# Grammar Help: Will vs. Shall **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [August 24, 2000, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/grammar-help-will-vs-shall/30580 "2000-08-24T13:31:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![HeyHomie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/heyhomie/32/207_2.png) [@HeyHomie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HeyHomie)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2000, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/grammar-help-will-vs-shall/30580/1 "2000-08-24T13:31:17Z")
It seems that the word “shall” has all but dropped out of American English, save for use by legal documents and some elitists. However, given that the word is still used by (presumably) the rest of the world’s English-speaking population (or those that use Queen’s English, anyway), and given that it seems to be intergangeable with the word “will,” what are the specific rules for its use? I can only think of one use for the word “shall” in place of “will,” and that is in the case of a solemn declaration: _I **shall** return!_ _You **shall** take this ring to The Cracks of Doom in the Fiery Mountain in Mordor and destroy it for good!_ What are the other rules? ---
**Author:** ![Scarlett67](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scarlett67/32/7387_2.png) [@Scarlett67](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scarlett67)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2000, 1:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/grammar-help-will-vs-shall/30580/2 "2000-08-24T13:38:01Z")
A person who is in the process of drowning accidentally: “I shall drown! No one will help me!” A person who is trying to commit suicide by drowning: “I will drown! No one shall help me!” In other words, when you are distinguishing between _shall_ and _will,_ _shall_ indicates what is definitely going to happen, whereas _will_ indicates a desire as to what may happen. ---
**Author:** ![jakanapes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ecc23a/32.png) [@jakanapes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jakanapes)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2000, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/grammar-help-will-vs-shall/30580/3 "2000-08-24T13:49:53Z")
Basically it works like this. I shall We shall you will You (all) will (s)he/it will They will And all that is just the simple future. Nothing special. However if you flip them (He shall, or I will) then it is volitional and determinative and it basically means “By God this **is going** to happen!” Of course most of the distinction has drop out of American English and is really only used in legalese. Should/would worked the same way and that’s where we get our should=ought thing. ---
**Author:** ![TNTruth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/d9b06d/32.png) [@TNTruth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TNTruth)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2000, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/grammar-help-will-vs-shall/30580/4 "2000-08-24T15:06:54Z")
Shall is alive and well in technical documents, which are not quite the same as legal documents. As said above, “shall” denotes a requirement, while “will” denotes volition. “The Contractor shall use pressure treated lumber.” But the Contractor will meet the specifications or get sued. Maybe we borrowed this distinction from the lawyers, but it is significant. ---
**Author:** ![TampaFlyer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/71e660/32.png) [@TampaFlyer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TampaFlyer)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2000, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/grammar-help-will-vs-shall/30580/5 "2000-08-24T21:04:31Z")
My head shall explode from reading this. ---
**Author:** ![Ad\_Noctum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b19c9b/32.png) [@Ad\_Noctum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ad_Noctum)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2000, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/grammar-help-will-vs-shall/30580/6 "2000-08-24T21:10:16Z")
I’ve always thought that SHALL is used with something that may or may not happen, and Will is something that… is going to happen, no matter what. another thing is that Shall seems to be more of a dubious word, where as Will is more of a FORCEFUL word… ---
**Author:** ![iampunha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/74df32/32.png) [@iampunha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iampunha)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2000, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/grammar-help-will-vs-shall/30580/7 "2000-08-24T21:19:24Z")
“Ask the Grammar Harpy” covered this, I believe. Check in other grammar threads for a link. Shall is used, IIRC, when asking a Q. ---
**Author:** ![Maeglin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8baadc/32.png) [@Maeglin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maeglin)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2000, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/grammar-help-will-vs-shall/30580/8 "2000-08-24T21:20:39Z")
It’s the opposite, **Ad Noctum**. _Will_ has been rather bastardized lately, and often takes the place of _shall_, the actual future tense of the verb _to be_. So in the most technical sense, shall is used for futurity and will for volition, but that dichotomy is blurred. Nowadays will seems to have completely pushed out shall, so it’s pretty hard to say that it is outright wrong. I still prefer to use when I write, but I don’t think I’ve ever said it out loud in conversation. MR ---
**Author:** ![Ad\_Noctum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b19c9b/32.png) [@Ad\_Noctum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ad_Noctum)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2000, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/grammar-help-will-vs-shall/30580/9 "2000-08-24T21:27:22Z")
heh… sorry, you’ll have to excuse me, I’m a moron… ---
**Author:** ![BobT](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8e8cbc/32.png) [@BobT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobT)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2000, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/grammar-help-will-vs-shall/30580/10 "2000-08-24T21:58:57Z")
I just read an article where Pete Seeger he started the singing the song “We Will Overcome” as “We Shall Overcome” because it was “easier to get your mouth around ‘shall’” I doubt he thinks there is much difference between the words.