# Gravitists vs Downists **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 5, 2000, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gravitists-vs-downists/35758 "2000-10-05T12:59:30Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![jab1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ee7513/32.png) [@jab1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jab1)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2000, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gravitists-vs-downists/35758/21 "2000-10-05T15:19:35Z")
You guys have GOT to stop making threads like this. When I’m ROTFLMAO in the middle of a public library, people look at me funny. More than usual, I mean. ---
**Author:** ![Freyr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/freyr/32/5763_2.png) [@Freyr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freyr)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2000, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gravitists-vs-downists/35758/22 "2000-10-05T15:31:24Z")
Oh, and more proof of Downism; I have several friends, all of whom are highly educated and they all agree that Downism is true! One has a PhD in Chemistry, the other is an electronics technician and the last is a Master Plumber. They all say Downism is true! How can you argue with people who hold degrees!? And Aristotle taught Downism! And he taught Plato and Socrates, so that proves that Downism has been around a long time and lots of people believe it and how can they be wrong? ---
**Author:** ![barker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/919ad9/32.png) [@barker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/barker)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2000, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gravitists-vs-downists/35758/23 "2000-10-05T16:17:22Z")
I have proof that the high priest of Gravitism, Sir Issac is actually the Anti-christ Look at his formula:\*\* F=G((m1\*m2)/r^2)\*\* where: m1, m2 are masses r is distance between the centers of the masses G is the universal gravitational constant Now let G = 1 (for simplicity) m1 = 96 m2 = 111 r = 4 Solve for F. Irrefutable proof. ---
**Author:** ![tracer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tracer/32/20578_2.png) [@tracer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tracer)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2000, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gravitists-vs-downists/35758/24 "2000-10-05T17:05:42Z")
CKDextHavn wrote: > [@](#): > > (2) There are lots of things that the theory of gravity fail to explain. For instance, the absence of dinosaur puke in the fossil record. If the earth is really spinning around so fast, then creatures on the earth would feel dizzy and hurl. The absence of dinosaur vomit in geological findings is clear evidence that the earth is not now, nor never has, rotated. Ah, so you’re not merely a Downist, you’re one of those “non-rotating Earth Downists”! You know, there are plenty of good Christians out there who have no trouble accepting that the descriptions of Downism and the non-rotating Earth in the Old Testament are just metaphors, written for the limited scientific understanding of the readers in their own time, and are not to be taken literally. Why, even the Catholic Church now admits that the Earth rotates! (Although they didn’t used to in Galileo’s time.\*) Or is your faith so shaky that you need to “prove” to yourself that every word in the Old Testament is literally true? \*) My apologies for inserting a real, serious statement in this thread – but it fit so well! ---
**Author:** ![kabbes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e99b99/32.png) [@kabbes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kabbes)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2000, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gravitists-vs-downists/35758/25 "2000-10-05T17:24:28Z")
**WHY** do you all **persist** in **insulting** me _ **ALL THE TIME???** _. It’s all so **UNFAIR**. You all call me an idiot just because of my **beliefs**. You’re all bigots. Everyone’s against me, but you’re ALL WRONG. And what about PLANNED GRAVITY? ::considers bringing in sock puppet\* to parrot responses:: \*[sub]er… Mods, I hope that I don’t need to point out that this is a joke[/sub] ---
**Author:** ![Freyr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/freyr/32/5763_2.png) [@Freyr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freyr)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2000, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gravitists-vs-downists/35758/26 "2000-10-05T18:25:02Z")
\*\*jab1 wrote: You guys have GOT to stop making threads like this. When I’m ROTFLMAO in the middle of a public library, people look at me funny. More than usual, I mean.\*\* That’s **VERY** insulting! It says right here in my Holy Book that Downism is right because my Holy Book says so. I bet you’re one of those atheist types that just wants to destroy all religion. And once religion is destroyed, communism will take over and all of Western civilization will be gone, too! ---
