# Greatest Comic Genius of the Twentieth Century **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [May 31, 2006, 12:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-comic-genius-of-the-twentieth-century/358863 "2006-05-31T12:43:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2006, 12:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-comic-genius-of-the-twentieth-century/358863/1 "2006-05-31T12:43:48Z")
So the jacket praise of _Groucho - the Life and Times of Julius Henry Marx_ calls Groucho “perhaps the greatest comic genius of the twentieth century.” Now, I like Groucho as much as the next guy (and I like the next guy just fine, even if he talks trash about Groucho), but greatest comic genius of the twentieth century? No way. So who is, in your estimation, and why? I have two contenders - **Charlie Chaplin** , who made it look easy, communicated perfectly without sound, and could make anything funny without forsaking the larger story he was telling, and **Charles Schulz** , who could make truly depressing subjects so beguilingly gentle that you felt no guilt laughing at kids who were just out-and-out mean to each other. He made the subversive aspects of _Peanuts_ so casual that most people weren’t even aware of them. Now who are your nominees? ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2006, 12:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-comic-genius-of-the-twentieth-century/358863/2 "2006-05-31T12:55:58Z")
Much as I love Groucho, I would have to go with Chaplin. As Mack Sennett said, “Oh, well, he’s just the greatest artist who ever lived.” Buster Keaton would be up there, as would Woody Allen. For comics, it’s George Herriman and Walt Kelly. ---
**Author:** ![BMalion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e274bd/32.png) [@BMalion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BMalion)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2006, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-comic-genius-of-the-twentieth-century/358863/3 "2006-05-31T12:59:47Z")
Somewhere on the list must be Jack Benny. and: Bob Hope Fred Allen P. G. Wodehouse My friend Mike cracks me up all the time, can I mention him? ---
**Author:** ![Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bosda_di_chi_of_tricor/32/16845_2.png) [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2006, 1:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-comic-genius-of-the-twentieth-century/358863/4 "2006-05-31T13:08:13Z")
Lenny Bruce changed American comedy forever. And was persecuted for it. However, he remains a genius. Bill Cosby should be considered, too. ---
**Author:** ![Eve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Eve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eve)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2006, 1:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-comic-genius-of-the-twentieth-century/358863/5 "2006-05-31T13:09:55Z")
Chaplin? Feh. His early films were "hit a cop with a brick"and his later films were “sad clown with tear running down cheek.” I’ve never understood why he’s so revered. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2006, 1:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-comic-genius-of-the-twentieth-century/358863/6 "2006-05-31T13:28:38Z")
> [@bup](#): > > **Charles Schulz** , who could make truly depressing subjects so beguilingly gentle that you felt no guilt laughing at kids who were just out-and-out mean to each other. I’m gonna say the Greatest Comic Genius of the Twentieth Century has to be funny, so… Peanuts?? Nah. I’d be happy to go with Groucho, but of course, the strike against him would be that he didn’t write most of his most famous lines. ---
**Author:** ![Rube\_E.Tewesday](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f0a364/32.png) [@Rube\_E.Tewesday](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rube_E.Tewesday)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2006, 1:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-comic-genius-of-the-twentieth-century/358863/7 "2006-05-31T13:35:04Z")
Chuck Jones is worth considering. Duck Season! Rabbit Season! ---
**Author:** ![JThunder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e95f7d/32.png) [@JThunder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JThunder)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2006, 1:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-comic-genius-of-the-twentieth-century/358863/8 "2006-05-31T13:40:45Z")
I was going to nominate Reed Richards, but I see that that’s not what you’re talking about. ---
**Author:** ![Kythereia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e8c25b/32.png) [@Kythereia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kythereia)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2006, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-comic-genius-of-the-twentieth-century/358863/9 "2006-05-31T13:42:31Z")
Well, there’s Alan Moore, who arguably… …oh. In that case, I’ll also nominate P.G. Wodehouse. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2006, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-comic-genius-of-the-twentieth-century/358863/10 "2006-05-31T13:47:29Z")
