# Governor Jerry Brown signs assisted suicide bill. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 6, 2015, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/governor-jerry-brown-signs-assisted-suicide-bill/733669 "2015-10-06T00:29:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2015, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/governor-jerry-brown-signs-assisted-suicide-bill/733669/41 "2015-10-06T23:04:05Z")
The inability of opponents to distinguish between people in difficult lives that can and could be changed - job loss, depression, business failure, etc. - and those who are facing months to years of nothing but drugged-to-the-eyebrows pain, suffering and near-zero quality of life, with absolutely no cure or release short of death, indicate that we have a long ways to go to cure stupidity. ---
**Author:** ![gazpacho](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/6f9a4e/32.png) [@gazpacho](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gazpacho)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2015, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/governor-jerry-brown-signs-assisted-suicide-bill/733669/42 "2015-10-06T23:04:40Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > The fact that you consider death preferable to pain is telling. Yes it means I am a rational person. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2015, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/governor-jerry-brown-signs-assisted-suicide-bill/733669/43 "2015-10-06T23:05:42Z")
> [@Amateur\_Barbarian](#): > > those who are facing months to years of nothing but drugged-to-the-eyebrows pain, suffering and near-zero quality of life, with absolutely no cure or release short of death The entire human race, in other words. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2015, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/governor-jerry-brown-signs-assisted-suicide-bill/733669/44 "2015-10-06T23:11:41Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > Perhaps, if you hold the opinion that a painful life is not worth living. I disagree. Then don’t opt for assisted suicide. It’s not mandatory, you know. ---
**Author:** ![Maggie\_the\_Ocelot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@Maggie\_the\_Ocelot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maggie_the_Ocelot)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2015, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/governor-jerry-brown-signs-assisted-suicide-bill/733669/45 "2015-10-06T23:13:05Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > The entire human race, in other words. Woah. You really feel that way? I feel crazy sorry for you now, and I understand your POV a bit better. Still disagree with it completely, by the way. ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2015, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/governor-jerry-brown-signs-assisted-suicide-bill/733669/46 "2015-10-06T23:13:44Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > … > > For now. We’ve already established above that posters here are perfectly OK with someone using their power of attorney to order the death of a family member. That is a total misstatement. My mother had a end of life document that she wanted me to honor. I didn’t want to. I dreaded that the day might ever come. But it did. And the doctors and nurses at the hospital took the time necessary to explain to me that she would never recover, but suffer possible pain and indignity from that point on. But, by removed her from support, she would likely die - just sooner. I refuse to believe that I “ordered” her death by giving permission to remove it, nor than any other family member who honors the wishes of a competent member for end of life options “ordered” their death. If you think these are easy decisions for family members, then you’ve been greatly mislead. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2015, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/governor-jerry-brown-signs-assisted-suicide-bill/733669/47 "2015-10-06T23:15:06Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > Then don’t opt for assisted suicide. It’s not mandatory, you know. For now. > [@Morgenstern](#): > > If you think these are easy decisions for family members, then you’ve been greatly mislead. I don’t think it’s a decision a family member has the authority to make. ---
**Author:** ![Idle\_Thoughts](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/838e76/32.png) [@Idle\_Thoughts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Idle_Thoughts)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2015, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/governor-jerry-brown-signs-assisted-suicide-bill/733669/48 "2015-10-06T23:15:55Z")
> [@Peremensoe](#): > > 😕 > > Whatever, it was going to end up here anyway… now **Maggie the Ocelet** can have her say! My mistake, although the first part of my post still applies and I guess you can change the OP being upset to “something that others might get upset about”. ---
**Author:** ![gazpacho](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/6f9a4e/32.png) [@gazpacho](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gazpacho)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2015, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/governor-jerry-brown-signs-assisted-suicide-bill/733669/49 "2015-10-06T23:16:22Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > The entire human race, in other words. Aside from my father in law’s last few months dying of cancer. I have personally never met someone who was currently facing “facing months to years of nothing but drugged-to-the-eyebrows pain, suffering and near-zero quality of life, with absolutely no cure or release short of death” It does not describe my current condition and I bet it does not describe your current condition. What is your point with this remark. Nobody is suggesting in this thread that we kill healthy functional people. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2015, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/governor-jerry-brown-signs-assisted-suicide-bill/733669/50 "2015-10-06T23:16:46Z")
I read the OP and wondered why this was posted in the Pit. Then I started reading, and it became obvious: Smapti. It didn’t start here, it was moved here. ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2015, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/governor-jerry-brown-signs-assisted-suicide-bill/733669/51 "2015-10-06T23:19:04Z")
> [@samclem](#): > > I’m convinced that you didn’t read the limitations that the law places on individuals who choose to legally end their lives. Otherwise, your statements sound irrational. _Sound?_ Some people just don’t do well when their preferred Morality Dispenser loses its [“Because I Said So” Mandate](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=18488398&postcount=19). Anyway, I’m fully in favor of Jerry Brown’s decision and I hope the right to die with dignity is recognized at the Federal level very soon. (Demographically, of course, this is practically a foregone conclusion, on two fronts… ) ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2015, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/governor-jerry-brown-signs-assisted-suicide-bill/733669/52 "2015-10-06T23:22:29Z")