**Author:** ![jab1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ee7513/32.png) [@jab1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jab1)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2000, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gravitists-vs-downists/35758/27 "2000-10-05T19:24:13Z")
Stuff falls down because it would look funny if it fell up. It would violate the natural order of stuff. Them gravitists also claim there’s no air in space. (Why? Because gravity made all the air fall onto the Earth.) If Heaven is in space and there is no air up there, how does God breathe, huh? How could Gabriel blow his trumpet? And how could anyone hear it? ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2000, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gravitists-vs-downists/35758/28 "2000-10-06T01:21:38Z")
Are those your best arguments? I’ll show you an argument! Givens: [ul] [li]G.1. The Earth exists in my reference frame, all other reference frames being damned.[/li][li]G.2. It is now late evening in my reference frame. The sun is (nearly) gone. The sky looks like burnished silver. The sun was gold. Bimetallism has authority from On High, the bad money driving out the good.[/li][li]G.3. I am sitting down.[/li][li]G.4. Sucking sucks. Therefore, it cannot be valid.[/li][/ul] Inferences: [ul] [li]I.1. Given G.1 and G.3, I must be attracted by Earth.[/li][li]I.2. That means Earth must be more massive than I, or else I would have crushed the Earth.[/li][li]I.3. I.2 means that my diet has worked, meaning that I can eat pizza.[/li][li]I.4. Given G.2 and I.3, the pizza will be purchased by money that is backed by gold and silver. This money is rapidly devaluing (Grisham’s Law), meaning that the value is going down.[/li][li]I.5. Given G.4, we know that nothing could suck the value of currency down.[/li][li]I.6. Therefore, nothing is sucking on me. Damn.[/li][li]I.7. Since both me (massive [yeah, I’m pretty big]) and the value of currency (nonmassive [I’ve never seen any bills so big I couldn’t run with them.]) are going down, the direction of down must have some special property.[/li][li]I.8. Therefore, downists must be right while suckists just suck. Their argument sucks, too.[/li][/ul] Satisfied? ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2000, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gravitists-vs-downists/35758/29 "2000-10-06T01:50:16Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Kyberneticist \* > \*\*It might be interesting to set up miniature solar systems in microgravity… Would a ping-pong ball orbit a basketball in the shuttle if set up right? Or would there be too much “noise” from all the other massive stuff around? \*\* I’m still trying to sort out this downism/suckism theory. To conduct our experiment, we’ll need to construct an anti-suck AND anti-downity stasis field. Obviously, you and I should get a huge government grant to construct one. I suggest we build our prototype in Tahiti. An alternate theory would be **porcism,** the theory that I am affixed to the earth because I’m inhaling Big Macs at record pace, but I cannot figure out how to isolate this effect from the downist or suckist effects. It also would not explain how supermodels stay on the ground. I think it’s a damned shame the Presidential candidates have not addressed this key issue. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2000, 2:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gravitists-vs-downists/35758/30 "2000-10-06T02:07:58Z")
All right. If Gravity is only a theory. How do Downists explain airplanes and birds flying? Gravity provides a clear explanation of Flight using the principle of Static Gravity, which, when one overcomes it, allows one to go Up. Nothing in the (faith based) speculations of Downism can accurately explain why anything is allowed to go Up. Clearly this specious argument has been allowed to continue only as a sop to that (_name withheld_) Down-wing political party and its increasingly vocal religious supporters. If left to the politics of the Downists, the Wright brothers would have spent their final years in prison for having the temerity to demonstrate that one can overcome gravity (which the Downists refuse to even recognize as a force). Too many Gravitists haven taken this lightly. Now our children are being threatened with ignorance as one state after another considers bill requiring that Scientific Downism be taught in the schools. This charade must stop. Stand up to Downism! ---
**Author:** ![pantom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/34f0e0/32.png) [@pantom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pantom)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2000, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gravitists-vs-downists/35758/31 "2000-10-06T02:15:15Z")
**barker** , can you post your solution to that formula for me please? I’m laughing so hard my eyes are tearing over here, and every time I try on the back of an envelope it just smears up because of all the water… ---
**Author:** ![pantom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/34f0e0/32.png) [@pantom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pantom)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2000, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gravitists-vs-downists/35758/32 "2000-10-06T02:20:19Z")
**CKDextHavn** : > [@](#): > > \<\< Why do they call it the “law” of gravity, like it’s been proven? You can’t see gravity, can you? Huh? Huh? Can you? \>\> > > Well, the Indiana state legislature (along with its law that pi = 3) also passed a bill enforcing gravity, hence the … um … law of gravity. However, it’s only operative in Indiana. Didn’t you mean Kansas? Or did I miss something? ---
**Author:** ![JDeMobray](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/85e7bf/32.png) [@JDeMobray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JDeMobray)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2000, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gravitists-vs-downists/35758/33 "2000-10-06T02:33:19Z")
While I have no problem believing that “gravity” holds things down, I think you must all acknowledge that the only reason it does so is because H-nk (Posessor of the Mighty Ass) created a set of rules to hold things in the proper Down direction. And for those of you who believe that “gravity” could exist without H-nk, let me simply ask you this: Does science have a theory of black holes? ---
