# Government shutdown watch fall 2023 edition **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Tags:** trump\ **Created:** [September 5, 2023, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/government-shutdown-watch-fall-2023-edition/989657 "2023-09-05T18:05:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![squeegee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/squeegee/32/14537_2.png) [@squeegee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squeegee)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2023, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/government-shutdown-watch-fall-2023-edition/989657/141 "2023-09-30T21:50:23Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > But I think it’s HUGE that McCarthy used Dem votes for the first time to bypass the nutcase caucus The debt ceiling deal couldn’t have passed without Dem support. ---
**Author:** ![flurb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/51bf81/32.png) [@flurb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flurb)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2023, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/government-shutdown-watch-fall-2023-edition/989657/142 "2023-09-30T21:50:57Z")
It’s hard to say what counts as a historical precedent. Representative Preston Brooks beat the shit out of Senator Charles Sumner on the floor of the Senate and the House failed to expel him for it. I feel like pulling a fire alarm, while juvenile, probably doesn’t exceed that on the “expulsion-worthy” scale. I agree it was dumb, but I don’t see it as a fundamental attack on democracy. There were Members of the House who sought to overturn the outcome of the Presidential election, and they’re getting on just fine. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2023, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/government-shutdown-watch-fall-2023-edition/989657/143 "2023-09-30T22:09:28Z")
> [@flurb](#): > > It’s hard to say what counts as a historical precedent. Representative Preston Brooks beat the shit out of Senator Charles Sumner on the floor of the Senate and the House failed to expel him for it. I feel like pulling a fire alarm, while juvenile, probably doesn’t exceed that on the “expulsion-worthy” scale. That was the closest one I could think of, and wasn’t it pre-Civil War? I am hoping our standards for decorum have risen since then. Reading the Wikipedia article, there was an attempt to oust him from Congress, and at least one historian credits this act of violence with moving the country even closer towards Civil War. ---
**Author:** ![PhillyGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ed655f/32.png) [@PhillyGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PhillyGuy)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2023, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/government-shutdown-watch-fall-2023-edition/989657/144 "2023-09-30T22:09:34Z")
> [@flurb](#): > > I agree it was dumb, but I don’t see it as a fundamental attack on democracy. A mistake doesn’t rise to the level of dumb. Bowman had no motive to disrupt the vote – he voted yes, just like every other Democrat save one. ---
**Author:** ![flurb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/51bf81/32.png) [@flurb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flurb)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2023, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/government-shutdown-watch-fall-2023-edition/989657/145 "2023-09-30T22:31:31Z")
> [@PhillyGuy](#): > > Bowman had no motive to disrupt the vote – he voted yes, just like every other Democrat save one. The allegation is that he was trying to delay the vote — Democrats had just gotten the text of the resolution and were trying to scrutinize it for any Republican poison pills. ---
**Author:** ![MulderMuffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muldermuffin/32/2862_2.png) [@MulderMuffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MulderMuffin)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2023, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/government-shutdown-watch-fall-2023-edition/989657/146 "2023-09-30T22:31:55Z")
> [@PhillyGuy](#): > > Bowman had no motive to disrupt the vote – he voted yes, just like every other Democrat save one I’m not saying he did it deliberately, but he definitely did have motive to _delay_ (not entirely disrupt) the vote. Democrats were trying to get time to read through the bill before voting on it. Jeffries took his magic minute to speak for over an hour as a stall tactic to give his members time to read and consider the bill. Ninja’ed by flurb. Hello! ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2023, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/government-shutdown-watch-fall-2023-edition/989657/147 "2023-09-30T22:32:40Z")
Ignoring the fire alarm for a while, I understand the Senate has already passed a similar bill with the main difference being the Ukraine funding. So I’d expect that the two bills would go to a reconciliation committee to hammer out a compromise bill. Perhaps some Ukraine support will be added back into that compromise. ---
**Author:** ![MulderMuffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muldermuffin/32/2862_2.png) [@MulderMuffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MulderMuffin)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2023, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/government-shutdown-watch-fall-2023-edition/989657/148 "2023-09-30T22:33:55Z")
I doubt it, because they’ve got only until midnight tonight to get _something_ passed, and the House already went home for the weekend. ---
**Author:** ![flurb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/51bf81/32.png) [@flurb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flurb)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2023, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/government-shutdown-watch-fall-2023-edition/989657/149 "2023-09-30T22:34:09Z")
No, the Senate is going to pass the House bill as-is. edit: ninjaed back, @MulderMuffin — touché! ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2023, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/government-shutdown-watch-fall-2023-edition/989657/150 "2023-09-30T22:57:54Z")