> [@gazpacho](#): > > Aside from my father in law’s last few months dying of cancer. I have personally never met someone who was currently facing “facing months to years of nothing but drugged-to-the-eyebrows pain, suffering and near-zero quality of life, with absolutely no cure or release short of death” It does not describe my current condition and I bet it does not describe your current condition. What release from your current state of existence are you _expecting_? Do you anticipate a golden chariot descending from the heavens to escort you into the bosom of Abraham while angels sing glories of your ascension? Death is all that any of us have to look forward to, and pain is all we can expect to experience in the meantime. The only difference is the degree of it we’re experiencing at the moment. This is all we get - we can either make the most of it, or we can chicken out. ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2015, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/governor-jerry-brown-signs-assisted-suicide-bill/733669/53 "2015-10-06T23:25:01Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > … > > I don’t think it’s a decision a family member has the authority to make. Let me try this again. The “person” makes the decision, the family just follows their wishes. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2015, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/governor-jerry-brown-signs-assisted-suicide-bill/733669/54 "2015-10-06T23:25:54Z")
> [@Morgenstern](#): > > Let me try this again. The “person” makes the decision, the family just follows their wishes. I don’t think that’s a decision that a person has the authority to make, either. ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2015, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/governor-jerry-brown-signs-assisted-suicide-bill/733669/55 "2015-10-06T23:31:07Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > or we can chicken out. You have not only lost this argument, you’ve thrown away whatever respect most of us once had for you. The _nice, generous_ interpretation is that you’re totally irrational on this subject, due to operating from premises so divorced from reality any conclusions you draw from them are similarly alien to actual experience. The interpretation most people will have is that you’re a singularly incompetent troll who’s taking a position so extreme that it destroys the uncertainty trolling is built on: Is it real or is it a put-on? In short, if a good troll involves claiming Trump is a foreign policy genius, you’re on the level of shouting your admiration for Josef Mengele at Yad Vashem. ---
**Author:** ![Memnon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f1d935/32.png) [@Memnon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Memnon)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2015, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/governor-jerry-brown-signs-assisted-suicide-bill/733669/56 "2015-10-06T23:31:19Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > I don’t think that’s a decision that a person has the authority to make, either. If a person doesn’t have the right to decide what to do with _their own body_, what _do_ they have the right to decide? Assisted suicide laws give people control over what is quite possibly the most profound and important decision they’ll have to ever make. What on _earth_ has it got to do with you, the government, or anyone else? ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2015, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/governor-jerry-brown-signs-assisted-suicide-bill/733669/57 "2015-10-06T23:37:23Z")
> [@Tithonus](#): > > If a person doesn’t have the right to decide what to do with _their own body_, what _do_ they have the right to decide? When has a person _ever_ had “the right to decide what to do with their body”? Governments regulate all sorts of things people do to themselves - what they can eat or drink, what chemicals they can use, what operations they can undergo. > [@](#): > > What on _earth_ has it got to do with you, the government, or anyone else? It has to do with all of us, because it relates to what value we place on human life. ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2015, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/governor-jerry-brown-signs-assisted-suicide-bill/733669/58 "2015-10-06T23:38:06Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > I don’t think that’s a decision that a person has the authority to make, either. Just… Wow. ---
**Author:** ![Memnon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f1d935/32.png) [@Memnon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Memnon)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2015, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/governor-jerry-brown-signs-assisted-suicide-bill/733669/59 "2015-10-06T23:45:44Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > When has a person _ever_ had “the right to decide what to do with their body”? Governments regulate all sorts of things people do to themselves - what they can eat or drink, what chemicals they can use, what operations they can undergo. That doesn’t answer the question. What I’m asking is, if the government has the right to tell you how you are allowed to die, why doesn’t it follow that they also have the right to tell you what to eat? Or what activities are too “dangerous” for you? If the government ruled that we all had to eat a mediterranean diet to maximise our longevity, or that we weren’t allowed to do extreme sports, would you be ok with that? After all, it would certainly send a very strong message about the value of human life. > [@Smapti](#): > > It has to do with all of us, because it relates to what value we place on human life. “We” don’t have a right to place _any_ level of value on other human lives. We only have a right to place a value on our own. If a person suffering a painful and humiliating terminal illness decides, in their final weeks or months, to check out early, the only moral choice is to _respect that decision._ ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2015, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/governor-jerry-brown-signs-assisted-suicide-bill/733669/60 "2015-10-06T23:48:22Z")
> [@Tithonus](#): > > That doesn’t answer the question. What I’m asking is, if the government has the right to tell you how you are allowed to die, why doesn’t it follow that they also have the right to tell you what to eat? Or what activities are too “dangerous” for you? If the government ruled that we all had to eat a mediterranean diet to maximise our longevity, or that we weren’t allowed to do extreme sports, would you be ok with that? It certainly does - and I’m far more comfortable with that than with the idea of the government deciding when our lives are no longer worth living, which is the consequence of your way of thought. > [@](#): > > “We” don’t have a right to place _any_ level of value on other human lives. Then democracy is invalid. > [@](#): > > If a person suffering a painful and humiliating terminal illness decides, in their final weeks or months, to check out early, the only moral choice is to _respect that decision._ No, the moral choice is to alleviate their pain and eradicate the cause of their illness. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/governor-jerry-brown-signs-assisted-suicide-bill/733669.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/governor-jerry-brown-signs-assisted-suicide-bill/733669.md?page=4)