I am not big on Chaplin, I like Groucho better. I would lean toward someone like George Carlin who has remained funny for such a long period of his career. I lean towards Mel Brooks for writer however. The man wrote for Sid Caesar on three shows “Sid Caesar Invites You” (1958/II) TV Series “Caesar’s Hour” (1954) TV Series (writer) “Your Show of Shows” (1950) TV Series … aka Sid Caesar’s Show of Shows (UK: rerun title) Created Get Smart, his first movie was The Producers (1968) and then he went on to make Young Frankenstein (1974), Blazing Saddles (1974), High Anxiety (1977), Silent Movie (1976), Spaceballs (1987), History of the World: Part I (1981) and then conquered Broadway with The Producers. He also had a hit comedy album with the 2000 Year old man with Carl Reiner. He had bombs and so-so movies but his highs are pretty amazing. As a side note: He won a Writing Oscar is 69 for “The Producers” He won 3 Emmy Awards for acting and 1 daytime Emmy for the children’s show Jakers. He won a Grammy in 2002 The Producers won a record setting 12 Tony Awards including Musical Book: Mel Brooks and Thomas Meehan, The Producers Original Score: Mel Brooks, The Producers Mel is one of a very small number of performers/writers to win in all four major Awards. Jim ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2006, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-comic-genius-of-the-twentieth-century/358863/11 "2006-05-31T13:56:41Z")
I posted this in the [Woody Allen Appreciation Thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=296650), so I’ll stick to my opinion. > [@](#): > > Who else has had the career that Woody has? > > He started selling jokes professionally while still in high school. He soon graduated to writing for television. (No, no matter how many times you read it, despite all the quotes you can dig up, no, he never wrote for Sid Caesar on “Your Show of Shows.” Never. He wrote for the Caesar’s Hour specials several years later.) While still in his twenties he was making $1700 a week. > > He gave that up to start honing a stand-up act. After two years of prep, he struck it big with his first comedy album in 1964. The three albums he put out rank among the very best stand-up comedy ever done, and are hilarious in a way that nobody has ever matched: a combination of sheer audacious fantasy and carefully honed self-deprecating humor to create a personality as instantly identifiable as Groucho’s. > > The stand-up made him a star and he branched out in every direction. He appeared all over television. Playboy used him regularly in comic pictorials. He was asked to write for big-budget motion pictures comedies. > > Then he started writing comic pieces for The New Yorker. From his very first one, he was hailed as the successor to Robert Benchley and S. J. Perelman. And rightly. His three collections of comic pieces rival any three other collections I could name. (And I’m a collector of American humor collections.) > > Then he conquered Broadway. Don’t Drink the Water was a minor success, but Play It Again, Sam, which he starred in, was a classic. > > What’s left but Hollywood? His early comedies were unlike anything being done in the late 60s- early 70s, and again rank among the best comedies ever. > > Then he started a more mature style with Annie Hall. All it did was win him the Oscar for Best Director, and added Best Picture, Best Screenplay and Best Actress wins and a Best Actor[!] nomination for himself. This was before all those other actor-directors like Redford, Costner, and Eastwood got into the game. > > Whatever you might think of his more recent pictures - I admit they are not nearly as good as his earlier work - he remains one of the only (who else? Altman, maybe) American directors to be able to work outside of the system and make any picture that he wants without a thought as to box office. Actors clamor to work for him, several have won Oscars for their work in his pictures, and he’s been personally nominated (for Best Director and Best Screenplay) about as often as anyone in history. > > That’s an unparalleled career. I can think of no other artist who rose to the top in so many facets of show business and remained excellent for so long. (Bob Hope, whom Woody always mentions as a major influence, is a contender, but he relied on legions of writers for material that Woody writes for himself.) > > I haven’t done more than glance at some of those threads that ask who will be remembered 50 years from now, but my guess is that Woody Allen’s name is rarely if ever mentioned. And my guess is that he will be remembered as one of the pre-eminent figures of the second half of the 20th century. ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2006, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-comic-genius-of-the-twentieth-century/358863/12 "2006-05-31T14:03:03Z")
