# GOP TP wing seems to be doubling down on being even more extreme - Successful long term strategy? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [February 1, 2014, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-tp-wing-seems-to-be-doubling-down-on-being-even-more-extreme-successful-long-term-strategy/680302 "2014-02-01T21:14:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![astro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9dc877/32.png) [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2014, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-tp-wing-seems-to-be-doubling-down-on-being-even-more-extreme-successful-long-term-strategy/680302/1 "2014-02-01T21:14:44Z")
Relative to it’s absolute numbers the Tea Party GOP win has been unusually successful in leveraging its power within the Republican Party locally and nationally even if it has not gotten the legislative results it wanted. There were predictions by many (including myself) that being rebuffed soundly in national election for POTUS would cause a GOP “walk in the woods” and re-assessment of their strategies with the old school GOP powers forcing the more extreme elements back in line. Per the linked article below this does not seem to have happened. Conservative legislators so full of animus toward the POTUS they are practically frothing at the mouth are still much in evidence and every other time a GOP leader opens their mouth about women or minorities it’s a cauldron of gibbering offensiveness and a ready made viral video. From a 20,000 foot view history and the demographic composition of the electorate seems to be moving away from many GOP positions. Why are they doubling down on these unpopular positions? It seems irrational. In the end it will cost them their power. Is there something I am not seeing going on in the background to explain why they are taking these extreme positions? [Rebel Conservatives Excel in G.O.P. Fund-Raising, Heralding a Tug Right](http://www.nytimes.com/2014/02/02/us/politics/rebel-conservatives-lead-way-in-gop-fund-raising.html?ref=politics) > [@](#): > > Insurgent conservatives seeking to pull the Republican Party to the right raised more money last year than the groups controlled by the party establishment, whose bulging bank accounts and ties to major donors have been their most potent advantage in the running struggle over the party’s future, according to new campaign filings and interviews with officials. > > The shift in fortunes among the largest and most influential outside political groups could have an enormous impact in the 2014 election cycle, as the Republican factions prepare to square off in a series of Senate and House primaries and as Republican leaders seek to rein in activists who they believe have fractured and endangered the party with policies that alienate independent-leaning voters. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2014, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-tp-wing-seems-to-be-doubling-down-on-being-even-more-extreme-successful-long-term-strategy/680302/2 "2014-02-01T21:17:37Z")
I think this ends in one of two ways – a Tea Party candidate wins the 2016 nomination and is promptly crushed in the general election, which would result in reducing the TP’s influence to near negligence, or a Republican candidate that the Tea Party finds unacceptable runs in 2016, and the TP fields a third party candidate. I’m not sure which result I like better. ---
**Author:** ![Ulf\_the\_Unwashed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Ulf\_the\_Unwashed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ulf_the_Unwashed)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2014, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-tp-wing-seems-to-be-doubling-down-on-being-even-more-extreme-successful-long-term-strategy/680302/3 "2014-02-01T23:05:23Z")
“near negligence”–I like that! ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2014, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-tp-wing-seems-to-be-doubling-down-on-being-even-more-extreme-successful-long-term-strategy/680302/4 "2014-02-01T23:12:44Z")
> [@astro](#): > > From a 20,000 foot view history and the demographic composition of the electorate seems to be moving away from many GOP positions. Why are they doubling down on these unpopular positions? It seems irrational. Because they are irrational. This isn’t about a cold blooded attempt to get elected or get some law passed by appealing to the crazy wing of the party like in the old days; this is what happens when the crazies in question actually get into power themselves. They are true believers, not cynics. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2014, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-tp-wing-seems-to-be-doubling-down-on-being-even-more-extreme-successful-long-term-strategy/680302/5 "2014-02-02T00:28:25Z")
