# Govenor Scott Walker (R) WI **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 17, 2011, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/govenor-scott-walker-r-wi/571743 "2011-02-17T20:56:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 49
**Author:** ![Agnostic\_Pagan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c4cdca/32.png) [@Agnostic\_Pagan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Agnostic_Pagan)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/govenor-scott-walker-r-wi/571743/963 "2011-03-04T02:54:54Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > There’s also a difference in that money that goes to Boeing may or may not make it into the pockets of the workers, while money negotiated by the public unions goes directly to all those members, giving them a much bigger financial incentive to become politically active. And then that money goes from their pockets to Office Depot to buy supplies for their students. How soon do you think workers would start striking if private workers were required to do the same? “Here is your workstation. Orientation will be at 1pm, make sure you have your computer set up by then.” “Um, what computer.” “You don’t have one? I guess you can give you a half-hour to go get one. Not on the clock of course.” “Uh?” I think their work environment has a bit more to do with their political activity then their compensation does, though it does play a factor, because they have no assurances their contract will be valid past any given election. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 3:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/govenor-scott-walker-r-wi/571743/964 "2011-03-04T03:04:35Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > The difference is a matter of scale. Boeing has 157,000 employees. The SEIU has 2.2 million members. The AFSCME has over 1 million members. > > There’s also a difference in that money that goes to Boeing may or may not make it into the pockets of the workers, while money negotiated by the public unions goes directly to all those members, giving them a much bigger financial incentive to become politically active. > > But in principle it’s the same, and there are certainly abuses of government carried out by large companies - sometimes in collusion with their own labor unions, btw (See: GM). Boeing has managed to land contracts despite non-competitive bids because of its influence on government. Something I heartily oppose, and I suspect you do to, which makes it weird for you to use them as an example of the kind of behavior the public unions also engage in. > > Either you think I support corporate pork and were hoping to catch me in an act of hypocrisy, in which case you haven’t read much of what I’ve said on these boards, or you somehow think that corruption of government by Boeing makes corruption of government by labor unions somehow okay. Either way, it’s a losing argument. The Boeing bosses make huge amounts of money, They use company profits to bribe congressmen, foreign leaders regulators , and senators. The military contractors are famous for bribery and stealing from the taxpayers. [http://archive.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2003/12/1/94848.shtml](http://archive.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2003/12/1/94848.shtml) You picked a lousy example. Boeing has gotten in trouble for bribes, scandals and looting the military budget. Is there some reason you believe military contracts are not using tax money? ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 3:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/govenor-scott-walker-r-wi/571743/965 "2011-03-04T03:05:44Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > As a _counterpoint_. I never said anything about the issue being proven by that paper…Out of that you make the claim that I said the paper in question was proof of something?.. You mean to say that you were simply offering an example, something to demonstrate to us hive-minded types that other opinions exist? But you were already doing that, **Sam**. You were giving us _your_ opinion, which is decidedly, adamantly different. But if this cite isn’t really a cite, if there is no argumentative value implied, why then do you regale us with the author’s _bona fides_? Right here: > [@](#): > > …The author of that piece was the deputy commissioner of the Social Security Administration, a former director of the Congressional Research Service, associate director of the National Economics Counsel, and holds a Ph.D from the London School of Economics… If you are not implying some evidentiary weight here, why underline his expertise? Unless you are using him to support your argument, why even bring him up? But popped for it (rather mildly), you dive for the weaseldoor, you try to pretend that a cite isn’t a cite, presuming I’m so dumb I won’t notice you peeing on my shoes and telling me its raining. Hey, **Sam** , want a turnip? There was a whole bunch of them on that truck I just fell off of! > [@](#): > > …What is it with you guys that you have to keep putting words in the mouths of your opponents?.. Didn’t put words in your mouth, just didn’t let your erase the ones you said. > [@](#): > > …Is this what you have to resort to when losing an argument? Dunno. Have to lose one first, I guess, before I’ll find out. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/govenor-scott-walker-r-wi/571743/966 "2011-03-04T03:09:53Z")
[The Boeing Scandal After the Boeing Scandals | HuffPost Latest News](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/robert-weissman/the-boeing-scandal-after-_b_24783.html) Boeing has been robbing the tax payers while off shoring a lot of their operations, But in America, steal big and they will be afraid to prosecute. How much stock holder money and profits is siphoned off to do Boeings dirty work. But of course the top bosses all deserve millions of dollars in pay. Psychopaths don’t come cheap. ---