So does this mean that Ukraine gets no funding from the US until and unless a next bill passes with such contained by that November kick the can down the road some more date? Or does Biden have executive order means at his disposal? ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2023, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/government-shutdown-watch-fall-2023-edition/989657/151 "2023-09-30T23:10:36Z")
> [@squeegee](#): > > The debt ceiling deal couldn’t have passed without Dem support. Is this because there are essentially three parties in the House at the moment…. (D, R and T) It sounds like a minority government in a parliamentary democracy, with the far right Trumpist Party holding control. Normally in a situation like this in another system, this sort of unstable situation would often lead to a vote of no confidence and a quick election so the voters can tell them to sort their shit out. ---
**Author:** ![squeegee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/squeegee/32/14537_2.png) [@squeegee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squeegee)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2023, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/government-shutdown-watch-fall-2023-edition/989657/152 "2023-09-30T23:29:46Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > Is this because there are essentially three parties in the House at the moment…. (D, R and T) > > It sounds like a minority government in a parliamentary democracy, with the far right Trumpist Party holding control. 26 members of the Freedom Caucus voted against the debt ceiling bill. It passed. I expect many or most of the FC voted against the CR today, but I haven’t seen the vote totals anywhere. It passed. This doesn’t sound like the T faction growing stronger or being in control. If McCarthy holds his gavel, which I consider quite likely, they are further marginalized. ---
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2023, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/government-shutdown-watch-fall-2023-edition/989657/153 "2023-09-30T23:40:11Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > So does this mean that Ukraine gets no funding from the US until and unless a next bill passes I believe most US support has been weapon transfers from existing DoD stockpiles. I don’t see why that won’t continue. ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2023, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/government-shutdown-watch-fall-2023-edition/989657/154 "2023-09-30T23:47:58Z")
So the government will continue lurching along for another 45 days while Congress goes on its flailing way trying to pass another funding bill in its usual dysfunctional muddle. That should get us up to, lemme see… Oh! Happy Thanksgiving! But at least we won’t be missing [Fat Bear Week](https://www.nps.gov/katm/learn/fat-bear-week.htm). ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2023, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/government-shutdown-watch-fall-2023-edition/989657/155 "2023-10-01T00:15:55Z")
## “We’re tired of fucking around with these whack jobs.” Rep. Don Bacon (R-Neb.) [https://www.politico.com/live-updates/2023/09/30/congress/stopgap-passes-00119280](https://www.politico.com/live-updates/2023/09/30/congress/stopgap-passes-00119280) ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2023, 12:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/government-shutdown-watch-fall-2023-edition/989657/156 "2023-10-01T00:24:18Z")
> [@MulderMuffin](#): > > the House already went home for the weekend. Nasty of them. Maybe the Senate should have gone home last night to stymie this. ---
**Author:** ![mozchron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c2a13f/32.png) [@mozchron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mozchron)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2023, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/government-shutdown-watch-fall-2023-edition/989657/157 "2023-10-01T00:29:37Z")
Hmm… [House Dem Leadership Statement: “When the House returns, we expect Speaker McCarthy to advance a bill to the House Floor for an up-or-down vote that supports Ukraine, consistent with his commitment to making sure that Vladimir Putin, Russia and authoritarianism are defeated.”](https://twitter.com/jackturmanIII/status/1708271975267782907) ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2023, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/government-shutdown-watch-fall-2023-edition/989657/158 "2023-10-01T00:30:03Z")
They had to strip the Ukraine funding out, or else Paul would have denied unanimous consent in the Senate: > [@](#): > > To actually avert a shutdown, though, the Senate still needs to act. Such a move would require unanimous consent from all 100 senators, but Sen. Rand Paul (R-Ky.) said he thought the GOP would allow it. > > “If the House passes a clean CR and it doesn’t have all that new Ukraine money in it? I will give my consent to let them speed up the process and have a vote on it this afternoon. I think our caucus leans in that direction,” Paul said. “I think it comes over here and we get consent to pass it over here and maybe done this afternoon.” ---
**Author:** ![mozchron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c2a13f/32.png) [@mozchron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mozchron)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2023, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/government-shutdown-watch-fall-2023-edition/989657/159 "2023-10-01T00:31:51Z")
Rand Paul’s neighbor needs to hit him harder next time, maybe aim for the head… ---
**Author:** ![TruCelt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/trucelt/32/523_2.png) [@TruCelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TruCelt)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2023, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/government-shutdown-watch-fall-2023-edition/989657/160 "2023-10-01T00:40:10Z")
If I’m counting correctly, that’s 68 "Aye"s. No shutdown. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/government-shutdown-watch-fall-2023-edition/989657.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/government-shutdown-watch-fall-2023-edition/989657.md?page=9)