Which is a good object lesson in WHY politics is the art of compromise. Disparate groups need to work together so everyone gets something. When one group or the other ends up demanding things only go their way the system breaks down. That path leads to stagnation - where we are now - or tyranny if the group achieves total power. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Lendervedder](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_lendervedder/32/8488_2.png) [@Happy\_Lendervedder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Lendervedder)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2014, 5:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-tp-wing-seems-to-be-doubling-down-on-being-even-more-extreme-successful-long-term-strategy/680302/6 "2014-02-02T05:19:30Z")
They’re terrified of how this country is changing. Gays, an increase of brown immigrants, white people heading toward minority status in much of the country, religions that don’t involve Jesus-- these things are all becoming the norm. The things that they find “comfortable” and “acceptable” and “normal” are, in their minds, being pushed aside, which means their culture, belief system and values are being pushed aside. They aren’t acting this way because they’re irrational; they’re doing it because that’s what a scared dog does when it’s cornered-- fights like hell for its own survival. So this isn’t a long-term strategy of the right-wing, it’s a strategy to keep Christian, white, “pro-nuclear family,” cowboy values alive. Things are “different” these days, and it scares the ever-shitting love out of them. An America that’s secular, embraces people that aren’t heterosexual, has a big federal government, is full of Spanish speakers and Arabic speakers and Muslims, and is run by someone other than a rich old white man-- well, that’s an America that isn’t worth saving. They’re scratching and clawing for their own cultural survival, as well as for what they think America is supposed to be. Letting Barack Hussein Obama be successful in any manner is a threat to them personally. Every time he succeeds at something (winning an election, winning re-election, passing health reform, killing Bin Laden, reducing government spending, etc), they feel the hammer crack their skull. So hell yeah they’re gonna fight dirty and do some crazy-ass shit. They’re cornered and desperate. Here’s [the link to the results of a focus group](http://www.democracycorps.com/attachments/article/954/dcor%20rpp%20fg%20memo%20100313%20final.pdf) (PDF) I found a while ago; it was very eye-opening. ---
**Author:** ![Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/7ba0ec/32.png) [@Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omg_a_Black_Conservative)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2014, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-tp-wing-seems-to-be-doubling-down-on-being-even-more-extreme-successful-long-term-strategy/680302/7 "2014-02-02T14:15:34Z")
> [@Happy\_Lendervedder](#): > > They’re terrified of how this country is changing. Gays, an increase of brown immigrants, white people heading toward minority status in much of the country, religions that don’t involve Jesus-- these things are all becoming the norm. The things that they find “comfortable” and “acceptable” and “normal” are, in their minds, being pushed aside, which means their culture, belief system and values are being pushed aside. > > They aren’t acting this way because they’re irrational; they’re doing it because that’s what a scared dog does when it’s cornered-- fights like hell for its own survival. So this isn’t a long-term strategy of the right-wing, it’s a strategy to keep Christian, white, “pro-nuclear family,” cowboy values alive. Things are “different” these days, and it scares the ever-shitting love out of them. > > An America that’s secular, embraces people that aren’t heterosexual, has a big federal government, is full of Spanish speakers and Arabic speakers and Muslims, and is run by someone other than a rich old white man-- well, that’s an America that isn’t worth saving. They’re scratching and clawing for their own cultural survival, as well as for what they think America is supposed to be. Letting Barack Hussein Obama be successful in any manner is a threat to them personally. Every time he succeeds at something (winning an election, winning re-election, passing health reform, killing Bin Laden, reducing government spending, etc), they feel the hammer crack their skull. So hell yeah they’re gonna fight dirty and do some crazy-ass shit. They’re cornered and desperate. > > Here’s [the link to the results of a focus group](http://www.democracycorps.com/attachments/article/954/dcor%20rpp%20fg%20memo%20100313%20final.pdf) (PDF) I found a while ago; it was very eye-opening. That’s a nice straw man. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2014, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-tp-wing-seems-to-be-doubling-down-on-being-even-more-extreme-successful-long-term-strategy/680302/8 "2014-02-02T14:32:05Z")
So how do \*you \*think the nihilists who control your party can have a long-term future, **OMGABC**? Their tantrums aren’t working, in case you hadn’t noticed. ---