**Author:** ![Nadir](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nadir/32/7302_2.png) [@Nadir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nadir)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/govenor-scott-walker-r-wi/571743/967 "2011-03-04T03:12:54Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > One of the most annoying things about the tactics the left use on this board is to assume that every cite from someone on the right is a lie unless proven otherwise, and that every cite that someone from the left posts automatically trumps the cites from the right, and therefore the person on the right is ‘shown’ the truth and is a liar. I heard that. Annoying yes, in an intellectual entitlement sort of way. > [@suranyi](#): > > [ul][li]Ergo, ice cream bought by public employess come from the taxpayer.[/ul][/li]Does this mean the taxpayers, collectively, have the right to decide how much ice cream public employess can buy? I thought everything came from taxpayers? I mean, is not literally just about every damn thing that gets monetized in some way in this country directly from taxpayers either in the form of taxes paid or goods and services produced and bought by virtue of their taxable endeavors? You know - those voters, engaging in all that activity? Like the ones who voted for the WI Governor and legislature? > [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > What is it with you guys that you have to keep putting words in the mouths of your opponents? Well, this tactic does have the appeal of being easier than coming up with your own information and casting doubt on the opponent at the same time - double whammy kinda thing. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/govenor-scott-walker-r-wi/571743/968 "2011-03-04T03:13:37Z")
[http://www.corpwatch.org/article.php?id=13582](http://www.corpwatch.org/article.php?id=13582) Heres a nice 625 million dollar fine Boeing had to pay. How much do you really think they bilked the tax payer out of? ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 3:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/govenor-scott-walker-r-wi/571743/969 "2011-03-04T03:24:57Z")
> [@Nadir](#): > > …You know - those voters, engaging in all that activity? Like the ones who voted for the WI Governor and legislature?.. Oh, so its the will of the people, then? That’s certainly very different! So, he ran on a platform of disemboweling the unions? You can cite that, of course, the many, many different occasions when he said that? No? A pity. But that’s all right, nobody else can either. Kind of a trick question. I totally believe in the will of the people, its about as close to sacred as this secular humanist will attest to. But for that will to be worthy of reverence, it must be honestly obtained, the will of the hoodwinked is nothing more than loot. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/govenor-scott-walker-r-wi/571743/970 "2011-03-04T03:26:04Z")
Condit was making a salary of 3.8 million a year plus benefits and bonuses running Boeing until he resigned in disgrace. When he resigned ,his retirement was a mere 3.1 million a year. How many public employees benefits would that cover? ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 3:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/govenor-scott-walker-r-wi/571743/971 "2011-03-04T03:30:12Z")
[http://news.infoshop.org/article.php?story=03/12/16/5284607](http://news.infoshop.org/article.php?story=03/12/16/5284607) Here’s a nice story about Boeing offshoring work. The article explains how offshoring has made workers insecure and they will accept slashes in benefits and salary. Yep, they are a true American example. ---
**Author:** ![Gordon69](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@Gordon69](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gordon69)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 3:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/govenor-scott-walker-r-wi/571743/972 "2011-03-04T03:34:38Z")
Alright, time to lighten up the place with a little humor… What do you get when you have 50 lesbians and 50 Wisconsin democrats? 100 people that DON’T DO DICK! ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 3:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/govenor-scott-walker-r-wi/571743/973 "2011-03-04T03:45:06Z")
Might be real good time to slink away. ---
**Author:** ![Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/try2b_comprehensive/32/65_2.png) [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Try2B_Comprehensive)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 3:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/govenor-scott-walker-r-wi/571743/974 "2011-03-04T03:56:43Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > Wisconsin, already has one of the top ten education systems in the country. Big whoop. Wisconsin is competing against the likes of Georgia, Mississippi, Texas, etc. And globally, ccording to [this](http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0923110.html), the US ranks 25th in math, science and reading skills among 15-year-olds. When Wisconsin students start to compare favorably with the likes of South Korea, Finland, the Netherlands and so on, then we can start handing out pats on the back. But let’s look at this again. People with good math/reasoning skills certainly are far less likely to vote Republican since one of the benefits of education is the capacity to tell shit from shinola. I think this fact reveals the naked political nature of Walker’s actions. No I don’t have a cite to back that up, but I do have Exhibit A: The debate skills of **superslug** et al. ---
**Author:** ![Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/try2b_comprehensive/32/65_2.png) [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Try2B_Comprehensive)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 4:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/govenor-scott-walker-r-wi/571743/975 "2011-03-04T04:02:03Z")
> [@Zebra](#): > > Who the fuck is Scott Walker? He is a weasely Republican who is running for recalled governor of Wisconsin. I think he has a pretty good too too- his campaign is getting the kind of media coverage that even the Koch brothers couldn’t buy! ---
