# Goulash. What's it to ya? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 24, 2015, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goulash-whats-it-to-ya/710762 "2015-01-24T16:21:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2015, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goulash-whats-it-to-ya/710762/1 "2015-01-24T16:21:57Z")
When I was a child, mom made ‘goulash’. This was ground beef, tomatoes, elbow macaroni, and spices (I’m guessing paprika). In my 20s I discovered Little Prague restaurant in Hollywood, where I had my first taste of _real_ goulash. Theirs was the Czech version, which was basically cubes of beef in a paprika sauce and served with dumplings. When you think of goulash, do you think of Hungarian goulash (with potatoes and/or other vegetables)? Czech goulash like I had at the Czech restaurant? Or do you think of mom’s version, which today I would pretty much call ‘chili mac’? ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2015, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goulash-whats-it-to-ya/710762/2 "2015-01-24T16:30:13Z")
There are many different varieties of gulyas, and I love them all, maybe because of my Austro-Hungarian ancestry. I also had what my mother called gulyas when I was a kid, but I now think of it as beefaroni. About a year ago, I made a pot of spicy three-meat (pork, lamb, and veal) gulyas with sauerkraut, which I think is from Szegd. A few weeks ago, I made the most common Hungarian gulyas with beef and veg; it was more like a hearty soup and not nearly as spicy. Next week, I’m going to make Austrian coachman’s gulyas with wieners. So many recipes, so little time…! ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Grrr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grrr/32/146_2.png) [@Grrr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grrr)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2015, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goulash-whats-it-to-ya/710762/3 "2015-01-24T16:38:49Z")
Elbow macaroni, canned whole tomatoes (squished up a bit), ground beef, onions and peppers. One of my favorite dishes as a kid. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2015, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goulash-whats-it-to-ya/710762/4 "2015-01-24T16:43:51Z")
[_Hungarian Goulash_](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jIwvsj40sBY), by Allan Sherman ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2015, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goulash-whats-it-to-ya/710762/5 "2015-01-24T16:51:52Z")
I grew up with goulash being an Eastern European beef or pork stew with paprika (although my Polish mother made a goulash with just black pepper, too). Then, I lived in Hungary for a few years, where it was more of a soup than a stew. I dont remember knowing “goulash” as a beef and mac dish until I think college, at least. That’s probably because I grew in Chicago, which has a large Eastern European population (though not so many Hungarians.) ---
**Author:** ![Inna\_Minnit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/5f8ce5/32.png) [@Inna\_Minnit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inna_Minnit)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2015, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goulash-whats-it-to-ya/710762/6 "2015-01-24T17:00:02Z")
> [@Shakes](#): > > Elbow macaroni, canned whole tomatoes (squished up a bit), ground beef, onions and peppers. > > One of my favorite dishes as a kid. This. And I never thought paprika had much of a flavor. Maybe I have only tasted crappy stuff. We just used it for color on potato salad, macaroni salad and deviled eggs to make them pretty. Now that I think of it, we probably had the same bottle of paprika all those years. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2015, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goulash-whats-it-to-ya/710762/7 "2015-01-24T17:01:02Z")
To expound, essentially, in English, there are three dishes I think of as goulash. One is a fairly thick and relatively plain meat, onion, and paprika stew that is somewhat similar to Texas red chili and goes by the name of pörkölt in Hungarian. This is what most places have a version of when they have “Hungaian goulash” on the menu. It can be served with noodles/spaetzle, with potatoes on the side or even with rice. Second is the beefaroni-type dish. Third is what is sometimes called goulash soup in English, but as gulyas or gulyasleves in Hungarian. This is a soupier version of pörkölt and is cooked along with at least potatoes and onions. It may also contain carrot, parsnip, and/or celeriac. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2015, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goulash-whats-it-to-ya/710762/8 "2015-01-24T17:04:29Z")
> [@Inna\_Minnit](#): > > This. And I never thought paprika had much of a flavor. Maybe I have only tasted crappy stuff. We just used it for color on potato salad, macaroni salad and deviled eggs to make them pretty. Now that I think of it, we probably had the same bottle of paprika all those years. Good, fresh paprika does indeed have flavor. If you take a whiff of it, it should smell like freshly roasted red peppers. If it smells of nothing, it’s not very good. A couple weeks ago, I bought some cheap 99 cent paprika in an emergency, and I just ended up not using it. It was awful and had a weird, sour smell and taste to it. (I’ve never encountered that before. Usually, bad paprika is just relatively flavorless.) ---
