# Gov. Cuomo: America "was never that great" - is this a common sentiment on the Left?
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gov-cuomo-america-was-never-that-great-is-this-a-common-sentiment-on-the-left/819934
**Category:** Politics & Elections
**Created:** [August 20, 2018, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gov-cuomo-america-was-never-that-great-is-this-a-common-sentiment-on-the-left/819934 "2018-08-20T22:47:41Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)
#### Post date: [August 20, 2018, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gov-cuomo-america-was-never-that-great-is-this-a-common-sentiment-on-the-left/819934/1 "2018-08-20T22:47:41Z")
[Recently Gov. Cuomo (D-NY) said America “was never that great.”](https://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/2018/08/15/ny-gov-andrew-cuomo-america-was-never-that-great-sot-vpx.ny-governors-office) Is this a common sentiment among those on the Left?
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### Author:  [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)
#### Post date: [August 20, 2018, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gov-cuomo-america-was-never-that-great-is-this-a-common-sentiment-on-the-left/819934/2 "2018-08-20T22:57:41Z")
[Context.](https://www.cnn.com/2018/08/15/politics/andrew-cuomo-america-was-never-that-great/index.html)
> [@](#):
>
> “We’re not going to make America great again. It was never that great,” Cuomo, a Democrat, remarked at a bill signing event in New York City. The comment was met by an audible reaction from the crowd.
> His comments were a response to President Donald Trump’s campaign catchphrase – “Make America Great Again.”
>
> “We have not reached greatness. We will reach greatness when every American is fully engaged,” Cuomo added. “We will reach greatness when discrimination and stereotyping of women, 51% of our population, is gone, and every woman’s full potential is realized and unleashed and every woman is making her full contribution.”
Let’s throw in that we were one of the last nations to eliminate slavery and Jim Crow laws existed until relatively recently.
That’s just scratching the surface of what keeps the nation from true greatness.
Trump’s idea of greatness is a huge step backwards.
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### Author:  [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)
#### Post date: [August 20, 2018, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gov-cuomo-america-was-never-that-great-is-this-a-common-sentiment-on-the-left/819934/3 "2018-08-20T23:10:44Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#):
>
> [Recently Gov. Cuomo (D-NY) said America “was never that great.”](https://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/2018/08/15/ny-gov-andrew-cuomo-america-was-never-that-great-sot-vpx.ny-governors-office) Is this a common sentiment among those on the Left?
What he was trying to say is that Donald Trump’s vision of “greatness” is deeply flawed. America shouldn’t want to be great the way Donald Trump defines great.
Cuomo expanded on his original comment the next day:
[https://www.politico.com/states/new-york/albany/story/2018/08/17/as-trump-and-republicans-rage-cuomo-admits-comment-was-inartful-562925](https://www.politico.com/states/new-york/albany/story/2018/08/17/as-trump-and-republicans-rage-cuomo-admits-comment-was-inartful-562925)
> [@Andrew Cuomo](#):
>
> “The expression I used the other day was inartful, so I want to be very clear: Of course America is great and of course America has always been great. No one questions that,” Cuomo told reporters on a conference call. “When Trump started talking about the slogan called ‘Make America Great Again,’ that what he believes establishes American greatness is not greatness at all.”
>
> The governor explained that on Wednesday, he was emphasizing that the nation’s history on women’s rights and civil rights for minorities and LGBT people leave much to be desired, and much progress to be made.
Cuomo was specifically addressing Trump’s disdain for minorities or the ways in which America has not always respected diversity. In truth, the way America has treated minorities is, not specifically, too good.
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### Author:  [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)
#### Post date: [August 20, 2018, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gov-cuomo-america-was-never-that-great-is-this-a-common-sentiment-on-the-left/819934/4 "2018-08-20T23:10:54Z")
I think in Trumpland declaring something to be great makes it great. It’s like a magic trick involving a blindfold.