**Author:** ![Wrath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ee7513/32.png) [@Wrath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wrath)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2000, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gravitists-vs-downists/35758/34 "2000-10-06T02:38:30Z")
As an Uppist, I take offense to this whole thread. My physionomy recapitulates the notion of reverse ion polarity. In essence, I am attracted to the dark matter of the universe (or it to me, I haven’t been able to figure it out). The worst part is the damn gravity boots that I have to wear - even to bed. Oh - and I apologize in advance for the meteors that are headed this way. ---
**Author:** ![SPOOFE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c5a1d2/32.png) [@SPOOFE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SPOOFE)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2000, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gravitists-vs-downists/35758/35 "2000-10-06T03:02:26Z")
You’re all wrong. Wrong wrong wrong. Stuff falls down 'cuz Simon said so. Sheesh! I used to think you guys were smart!! ---
**Author:** ![barker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/919ad9/32.png) [@barker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/barker)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2000, 3:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gravitists-vs-downists/35758/36 "2000-10-06T03:06:07Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by pantom \* > \*\*can you post your solution to that formula for me please? I’m laughing so hard my eyes are tearing over here, and every time I try on the back of an envelope it just smears up because of all the water… \*\* We can’t make it that easy. Just think number of the Beast ---
**Author:** ![barker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/919ad9/32.png) [@barker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/barker)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2000, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gravitists-vs-downists/35758/37 "2000-10-06T03:27:21Z")
**tomndeb** said > [@](#): > > If Gravity is only a theory. How do Downists explain airplanes and birds flying? No explanation is possible, it is beyond the comprehension of mankind. When I was in Downer school, one of the lead Downist told us that on “Flight Sunday” almost all Downist will commit a heresy by even trying to explain this mystery.😃 And then > [@](#): > > Now our children are being threatened with ignorance as one state after another considers bill requiring that Scientific Downism be taught in the schools. This charade must stop. Stand up to Downism! Well, I think we should take this to the Pit. And I would except that Lynn doesn’t want anyone to play games and have fun over there.:rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![MEBuckner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mebuckner/32/2896_2.png) [@MEBuckner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MEBuckner)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2000, 3:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gravitists-vs-downists/35758/38 "2000-10-06T03:40:11Z")
And how does this so-called “Scientific Downism” explain protein homology? Huh? Huh? You can’t answer, can you? ---
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2000, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gravitists-vs-downists/35758/39 "2000-10-06T03:42:08Z")
See, what really happened is that orgainsms that floated in the air had a hard time mating - they’d carom wildly off nearby mountains. Therefore, over time, organisms that happened to be able to stick to the ground better had an advantage, passed on the gravity genes, and now we’re all stuck down here. Birds are genetic throwbacks. (See **WoodThrush** , for example. 😃 – Just kidding, Woody!) There. That should twist things up some. [sub]I knew you were on our side in that thread in your forum, Dex![/sub] ---
**Author:** ![barker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/919ad9/32.png) [@barker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/barker)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2000, 3:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gravitists-vs-downists/35758/40 "2000-10-06T03:54:39Z")
**smeghead** I am confused by your post. Is this an arguement for a theistic Downism or is this a Naturalistic approach? And **tomndebb** sorry I left a **b** of the end of your name in a previous post. I had to use it elsewhere. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gravitists-vs-downists/35758.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gravitists-vs-downists/35758.md?page=3)