**Author:** ![nevadaexile](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/eb8c5e/32.png) [@nevadaexile](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nevadaexile)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2014, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-tp-wing-seems-to-be-doubling-down-on-being-even-more-extreme-successful-long-term-strategy/680302/9 "2014-02-02T23:30:53Z")
The Tea Party “works” through groupthink and active denial. Their base is shrinking (thanks to age and demographics) and they are on the “wrong” side of history. The combination of the two (paired with a healthy dose of self delusion) make them believe that their movement is something more than a short-term political trend. It isn’t. Like the Whigs, the Bull Moose Party and a host of other political distractions, they are making a minor impression and then alienating the very people whose help they’ll need to survive over the next few decades. Without significant influxes of women, minorities and recent immigrants, the Tea Party will simply become a footnote in the history of American politics. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2014, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-tp-wing-seems-to-be-doubling-down-on-being-even-more-extreme-successful-long-term-strategy/680302/10 "2014-02-02T23:37:07Z")
> [@nevadaexile](#): > > Like the Whigs, the Bull Moose Party and a host of other political distractions, they are making a minor impression . . . The Whigs were once one of the two main parties in America. ---
**Author:** ![nevadaexile](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/eb8c5e/32.png) [@nevadaexile](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nevadaexile)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2014, 11:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-tp-wing-seems-to-be-doubling-down-on-being-even-more-extreme-successful-long-term-strategy/680302/11 "2014-02-02T23:41:47Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > The Whigs were once one of the two main parties in America. Yes, I know. They had three US Presidents elected between 1841-1853, two of whom (WH Harrison and Zachary Taylor) died in office. After 1853, they vanished into the ether. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2014, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-tp-wing-seems-to-be-doubling-down-on-being-even-more-extreme-successful-long-term-strategy/680302/12 "2014-02-02T23:53:00Z")
> [@Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](#): > > That’s a nice straw man. Is it? I’ve witnessed TP rallies, live and on TV. **Happy’s** description would appear to be spot-on. ---
**Author:** ![Twoflower](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/twoflower/32/22_2.png) [@Twoflower](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Twoflower)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2014, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-tp-wing-seems-to-be-doubling-down-on-being-even-more-extreme-successful-long-term-strategy/680302/13 "2014-02-03T00:26:15Z")
I think the California Republican party shows what the potential TP future looks like. They’ve been purging RINOs for a couple of decades now, and have successfully molded a permanent minority party, holding no statewide offices and not quite 1/3 of the legislature. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2014, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-tp-wing-seems-to-be-doubling-down-on-being-even-more-extreme-successful-long-term-strategy/680302/14 "2014-02-03T01:26:00Z")
> [@Happy\_Lendervedder](#): > > They’re terrified of how this country is changing. Gays, an increase of brown immigrants, white people heading toward minority status in much of the country, religions that don’t involve Jesus-- these things are all becoming the norm. The things that they find “comfortable” and “acceptable” and “normal” are, in their minds, being pushed aside, which means their culture, belief system and values are being pushed aside… > > Things are “different” these days, and it scares the ever-shitting love out of them. Reminds me of Johnny Cash’s _What Is Truth?_ _The old man turned off the radio Said, “Where did all of the old songs go Kids sure play funny music these days They play it in the strangest ways” Said, “it looks to me like they’ve all gone wild It was peaceful back when I was a child” Well, man, could it be that the girls and boys Are trying to be heard above your noise?_ \ \*The young girl dancing to the latest beat Has found new ways to move her feet The young man speaking in the city square Is trying to tell somebody that he cares Yeah, the ones that you’re calling wild Are going to be the leaders in a little while This old world’s wakin’ to a new born day And I solemnly swear that it’ll be their way… \* ---
**Author:** ![Ranger\_Jeff](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ranger_jeff/32/2065_2.png) [@Ranger\_Jeff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranger_Jeff)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2014, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-tp-wing-seems-to-be-doubling-down-on-being-even-more-extreme-successful-long-term-strategy/680302/15 "2014-02-03T15:06:35Z")
I’d say it depends on how you want to define “success”. If they intend to destroy the GOP as we know it, I’d say they’ve got a good head start. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2014, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-tp-wing-seems-to-be-doubling-down-on-being-even-more-extreme-successful-long-term-strategy/680302/16 "2014-02-03T16:45:51Z")
