the Republicans more hardline than they would otherwise have been. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2014, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-still-trending-to-win-senate/695426/1163 "2014-11-03T21:52:01Z")
> [@Fotheringay-Phipps](#): > > I wouldn’t expect anything to get done with the Republicans (or Democrats) in charge of the Senate (which is fine with me, frankly). That’s a very ignorant position to have. It presumes that there is no work for congress to do. It’s magical thinking. > [@](#): > > The real question is Obama appointments which need Senate confirmation. I would expect the SCOTUS ruling on recess appointments and the Democratic “Nuclear Option” manuever will make the Republicans more hardline than they would otherwise have been. My bad on this part. I was mistaken. Edit. ---
**Author:** ![Ann\_Hedonia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ann_hedonia/32/319_2.png) [@Ann\_Hedonia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ann_Hedonia)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2014, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-still-trending-to-win-senate/695426/1164 "2014-11-03T22:00:56Z")
> [@DigitalC](#): > > I think the republicans are likely to barely take the senate but it wouldn’t be a huge unthinkable upset if they didn’t. While I’m sort of resigned to a Republican senate win, I saw a ray of hope this weekend. I found out that all the members of my lifelong Republican Romney voting family in NC are not only voting for Kay Hagan, but actively encouraging all their friends to do the same. ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2014, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-still-trending-to-win-senate/695426/1165 "2014-11-03T22:09:44Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > That’s a very ignorant position to have. It presumes that there is no work for congress to do. It’s magical thinking. It does not presume that. It presumes that congress is as likely or more likely to make things worse as to make things better. And I think your position is equally ignorant if not more so. So there. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2014, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-still-trending-to-win-senate/695426/1166 "2014-11-03T22:20:31Z")
> [@Fotheringay-Phipps](#): > > make the Republicans more hardline than they would otherwise have been. I almost hate to ask, but how is that even possible? ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2014, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-still-trending-to-win-senate/695426/1167 "2014-11-03T22:58:17Z")
> [@Fotheringay-Phipps](#): > > The real question is Obama appointments which need Senate confirmation. I would expect the SCOTUS ruling on recess appointments and the Democratic “Nuclear Option” manuever will make the Republicans more hardline than they would otherwise have been. I don’t think the Republicans would be any “nicer” had the Democrats not changed the rule, but even if they are, it’s still worth it. Hopefully, they’ll revert to the old talking filibuster – I hope the Democrats force this, should the Republicans take the Senate. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2014, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-still-trending-to-win-senate/695426/1168 "2014-11-03T23:28:49Z")
> [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#): > > The question is whether the Republicans will embrace the system that the Founding Fathers bequeath us: compromise is an underlying assumption. If McConnell is the majority leader, I seriously doubt it. McConnell has pledged to allow the minority to offer amendments. THat’s a big step up. Harry Reid has spent the last six years trying to preserve his majority by sparing his red state Democrats tough votes. That’s no way to run a legislative body. He obstructed his own majority more than the Republicans ever did, plus he denied red state Democrats’ constituents the ability to know who their Senators actually were. And it’s why all these Democrats voted with Obama 96% of the time or whatever: because they never got a chance to vote “no” on tough issues. ALthough I’m sure they wouldn’t. I happen to think that except for Manchin, they are all loyal liberal Democrats when in DC. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2014, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-still-trending-to-win-senate/695426/1169 "2014-11-03T23:31:06Z")
Appointments will actually get easier. Reid was protecting his red staters from those votes too. What you should actually be afraid of is Democrats keeping the Senate. At least a Republican Senate and House gives us clarity as to what they stand for, as well as what the more moderate and conservative Dems stand for. If Reid stays as majority leader, it’ll just be two more years of not holding votes on anything that might jeopardize their majority in 2016. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2014, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-still-trending-to-win-senate/695426/1170 "2014-11-03T23:52:56Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > I don’t think the Republicans would be any “nicer” had the Democrats not changed the rule, but even if they are, it’s still worth it. Hopefully, they’ll revert to the old talking filibuster – I hope the Democrats force this, should the Republicans take the Senate. I expect the Democrats will be re-discovering that the filibuster is a critical and necessary bulwark against the tyranny of the majority. I mean re-re-discovering. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2014, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-still-trending-to-win-senate/695426/1171 "2014-11-03T23:54:36Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > I expect the Democrats will be re-discovering that the filibuster is a critical and necessary bulwark against the tyranny of the majority. > > I mean re-re-discovering. Good – I want it used so often that the Republicans finally get rid of it in its current incarnation, should they take the Senate. Whatever gets rid of the filibuster, or reverts it to a talking filibuster, is good for America. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2014, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-still-trending-to-win-senate/695426/1172 "2014-11-04T00:00:17Z")
Huh, and I thought [Thomas Reed](http://www.bloombergview.com/articles/2013-11-22/harry-reid-s-house-doppelganger) killed off the filibuster over a hundred years ago. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2014, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-still-trending-to-win-senate/695426/1173 "2014-11-04T00:05:02Z")