> [@Eve](#): > > Chaplin? Feh. His early films were "hit a cop with a brick"and his later films were “sad clown with tear running down cheek.” I’ve never understood why he’s so revered. First of all, “hit a cop with a brick” is _funny_. Especially if it’s the face. And Chaplin could make hitting a cop with a brick funnier than anyone else - he made it _sing_. Second of all, I hardly think _Modern Times_, _The Great Dictator_, or _The Circus_ is the sad clown. I can see your point with _The Gold Rush_ and _City Lights_, even if I disagree (he gets the chick and the cash in the end). Keaton’s films were “look at the nebbish.” Arubuckle’s were “look at the fat guy.” ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2006, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-comic-genius-of-the-twentieth-century/358863/13 "2006-05-31T14:05:28Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > I’m gonna say the Greatest Comic Genius of the Twentieth Century has to be funny, so… Peanuts?? Nah. I’d be happy to go with Groucho, but of course, the strike against him would be that he didn’t write most of his most famous lines. I can only assume you’re confusing the comic strip with the TV specials, movies, Hallmark cards, insurance commercials, Dolly Madison commercials and everything else Schulz dropped his pants for. Try reading the actual strip. It’s funny! ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2006, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-comic-genius-of-the-twentieth-century/358863/14 "2006-05-31T14:09:13Z")
> [@Exapno Mapcase](#): > > I posted this in the [Woody Allen Appreciation Thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=296650), so I’ll stick to my opinion. Great argument for Woody but as to “That’s an unparalleled career. I can think of no other artist who rose to the top in so many facets of show business and remained excellent for so long.” The guy I mentioned in the post above yours is just as diverse in talents. Replacing award winning music for writing for the New Yorker and beloved TV actor, writer, creator and voice actor to add an extra medium. Jim ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2006, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-comic-genius-of-the-twentieth-century/358863/15 "2006-05-31T14:12:35Z")
Chaplin - Meh. Keaton - Maybe Groucho - Stronger maybe. Jones - Yes. Brooks - Yes. I think we have to limit this by medium if we are going to argue our choices effectively. Oh, and Schulz- No. ---
**Author:** ![stpauler](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9d8465/32.png) [@stpauler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/stpauler)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2006, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-comic-genius-of-the-twentieth-century/358863/16 "2006-05-31T14:15:01Z")
[Steve Allen.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steve_Allen_%28comedian%29) A bit of a pioneer, an intellectual, and damn funny. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2006, 2:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-comic-genius-of-the-twentieth-century/358863/17 "2006-05-31T14:17:31Z")
> [@](#): > > Chuck Jones is worth considering. > > Duck Season! Rabbit Season! I love Chuck Jones, too. I think he’s made the greatest cartoons of the 20th century. but if the _writing_ in his cartoons that really gets you (“pronoun trouble!”), I have to mention that the guy who came up with all those great gags was the grossly underappreciated **Michael Maltese**. ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2006, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-comic-genius-of-the-twentieth-century/358863/18 "2006-05-31T14:29:00Z")
W. C. Fields Ernie Kovacs Burns and Allen ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2006, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-comic-genius-of-the-twentieth-century/358863/19 "2006-05-31T14:36:04Z")
> [@bup](#): > > Keaton’s films were “look at the nebbish.” Arubuckle’s were “look at the fat guy.” Absolutely not. Keaton’s characters are not nebbishes. > [@](#): > > By definition, nebbishes are whiners, lacking self-confidence, generally inept, and on the losing end of social transactions–all characteristics that work against their ever achieving fame. The only famous nebbishes are fictional characters: George Costanza, Isaac Bashevis Singer’s Gimple the Fool, George McFly in Back to the Future, and virtually anyone played by Woody Allen or Rick Moranis…Nebbishes are necessarily schlumpy, never handsome or physically robust. from [here](http://www.slate.com/id/1873/). Keaton’s characters are never whiners, nor do they lack self-confidence. Indeed, his characters can only be described as having indominatable will. They inevitably overcome everything a hostile and chaotic world throws at them. Further, Keaton was a superb athlete and his fims showcase that. Schlumpy? Not robust? I don’t think so. ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2006, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-comic-genius-of-the-twentieth-century/358863/20 "2006-05-31T14:39:37Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > Chaplin - Meh. > > Keaton - Maybe > > Groucho - Stronger maybe. > > Jones - Yes. > > Brooks - Yes. > > I think we have to limit this by medium if we are going to argue our choices effectively. > > Oh, and Schulz- No. Way to support your contentions! [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-comic-genius-of-the-twentieth-century/358863.md?page=2)