# grammar: subject/verb agreement **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [May 26, 2011, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/grammar-subject-verb-agreement/583274 "2011-05-26T12:59:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 12\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![pancakes3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ba9def/32.png) [@pancakes3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pancakes3)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2011, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/grammar-subject-verb-agreement/583274/1 "2011-05-26T12:59:41Z")
“none of us knows” or “none of us know” ? “any of you know” or “any of you knows” … ---
**Author:** ![TheChileanBlob](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thechileanblob/32/435_2.png) [@TheChileanBlob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TheChileanBlob)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2011, 1:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/grammar-subject-verb-agreement/583274/2 "2011-05-26T13:48:06Z")
Any of you know? None of us knows. ---
**Author:** ![Ximenean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/aca169/32.png) [@Ximenean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ximenean)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2011, 2:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/grammar-subject-verb-agreement/583274/3 "2011-05-26T14:00:02Z")
Both usages are common, and have been for centuries, so they’re both correct in my book. Some people argue that “none” is equivalent to “not one” and therefore should take the singular, but I see nothing wrong with things like “none of them are here”. In fact “none of them is here” sounds odd to me. ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2011, 2:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/grammar-subject-verb-agreement/583274/4 "2011-05-26T14:04:55Z")
**“none of us knows”** or “none of us know” **“any of you know”** or “any of you knows” These are interesting cases when laid side by side. The “any” cases are easy to resolve – the “of you” modifies the word “any”, which specifies a non-specific “one” or “at least one”. Accordingly, the “any” case takes the second person (“of you”) singular (“any”). Compare: _Does anyone know? He knows_ (where the second phrase has a specific referent). The “none” cases were a less definite in my mind, so I went and looked it up. [Interesting find](http://motivatedgrammar.wordpress.com/2009/01/08/none-is-none-are-grammar-according-to-clarkson/) at a descriptivist grammar blog: > [@](#): > > _None_ can be singular or plural, unless it quantifies a singular or mass noun. Don’t believe anyone who says _none_ has to be singular because it’s a contraction of _not one_. Both \*none of the meals \*is and \*none of the meals \*are are okay, and both _none is_ and _none are_ are okay. \*_None of the stuff are_ is ungrammatical, though. So then. I made the choice for “none of us knows” strictly on the basis of style and what sounded good to me. Of course, that’s with the phrase in isolation. Within a longer narrative, with some contextual clues, “none of us know” might sound better. ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2011, 2:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/grammar-subject-verb-agreement/583274/5 "2011-05-26T14:07:55Z")
> [@Ximenean](#): > > Both usages are common, and have been for centuries, so they’re both correct in my book. It might have some dialectical uses, but I’d offer that “any of you knows” has by far the weakest case of the four phrases offered. ---
**Author:** ![Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a183cd/32.png) [@Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barkis_is_Willin)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2011, 2:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/grammar-subject-verb-agreement/583274/6 "2011-05-26T14:19:27Z")
> [@](#): > > \*\*None of the stuff are \*is ungrammatical, though. The example above makes me think you should use the noun being quantified as the subject. In other words, say it like you would if you took out the “none of.” So, the meals are good. None of the meals are good. The problem with “none of us” is that if you take out “none of” you’ve got a bad sentence. Neither “us knows” or “us know” is any good. In that case, I’d assume none is singular and say “none of us know.” ---
**Author:** ![Ximenean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/aca169/32.png) [@Ximenean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ximenean)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2011, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/grammar-subject-verb-agreement/583274/7 "2011-05-26T14:22:01Z")
> [@bordelond](#): > > It might have some dialectical uses, but I’d offer that “any of you knows” has by far the weakest case of the four phrases offered. Oh, I interpreted that part as the OP asking the question in a joky way :smack: ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2011, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/grammar-subject-verb-agreement/583274/8 "2011-05-26T16:05:39Z")
> [@Barkis\_is\_Willin](#): > > The example above makes me think you should use the noun being quantified as the subject. In other words, say it like you would if you took out the “none of.” So, the meals are good. None of the meals are good. The problem with “none of us” is that if you take out “none of” you’ve got a bad sentence. Neither “us knows” or “us know” is any good. In that case, I’d assume none is singular and say “none of us know.” Naw. _Us_ is plural so _none_ is plural. The switch between objective and subjective case is just the necessity of using a prepositional phrase. Just replace _us_ with the antecedent if it bugs you. Oddly enough, I’d say, “None of us know,” but I’d also say, “None of us has.” At least, I would if has is a linking verb. I don’t know why. ---
**Author:** ![\_mostly\_Harmless](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/_/9d8465/32.png) [@\_mostly\_Harmless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/_mostly_Harmless)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2011, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/grammar-subject-verb-agreement/583274/9 "2011-05-27T03:10:15Z")
I think both of the “none of us…” examples are correct, but I interpret them to be slightly different in what they convey. I would interpret “none of us knows” to be putting a fine point on the fact that each individual referred to as part of the ‘us’ does not know. However “none of us know” makes me think that such a distinction is not being made and ‘us’ refers to the conglomeration of individuals without trying to point out their individuality. Just look at the ‘-s’ ending on the verb. That suffix denotes the Third Person, Singular, Present Tense. Notice that it is Singular number. I think that is why I am hearing it as saying something like: “not one of us individuals knows…” Even though that example is kinda clumsy. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2011, 3:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/grammar-subject-verb-agreement/583274/10 "2011-05-27T03:37:22Z")
I usually subscribe to the “none is ‘not one’ and thus singular” school myself, but I never get my panties in a twist when I encounter it used otherwise. [Usage Note](http://education.yahoo.com/reference/dictionary/entry/none) in the American Heritage Dictionary: **“It is widely asserted that _none_ is equivalent to _no one_ and hence requires a singular verb and singular pronoun: ‘None of the prisoners was given his soup.’ It is true that _none_ is etymologically derived from the Old English word _an_, “one,” but the word has been used as both a singular and a plural noun from Old English onward. The plural usage appears in the King James Bible as well as the works of John Dryden and Edmund Burke and is widespread in the works of respectable writers today. Of course, the singular usage is perfectly acceptable. The choice between a singular or plural verb depends on the desired effect. Both options are acceptable in this sentence: ‘None of the conspirators has (or have) been brought to trial.’ When none is modified by _almost_, however, it is difficult to avoid treating the word as a plural: ‘Almost none of the officials were (not was) interviewed by the committee.’ _None_ can only be plural in its use in sentences such as ‘None but his most loyal supporters believe (not believes) his story’.”** ---
**Author:** ![Hari\_Seldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hari_seldon/32/5173_2.png) [@Hari\_Seldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hari_Seldon)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2011, 1:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/grammar-subject-verb-agreement/583274/11 "2011-05-27T13:05:21Z")
Why does every question of this sort have to have a definite answer? Incidentally, there is a serious argument to be made that 0 is a plural (would you say “he has no bananas” or “he has no banana”?) ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2011, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/grammar-subject-verb-agreement/583274/12 "2011-05-28T02:13:30Z")
Yes, he has no bananas. At least, not today.