I don’t particularly see why the Dems need to filibuster a lot. If they don’t like it, Obama won’t sign it, and the Senate can try to override. The solution invokes the ghost of Saul Alinsky: register new voters. Follow every stinking two-bit rule they come up with, and register them anyway. Pile 'em up, stack 'em high. Because if 99% of the people vote, we won’t have to worry what the 1% want… ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2014, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-still-trending-to-win-senate/695426/1174 "2014-11-04T00:08:17Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > Huh, and I thought [Thomas Reed](http://www.bloombergview.com/articles/2013-11-22/harry-reid-s-house-doppelganger) killed off the filibuster over a hundred years ago. > [@](#): > > …Reed replied, “The Chair is making a statement of fact that the gentleman from Kentucky is present. Does he deny it?”… Procedural poetry. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2014, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-still-trending-to-win-senate/695426/1175 "2014-11-04T00:08:48Z")
> [@Fotheringay-Phipps](#): > > It does not presume that. It presumes that congress is as likely or more likely to make things worse as to make things better. Which, is of course, nonsense. Why even have a government if unthinking inaction is better or as good as reasoned action? It’s the political equivalent of “Jesus Take the Wheel!” > [@](#): > > And I think your position is equally ignorant if not more so. So there. Your position is, “Whatever, let it coast.” My position is, “Man the wheel and steer appropriately.” That you think yours is equally valid, is goofy. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2014, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-still-trending-to-win-senate/695426/1176 "2014-11-04T00:11:02Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > I expect the Democrats will be re-discovering that the filibuster is a critical and necessary bulwark against the tyranny of the majority. > > I mean re-re-discovering. One cup of chocolate milk is a nice thing. Nothing but chocolate milk turns you into the diabetic version of Jabba the Hut. The filibuster isn’t inherently stupid. It’s inherently stupid to nail it to the floor in the on position. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2014, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-still-trending-to-win-senate/695426/1177 "2014-11-04T03:49:09Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > I expect the Democrats will be re-discovering that the filibuster is a critical and necessary bulwark against the tyranny of the majority. > > I mean re-re-discovering. True. And that furthermore when norms are shattered, behavior ratchets. Similarly Republicans will call for “Straight up or down votes.” I have the data to back me up. When the Republicans are in the minority, cloture votes increase. When Democrats are in the minority… they level up to where the Republicans were. What they don’t do is dial it back. Then Republicans join the minority and make things worse. Again. [Chart](http://www.brookings.edu/blogs/brookings-now/posts/2013/11/chart-recent-history-of-senate-cloture-votes-to-end-filibusters) And conservatives never grasp the concept of being a _sleaze innovator_. Instead the bray about, “Both sides doing it”, like the guy who resists arrests and wonders why he got pummeled by the cops. But will Harry Reid filibuster bills that he sponsored? No, he has integrity, unlike McConnell. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2014, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-still-trending-to-win-senate/695426/1178 "2014-11-04T04:04:32Z")
McConnell won’t avoid votes to protect Mark Kirk and Susan Collins. Nor will he fill up the amendment tree. Filibustering your own bill isn’t a lack of integrity, it’s just using a procedural gimmick. Avoiding tough votes to win an election is much more morally problematic. Not to mention Reid’s generally outrageous behavior. Has McConnell sought to demonize Americans on the floor of the Senate as Reid has done the Kochs? Did McConnell ever say a Democratic Presidential candidate paid no taxes when he knew he didn’t have that information? Reid lies about as blatantly as any politician in recent memory and it costs him nothing with Democratic voters. Hopefully if Democrats do keep the Senate they keep their promise and select a new leader. There aren’t enough votes to reelect Reid in any scenario if we assume red state Democrats are telling the truth. You’re a good poster, but saying Reid has integrity is a pretty incredible thing to say. Aside from being a blatant liar, he’s gotten awfully rich off of a lifetime of “public service”. He represents everything that’s wrong with politicians. Then there’s his supposed “pro-life” stance, but Democratic voters don’t hold that against him either since he’s lying about that too and his voting record proves it. That’s what bugs me about Democratic voters. They embrace corruption and dishonesty if it’s put in the service of liberalism. ---
**Author:** ![2ManyTacos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/2/3da27b/32.png) [@2ManyTacos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/2ManyTacos)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2014, 4:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-still-trending-to-win-senate/695426/1179 "2014-11-04T04:12:14Z")
Call me old fashioned, but if the GOP takes the Senate then I want the Democrats to filibuster every Gawddamn thing that McTurtle brings to the floor. What comes around, goes around, as they say. If Ginsburg retires from the Court sometime over the next two years, I don’t expect the GOP to put up TOO much of a roadblock to confirming an Obama replacement. However, if one of the conservative Justices retires or dies unexpectedly, then I’d anticipate all out Senatorial warfare if Obama maneuvers to fill that vacancy. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2014, 4:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-still-trending-to-win-senate/695426/1180 "2014-11-04T04:29:38Z")
Merciful Og, man, weren’t you paying attention? The man degrades and disparages two of the noblest citizens of our age! Sure, they make their money poisoning the environment, but, Hell, _everybody_ pees in the pool! Its their country, and they let us live here! A little gratitude, maybe? The only reason I don’t mention their names is I will not encourage the sort of crude middle school humor that pervades this board! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-still-trending-to-win-senate/695426.md?page=58) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-still-trending-to-win-senate/695426.md?page=60)