**Author:** ![Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/try2b_comprehensive/32/65_2.png) [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Try2B_Comprehensive)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 4:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/govenor-scott-walker-r-wi/571743/976 "2011-03-04T04:15:27Z")
> [@gonzomax](#): > > Absolutely true. The top 1 percent own 38 percent of the wealth. The top 5 own over half the wealth. Which means 95 percent of the people own less than half. A friend sent me a very interesting article, [What Conservatives Really Want](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/george-lakoff/what-conservatives-really_b_825504.html?ref=fb&src=sp). According to George Lakoff, the distribution of assets is at least as skewed as you say: > [@](#): > > there is plenty of money in America, and in Wisconsin. It is at the top. The disparity in financial assets is un-American – the top one percent has more financial assets than the bottom 95 percent. Middle class wages have been flat for 30 years, while the wealth has floated to the top. So… tell me again why we’re picking on teachers? Oh yeah, racism is out of style, and picking on gays is on the way out too. Ask a conservative to actually define ‘liberal’ and you’ll get a glassy stare, if not assaulted. Conservatives simply _cannot_ function without some demographic to demonize. Now it’s those gol durn teachers and their greedy unions! I’m curious to see others’ (thoughtful) comments on the rest of the article. ---
**Author:** ![mkecane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9e8a1a/32.png) [@mkecane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mkecane)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 4:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/govenor-scott-walker-r-wi/571743/977 "2011-03-04T04:17:14Z")
Senate Majority Leader Fitzgerald has called for the arrest of the 14 Democrats. He’s said that citizens can (should?) call the cops if they spot a Democratic senator. What I’d love to read about is a Spartacus-like situation where people just start calling in with leads left and right. “I just saw Senator Larson at 76th & Good Hope in Milwaukee.” “I just saw Senator Larson at Kohl’s in Glendale.” “I heard Senator Larson is driving down Wisconsin Ave toward the US Bank building.” And so on… ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 4:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/govenor-scott-walker-r-wi/571743/978 "2011-03-04T04:23:44Z")
I am beginning to think busting the unions is a stalking horse for Walker’s (read: conservative) real goal: destroying public education in America. If they can reduce public teacher compensation so low, and reduce spending on education so much, eventually test scores will plummet low enough they can point to the failure of public schools and ram through vouchers for private education for the whitest and brightest of America’s students, and eventually close the public schools altogether. I honestly think conservatives want to destroy America. ---
**Author:** ![TravisFromOR](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/cc9497/32.png) [@TravisFromOR](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TravisFromOR)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 4:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/govenor-scott-walker-r-wi/571743/979 "2011-03-04T04:27:02Z")
> [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](#): > > Exhibit A: The debate skills of **superslug** et al. But everyone knows that collective bargaining goes against the public interest. There’s no need for debate skills, since there’s no debate. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 4:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/govenor-scott-walker-r-wi/571743/980 "2011-03-04T04:36:40Z")
> [@](#): > > …and ram through vouchers for private education for the whitest and brightest of America’s students, and eventually close the public schools altogether. According to scurrilous lefty sources I have not directly verified, there is a plan afoot to eliminate the income cap on credits for private schools, in order to ensure that rich folks kids are not discriminated against. By the way, did you hear about the guy who dressed up as a pimp, and taped his conversations with the union goons? Pretty damning stuff… ---
**Author:** ![user\_hostile](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/user_hostile/32/474_2.png) [@user\_hostile](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/user_hostile)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 4:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/govenor-scott-walker-r-wi/571743/981 "2011-03-04T04:40:55Z")
I watched [FRONTLINE](http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/collegeinc/?utm_campaign=homepage&utm_medium=bigimage&utm_source=bigimage)this week and couldn’t help but wonder if this was also happening with higher education. The thing that bugs me is that federal money is going more and more to private-for-profit universities (in the form of student loans–which is turning out to be bad for the student, but good for the school). Which means as this industry gets larger, they will lobby for more and more funds at the expense of public and private non-profit institutions. Now is this good or bad? I don’t know. What about tenure? What if you wish to be outspoken about new ideas? Has any of the for-profits shown innovation or academic accomplishments or are they just assembly line machines with accreditation? ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2011, 4:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/govenor-scott-walker-r-wi/571743/982 "2011-03-04T04:40:58Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > Funny, I read it as “welovethemasterwewillservehimalwaysallhailthereaganallhailwelovethemasterwewillservehimalwaysallhailthereaganallhail…” > > Which ain’t bad return on investment for a cult that worships a man whose brain was already rotting in his skull the day he was first inaugurated. I think Reagan gets a bad rap by association with the modern day Republicans. If he were a congressman over the last 10 years, he would not have survived the purging of Republican moderates from the Republican party. He was pro-life but he wouldn’t have tried to deny abortions to the victims of incest and statutory rape. He was against raising taxes but they weren’t “off the table” for him. He understood making a compromise didn’t mean you have compromised yourself. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/govenor-scott-walker-r-wi/571743.md?page=48) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/govenor-scott-walker-r-wi/571743.md?page=50)