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### Author:  [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)
#### Post date: [August 20, 2018, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gov-cuomo-america-was-never-that-great-is-this-a-common-sentiment-on-the-left/819934/5 "2018-08-20T23:13:57Z")
> [@bobot](#):
>
> I think in Trumpland declaring something to be great makes it great. It’s like a magic trick involving a blindfold.
Or doing the vanishing doorway trick in front of dogs.
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### Author:  [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)
#### Post date: [August 20, 2018, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gov-cuomo-america-was-never-that-great-is-this-a-common-sentiment-on-the-left/819934/6 "2018-08-20T23:40:10Z")
Speaking for myself as a liberal, the greatness of America is in certain American ideals and in its potential, not in its past.
There is no point in America’s past that is good enough to go back to, so in that sense “make America great again” is a nonsensical statement. There is no “great” in the past that can happen “again.”
What makes America great is its capacity to become better than it is.
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### Author:  [@steatopygia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steatopygia)
#### Post date: [August 20, 2018, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gov-cuomo-america-was-never-that-great-is-this-a-common-sentiment-on-the-left/819934/7 "2018-08-20T23:42:14Z")
Yes, America was the greatest. But what made us great in the past is not what will make us great in the future. Natural resources and the room to exploit them, a relatively homogeneous majority population with ample immigration to continue the expansion, and a democratic system of government. Was it perfect? Of course not. Native Americans and minority groups were openly discriminated against. Pollution and environmental degradation were rampant. Political corruption would regularly rear its head. But we tried to rise above those things with the rule of law. We were making great strides in all of these areas. Until recently. Now public lands are being sold for political favors, asbestos is the newest thing and oh yeah, we should probably start making cars inefficient again. Far right groups are now openly espousing their hatred because their leader says they are very fine people.
What could make us great again would be to have the happiest, healthiest population in the world. We could lead the world in the things we used to lead in. Technology, invention, charity, democratic ideas. Leadership.
But instead we have the Me First ideas of the republican party. “Why should I have to pay taxes so that you can eat? . Why shouldn’t my beliefs be yours? Why shouldn’t we pollute the country? White people really are better. You shouldn’t have insurance if you work as a cook.”
All of those things are what the Republican party has become. They point to the current economy as justification for dismantling what has taken decades to achieve. They forget that the economy was doing just fine with all those taxes and rules and regulations in place.
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### Author:  [@Happy\_Fun\_Ball](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Fun_Ball)
#### Post date: [August 20, 2018, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gov-cuomo-america-was-never-that-great-is-this-a-common-sentiment-on-the-left/819934/8 "2018-08-20T23:52:14Z")
Honestly I though this was a common opinion of the right. Conservatives (especially Trump) are always talking about how screwed up America is while the left seems to think it is a pretty great country. This is just my opinion from listening to stump speeches and the like.
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### Author:  [@SpoilerVirgin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SpoilerVirgin)
#### Post date: [August 21, 2018, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gov-cuomo-america-was-never-that-great-is-this-a-common-sentiment-on-the-left/819934/9 "2018-08-21T00:06:13Z")
It’s now become an annual tradition for me to reference Peter Beinart’s article [The War over Patriotism](http://njbrepository.blogspot.com/2013/01/the-war-over-patriotism-by-peter-beinart.html), which was published in Time Magazine back in 2008. I’ve never seen another explanation of this fundamental difference between conservatives and liberals that is as simple and as eloquent.
> [@](#):
>
> …conservatives tend to believe that loving America today requires loving its past.
>
> * * *
>
> When evaluating America, they’re more likely to remember that for most of human history, tyranny has been the norm. By that standard, America looks pretty good. Conservatives worry that if Americans don’t appreciate—and celebrate—their nation’s past accomplishments, they’ll assume the country can be easily and dramatically improved. And they’ll end up making things worse.
> [@](#):
>
> If conservatives tend to see patriotism as an inheritance from a glorious past, liberals often see it as the promise of a future that redeems the past.