> [@Ranger\_Jeff](#): > > I’d say it depends on how you want to define “success”. If they intend to destroy the GOP as we know it, I’d say they’ve got a good head start. And I feel fine! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2014, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-tp-wing-seems-to-be-doubling-down-on-being-even-more-extreme-successful-long-term-strategy/680302/17 "2014-02-03T17:44:19Z")
I think it’s a mistake to ascribe too much big picture strategy or planning to the TP movement. It’s a coalition of like-minded individuals, not a centrally planned (heaven forfend) organization. I know the grassrootsyness of the movement is overstated, so I’m not trying to say there was no national plan originally, but I think this is like a stampede at this point. You can’t point to a strategy with a stampede, even if you can point to reasons it’s happening. The entire herd may be damaged or destroyed in a stampede, but the individuals aren’t thinking of that. Happy’s link rings true for me. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2014, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-tp-wing-seems-to-be-doubling-down-on-being-even-more-extreme-successful-long-term-strategy/680302/18 "2014-02-03T21:10:12Z")
> [@Twoflower](#): > > I think the California Republican party shows what the potential TP future looks like. They’ve been purging RINOs for a couple of decades now, and have successfully molded a permanent minority party, holding no statewide offices and not quite 1/3 of the legislature. And Arnold had nothing to do with the majority of California Republicans. The Republican base is in the Central Valley and Orange County, and Orange County is going to be turning Democratic soon, due to changing demographics. Republicans with a tea party like view of social issues won’t stand a chance. The only Republicans who stand a chance here are going to be socially well to the left of the national Republican party. I think that is going to be the trend nationally in a decade also. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2014, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-tp-wing-seems-to-be-doubling-down-on-being-even-more-extreme-successful-long-term-strategy/680302/19 "2014-02-03T21:42:37Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > The Whigs were once one of the two main parties in America. In about 3 years, you’ll be able to say that about the Republicans. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2014, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-tp-wing-seems-to-be-doubling-down-on-being-even-more-extreme-successful-long-term-strategy/680302/20 "2014-02-03T22:24:42Z")
> [@Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](#): > > That’s a nice straw man. Are you talking about the article or **Happy’s** analysis? I didn’t read the article, but \*\*Happy[b/] is dead on. He describes exactly the thoughts and fears that a lot of my relatives and acquaintances articulate via various emails, live statements, and Facebook commentary. They put the “US that was” on a pedestal, and are fearful of the “US that will be”. To them, the “US that was” is a model of civic responsibility, fiscal responsibility, hard work, taxes being spent on things they agree with, and higher ethics and morals. They see the “US that will be” as something giving a lot more voice to people who don’t pay taxes, suck off the public teat, and generally behave counter to those ethics and morals that they hold so dear. It doesn’t help things that race and socio-economic class are so tightly linked- they see black and mexican people having lots of kids out of wedlock, making foolish fiscal decisions, and then agitating about their poverty, and think “Well, duh, if you act like that, you sure will be poor.” and as a result are less than excited about voting for candidates willing to try and solve their problems with government money. To them, it seems like throwing good money after bad, while things like defense expenditures and debt repayment are things they can get behind, because there’s a perceived value from both of them. Things like the Earned Income Tax Credit are widely considered to be horrid because they are thought of as incentivizing the behaviors they consider so abhorrent, as well as a sort of government-sanctioned Robin Hood scheme. They feel much the same way about the Affordable Care Act- it’s basically playing Robin Hood to take their money and give knuckleheads who smoke, drink and have children out of wedlock that money in the form of health care, and provide a sort of moral hazard. Of course, this isn’t the whole story, but this is the way they perceive a lot of this stuff, and the Tea Party wing of the Republican party plays to that sort of FUD, and as a result, had their day in the sun. However, most of them are NOT cool with the idea of retards like Ted Cruz shutting down the government entirely- that pissed a lot of them off- mostly in the name of not allowing the government to meet its obligations. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gop-tp-wing-seems-to-be-doubling-down-on-being-even-more-extreme-successful-long-term-strategy/680302.md?page=2)