**Author:** ![Inna\_Minnit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/5f8ce5/32.png) [@Inna\_Minnit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inna_Minnit)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2015, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goulash-whats-it-to-ya/710762/9 "2015-01-24T17:07:51Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > To expound, essentially, in English, there are three dishes I think of as goulash. One is a fairly thick and relatively plain meat, onion, and paprika stew that is somewhat similar to Texas red chili and goes by the name of pörkölt in Hungarian. This is what most places have a version of when they have “Hungaian goulash” on the menu. It can be served with noodles/spaetzle, with potatoes on the side or even with rice. Second is the beefaroni-type dish. Third is what is sometimes called goulash soup in English, but as gulyas or gulyasleves in Hungarian. This is a soupier version of pörkölt and is cooked along with at least potatoes and onions. It may also contain carrot, parsnip, and/or celeriac. Those all sound really good. ---
**Author:** ![typoink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecb155/32.png) [@typoink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/typoink)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2015, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goulash-whats-it-to-ya/710762/10 "2015-01-24T17:17:13Z")
> [@Inna\_Minnit](#): > > This. And I never thought paprika had much of a flavor. Maybe I have only tasted crappy stuff. We just used it for color on potato salad, macaroni salad and deviled eggs to make them pretty. Now that I think of it, we probably had the same bottle of paprika all those years. Paprika has a shorter shelf life than most other spices, so most people’s experience is with paprika that’s well past its prime. Paprikash made with good paprika is indeed a highly flavorful dish. ---
**Author:** ![scabpicker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scabpicker/32/8268_2.png) [@scabpicker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scabpicker)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2015, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goulash-whats-it-to-ya/710762/11 "2015-01-24T17:20:15Z")
It’s basically chili mac to me, too. I’ve never had an authentic one, I think. The Czech one sounds delicious. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2015, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goulash-whats-it-to-ya/710762/12 "2015-01-24T17:22:59Z")
> [@Inna\_Minnit](#): > > This. And I never thought paprika had much of a flavor. Maybe I have only tasted crappy stuff. We just used it for color on potato salad, macaroni salad and deviled eggs to make them pretty. Now that I think of it, we probably had the same bottle of paprika all those years. I can’t imagine my mother putting paprika in anything (it was my dad’s side of the family that was Austro-Hungarian), so I imagine she used either some form of Italian seasoning or nothing at all, outside of salt and pepper. I also don’t recall her ever using either green or red bell peppers, not even in her stovetop chili. Italian seasoning really would have made it more beefaroni than anything else. OT: I found stovetop Bavarian dumplings in the food section at Wal-Mart. I’m dying to try them with gulyas! When I lived in Czechoslovakia, I had a private student whose mother made me dinner every weekend. She made the most wonderful knedlicky to soak up the gravy of her dishes! I wish now I had asked her for the recipe. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2015, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goulash-whats-it-to-ya/710762/13 "2015-01-24T17:25:52Z")
Mrs. J. sometimes makes a goulash-like dish for dinner. We call it “bowl o’meat”. ---
**Author:** ![jnglmassiv](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f07891/32.png) [@jnglmassiv](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jnglmassiv)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2015, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goulash-whats-it-to-ya/710762/14 "2015-01-24T17:30:05Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > Third is what is sometimes called goulash soup in English, but as gulyas or gulyasleves in Hungarian. This is a soupier version of pörkölt and is cooked along with at least potatoes and onions. It may also contain carrot, parsnip, and/or celeriac. The [Polish grocery](http://www.richsharlem.com/) I shop at for soups and salads has _zupa gulaszowa_ and it is really great. The ingredients listed are: Pork meat, cucumbers in brine, mushrooms, carrots, celery, parsley, salt, pepper, spices. While I have found that the listed ingredients on these made in-house items can differ a bit\* from the actual product, this one seems accurate. Anyway, this goulash is a bit reddish in color and I’m sure it’s in there but I haven’t tasted a detectable amount of paprika. \*For example, sometimes a creamy soup doesn’t have any dairy listed or potatoes are subbed for pasta. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2015, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goulash-whats-it-to-ya/710762/15 "2015-01-24T17:30:52Z")
> [@scabpicker](#): > > The Czech one sounds delicious. [Here’s a recipe](http://fae-magazine.com/2012/09/26/hungarian-goulash-with-czech-bread-dumplings/) that looks like what I had at the restaurant. [Here’s another one](http://mooshujenne.com/czech-goulash-cesky-gulas/) that adds tomato paste, and has porno-licious photos. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2015, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goulash-whats-it-to-ya/710762/16 "2015-01-24T17:38:46Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > [Here’s another one](http://mooshujenne.com/czech-goulash-cesky-gulas/) that adds tomato paste, and has porno-licious photos. Interesting. I’ve never heard of East European cooking with olive oil. Traditionally they use animal fat or maybe sunflower oil. When I cook Hungarian, I saute the onions and paprika in lard. Nothing else tastes the same. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2015, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goulash-whats-it-to-ya/710762/17 "2015-01-24T17:42:00Z")
> [@jnglmassiv](#): > > While I have found that the listed ingredients on these made in-house items can differ a bit\* from the actual product, this one seems accurate. Anyway, this goulash is a bit reddish in color and I’m sure it’s in there but I haven’t tasted a detectable amount of paprika. Being Polish (the dish, not me), I would imagine the predominant seasoning is caraway seed. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2015, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goulash-whats-it-to-ya/710762/18 "2015-01-24T17:47:38Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > Being Polish (the dish, not me), I would imagine the predominant seasoning is caraway seed. That’s certainly a good guess, although Hungarian styles of goulash commonly include caraway as well. (My Polish mom’s didn’t because she doesn’t much like caraway.) Marjoram would be another good guess-that one is seen a lot in Polish cooking, not _as_ much in Hungarian cooking, but quite a lot in various goulashes (especially German and Austrian types.) I’ve shared these before, but here are my recipes along with technique and variations on: [Goulash soup/gulyás/gulyásleves](http://www.lthforum.com/bb/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=36783) [Goulash/pörkölt](http://www.lthforum.com/bb/viewtopic.php?p=176835). This recipe also contains instruction for galuska/spaetzle/nokedli dumplings/noodles as well. You will note I share your love of animal fats. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![jnglmassiv](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f07891/32.png) [@jnglmassiv](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jnglmassiv)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2015, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goulash-whats-it-to-ya/710762/19 "2015-01-24T17:49:46Z")
Oh shoot, I forgot about the Hungarian pancake at [Smak-Tak!](http://www.smaktak.com/restaurant.htm) [QUOTE=Mike Sula in the Reader] The placek po wegiersku, or Hungarian-style pancake, is formed by one of Smak Tak’s enlarged but delicately crispy potato pancakes folded over a massive portion of mushroomy, peppery beef goulash, topped by a length of coiled sour cream, and a mocking sprinkle of chopped parsley. [/quote] [Link](http://www.chicagoreader.com/Bleader/archives/2009/06/17/one-huge-bite-smak-taks-hungarian-pancake) Another review and photos: [http://www.skilletdoux.com/2009/11/smaktak.html](http://www.skilletdoux.com/2009/11/smaktak.html) [QUOTE=Dom] It starts with that thick potato pancake that’s moist and buttery, but has been griddled to a perfect crisp, particularly along the edges. The goulash is wonderful, with a deep but clean flavor that makes it feel more sophisticated than a simple meat stew, and the sour cream is light and fresh. [/quote] [QUOTE=terentii] Being Polish (the dish, not me), I would imagine the predominant seasoning is caraway seed. [/quote] Not that I recall but could be. I’m certain there’s allspice, though. I’m heading to Rich’s this afternoon and if they have it, I’m picking up a couple pints. I’ll carefully taste it (many times) and see what I find. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2015, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goulash-whats-it-to-ya/710762/20 "2015-01-24T18:00:11Z")
Heh, my mom makes placki po węgiersku pretty regularly. 🙂 I’m not sure if it’s an actual Hungarian dish (I’ve never seen that there), but it’s a common Polish restaurant dish. The goulash used is a Polish take on Hungarian pörkölt. It usually has some paprika in it, but it’s not predominantly spiced with it the way a Hungarian stew would be. “Peppery.” as in black pepper, would be more my experience with Polish versions of goulash. And allspice is a common Polish ingredient (where it’s known in the language as “ziele angielskie,” or “English herb,” apparently because it came to Poland via English spice merchants.) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/goulash-whats-it-to-ya/710762.md?page=2)