>
> * * *
>
> For liberals, America is less a common culture than a set of ideals about democracy, equality and the rule of law. American history is a chronicle of the distance between those ideals and reality. And American patriotism is the struggle to narrow the gap. Thus, patriotism isn’t about honoring and replicating the past; it’s about surpassing it.
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### Author:  [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)
#### Post date: [August 21, 2018, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gov-cuomo-america-was-never-that-great-is-this-a-common-sentiment-on-the-left/819934/10 "2018-08-21T01:10:51Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#):
>
> [Recently Gov. Cuomo (D-NY) said America “was never that great.”](https://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/2018/08/15/ny-gov-andrew-cuomo-america-was-never-that-great-sot-vpx.ny-governors-office) Is this a common sentiment among those on the Left?
I think America has always been great in its ideals, not so great in its execution. “…all men are created equal…” was a great ideal in its time, but Americans still owned slaves. The Civil War wasn’t great, neither was, for example, the Vietnam War, nor how we were basically suckered into it. But, we’ve always had great goals and seemed to (mostly) sincerely strive for those goals. Women’s suffrage, the end of Jim Crow were all great stepping stones that moved us toward our stated goals.
Now, it’s certainly the case that there have always been many, many nations much worse than us, either on purpose (through strongmen, corruption, dictatorships) or through circumstance (abject poverty, lack of resources, civil war).
All that said, I think the important thing is to remove all context and try a back-handed accusation that liberals think America isn’t great. I’m sure that’s what Fox News, for example, is doing. “You didn’t build that” all over again. What a crock.
When the president says Make America Great Again, was he agreeing with Cuomo, that America is not great? Are we great now, according to him? When weren’t we?
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### Author:  [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)
#### Post date: [August 21, 2018, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gov-cuomo-america-was-never-that-great-is-this-a-common-sentiment-on-the-left/819934/11 "2018-08-21T01:19:14Z")
> [@Happy\_Fun\_Ball](#):
>
> Honestly I though this was a common opinion of the right. Conservatives (especially Trump) are always talking about how screwed up America is while the left seems to think it is a pretty great country. This is just my opinion from listening to stump speeches and the like.
That’s what people should have been asking Trump when he was running, “Mr Trump, are you saying America is not a great country?”
Because isn’t that a necessary prelude to Making America Great Again? Saying it isn’t currently great?
Reagan said the same thing when he was running; “Let’s Make America Great Again”. So I guess Reagan didn’t believe America was a great country either.
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### Author:  [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)
#### Post date: [August 21, 2018, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gov-cuomo-america-was-never-that-great-is-this-a-common-sentiment-on-the-left/819934/12 "2018-08-21T02:04:56Z")
Here’s my impression of the common leftist sentiment, as brief as possible.
“America has done many great things. It has also left people out of those great things and done some absolutely horrible things. We celebrate past greatness while demanding - not wishing for or idly parroting patriotic slogans about - everybody get included equally in its greatness.”
That sentiment does not seem to be common on the right. It is perhaps the one thing that separates left and right the most. The left feel, to greater or lesser degrees, that those who don’t accept that sentiment can’t be accepted as decent human beings. So the left will undoubtedly continue to demand that the right live up to the words they mouth - and expect that they will fail to do so.
That said, Cuomo’s phrasing was as stupid as Guliani’s “Truth isn’t truth.” In the world of memes and ripping words out of context, both statements will come back to haunt them.
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### Author:  [@BlankSlate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlankSlate)
#### Post date: [August 21, 2018, 3:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gov-cuomo-america-was-never-that-great-is-this-a-common-sentiment-on-the-left/819934/13 "2018-08-21T03:14:47Z")
This Facebook diarrhoea is unworthy of this forum.
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### Author:  [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)
#### Post date: [August 21, 2018, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gov-cuomo-america-was-never-that-great-is-this-a-common-sentiment-on-the-left/819934/14 "2018-08-21T03:22:04Z")
> [@BlankSlate](#):
>
> This Facebook diarrhoea is unworthy of this forum.
