So, why didn’t Stan Musial’s stats plummet after 1947? Why didn’t Ted Williams’?
Why didn’t Warren Spahn’s ERA soar?
Because the league didn’t become fully integrated right after Jackie Robinson started playing. It took 12 more years before the last team (Boston) brought up a black player. Many teams only had one or two black players.
It’s probably worth noting that Ty Cobb himself thought he’d only hit .300 against modern (then 1960) pitchers.
Because he was 73 years old by then, of course.
Strange how they kept pitching to him down the stretch if they were trying to deny him the record, huh?
Greenberg was walked 119 times in 1938, normal for a frightening power hitter with good plate discipline. But his walk rate did not go up later in the season. In his last 5 games, after he’d gotten to 58, he was walked four times, a reasonably normal number. After Game 140, when he hit his 53rd homer and would have seemed like a longshot threat to get there (8 homers in 15 games would be amazing even for him, though; there was never a point late in the season when Greenberg was on pace to break the record) he drew 11 walks in 15 games, again a normal rate for him and consistent with his season rate.
The fact that Cobb isn’t better known in the baseball movie pantheon is a travesty.
I said this myself, and Lamar says it too, but MLB did not become fully integrated overnight. It was a gradual process that took as long as those men were productive hitters.
Integration cost Stan Musial at least one pennant, but the effect on his numbers wouldn’t have been noticeable. How many black pitchers do you think he faced in 1947? 1948?
A recent biography also mentions him being
Someone mentioned Sammy Baugh earlier. People forget that his record for longest average punt distance for a season of 51.4 yards in 1940 is still the record. His career average is still second all time. I don’t think he could be a modern QB or DB, but he sure could punt the ball!
If she wasn’t AT LEAST bi-sexual, I’d be stunned. She was quite a masculine-looking woman. He’ll, she was quite a masculine-looking man. Quite honestly, just by the virtue of being married to her, George should also be considered a bi-sexual.
I doubt this had anything to do with it. I know many Jews hold this belief, but it doesn’t stand up to scrutiny. When Jimmy Foxx hit 58, what was his excuse? I don’t recall reading that he was Jewish. When Maris hit 61, he was under so much stress that his hair was falling out in clumps. No… The simple reason is that before the ‘road era, it was damn hard to hit 60 home runs in a season. Period. If Greenberg wasn’t getting pitches to hit, I doubt seriously if it was a case of anti-semitism. If you believe that, I think any anti-Semitic pitcher would have hit the man in the ear with a pitch and putting him down for a month or two. Breaking that record more than any other was psychological. Hammering’ Hank and the Jewish population may make themselves feel better with this story, but the truth is, only one person hit over 60 since Ruth, and that was Maris’ 61 in the eight game longer season. It’s hard. The proof is all over the record books.
An all-star? I don’t know. Howe was good, but remember, he played in the slower. plodding NHL, and he wasn’t very big. With the influx of the global hockey world’s talent into today’s NHL, I wonder if he would even be an all-star.
I’m sure you meant to qualify that a little better.
Of course these old-style athletes would have the benefit of modern steroids, right?
He was being walked more often as well, though not as often as Greenberg.
Greenberg was getting hit, see post 48. Deliberately throwing at his ear would have been grounds for, at the very least, retaliation by his supportive teammates.
I had not heard that, just that he was gay.
If it’s true, they’re not the same thing.
There’s a large amount of truth, but their are other factors I think you’re ignoring.
Yes, the presence of African-American baseball players, such as Bullet Joe Rogan and Satchel Paige certainly would have effected his stats negatively, but I think expansion would have more than offset that.
In Babe Ruth’s time, there were just seven teams in the American League whereas now there are IIRC, fifteen.
Now imagine if there’d been 15 AL teams in 1927. That would mean that roughly half the players, and more importantly regarding our discussion, half the pitchers, would have been in the minors were it not for the expansion teams.
Lots of people have attributed the home run explosion of 1961 to the presence of just TWO additional teams. Imagine what having EIGHT additional teams would have done.
Of course. I meant the only person since Ruth to hit over 60 hr in a season in the non-steroid era. Actually, he (Maris) is STILL the only one to hit more than 60 HR in a season outside of the steroid era, even in the post steroid era, where I’m still sure people are trying to beat the system with HGH and other synthetic drugs.
One of the best power hitters of our time has been A-Rod. And even shooting and popping, he never did it once.
Again, this proves nothing. There may have been a few guys making Greenberg hit their best pitch. Maybe they would have rather walked him than let him hit. you might remember during Bonds 73 HR season, people walked him all the time rather than let him hit a HR to beat him. If pitchers actually threw to Bonds, he might have hit 90 that year.
All I’m saying is if you go back to each game, take a look at each at bat and see what the situation was. If a walk was better than a home run, there you go. If you want a Jewish conspiracy, like I said, throw one in his ear. Nobody on the Tigers would have helped him, right? After all, he was Jewish. If I am to believe you, his Tiger teammates would have rushed the field just to jump on Greenberg while he was down, to get their spikes into him, not stick up for him.
You want to see some ugly racism, look read about what Aaron went through on his quest for Ruth’s all-time mark.
6 ft 1
205 lb ?
That’s plenty big enough.
Wow. I met him… Granted, it was late in his career, but I have a picture with him and I’m taller than he is by more than an inch and heavier than him, too. So, either his personal stats are padded a bit (which was and still is a popular thing to do), or I would have been a big badass on skates.
I have about 4 inches on him in the picture.. And I’m 6’2" in the pic (and in real life) Maybe he shrunk. Or maybe he was slouching. I don’t recall any of that, though.
I met him during a charity hockey game. The one thing I remember about him was his hands. He had enormous hands. Hands that could smash a walnut with one squeeze or rip a phone book in two. Massive, muscular hands.
Agree completely. It’s a great film.
Cool story. Thanks!
People do shrink with age. The stats are from his Wikipedia page.