Facebook diarrhea? The link in the OP is from CNN. The video is a segment of a speech by the Governor of New York. Hardly some rando off Facebook (although I sincerely wish he were just some nut spewing his nonsense on Facebook).
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### Author:  [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)
#### Post date: [August 21, 2018, 3:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gov-cuomo-america-was-never-that-great-is-this-a-common-sentiment-on-the-left/819934/15 "2018-08-21T03:29:48Z")
> [@Happy\_Fun\_Ball](#):
>
> Honestly I though this was a common opinion of the right. Conservatives (especially Trump) are always talking about how screwed up America is while the left seems to think it is a pretty great country. This is just my opinion from listening to stump speeches and the like.
If you were to hazard a guess, which party do you think currently has more of its members believing that America is “on the wrong track”?
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### Author:  [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)
#### Post date: [August 21, 2018, 3:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gov-cuomo-america-was-never-that-great-is-this-a-common-sentiment-on-the-left/819934/16 "2018-08-21T03:32:18Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#):
>
> Facebook diarrhea? The link in the OP is from CNN. The video is a segment of a speech by the Governor of New York. Hardly some rando off Facebook (although I sincerely wish he were just some nut spewing his nonsense on Facebook).
You “carelessly” removed all but the out of context part of the quote that was most damning.
Not to worry, I supplied the context upthread.
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### Author:  [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)
#### Post date: [August 21, 2018, 3:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gov-cuomo-america-was-never-that-great-is-this-a-common-sentiment-on-the-left/819934/17 "2018-08-21T03:36:05Z")
> [@Merneith](#):
>
> What he was trying to say is that Donald Trump’s vision of “greatness” is deeply flawed. America shouldn’t want to be great the way Donald Trump defines great.
>
> Cuomo expanded on his original comment the next day:
>
> [https://www.politico.com/states/new-york/albany/story/2018/08/17/as-trump-and-republicans-rage-cuomo-admits-comment-was-inartful-562925](https://www.politico.com/states/new-york/albany/story/2018/08/17/as-trump-and-republicans-rage-cuomo-admits-comment-was-inartful-562925)
>
> Cuomo was specifically addressing Trump’s disdain for minorities or the ways in which America has not always respected diversity. In truth, the way America has treated minorities is, not specifically, too good.
You call this “expanded on”? It sounds more like a reversal.
One day: America “was never that great.”
Another day: “Of course America is great and of course America has always been great. No one questions that.”
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### Author:  [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)
#### Post date: [August 21, 2018, 3:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gov-cuomo-america-was-never-that-great-is-this-a-common-sentiment-on-the-left/819934/18 "2018-08-21T03:37:46Z")
> [@running\_coach](#):
>
> You “carelessly” removed all but the out of context part of the quote that was most damning.
> Not to worry, I supplied the context upthread.
I posted a link to the video from CNN’s website. I didn’t feel like trying to transcribe all the “context”. Feel free to supply as much as you like.
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### Author:  [@TimeWinder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TimeWinder)
#### Post date: [August 21, 2018, 3:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gov-cuomo-america-was-never-that-great-is-this-a-common-sentiment-on-the-left/819934/19 "2018-08-21T03:39:31Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#):
>
> You call this “expanded on”? It sounds more like a reversal.
>
> One day: America “was never that great.”
>
> Another day: “Of course America is great and of course America has always been great. No one questions that.”
Again, it’s not a reversal of the ACTUAL CONTEXT that you left out of the quote, both in the OP and again here.
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### Author:  [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)
#### Post date: [August 21, 2018, 3:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gov-cuomo-america-was-never-that-great-is-this-a-common-sentiment-on-the-left/819934/20 "2018-08-21T03:40:55Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#):
>
> I posted a link to the video from CNN’s website. I didn’t feel like trying to transcribe all the “context”. Feel free to supply as much as you like.
Post 2. Or do you not read threads?
No need to transcribe. There’s a neat function that nay computer can do. It’s called “copy and paste”.
Works on quotes of any size.
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