# Greatest Military Leader elimination game (game thread) **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [August 12, 2010, 2:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-military-leader-elimination-game-game-thread/550010 "2010-08-12T02:50:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 24
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2010, 12:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-military-leader-elimination-game-game-thread/550010/461 "2010-10-22T00:19:38Z")
> [@Quartz](#): > > He was a flash-in-the-pan compared with Caesar, Zhukov, and Genghis. That seems extreme. If a historian had been writing about Alexander’s impact on the “modern world” 200 years after his death, he would have ranked it as _immense_. The Hellenistic Age flowed primarily from Alexander and though it proved somewhat ephemeral in the long run, it was a very long-lasting ephemera, including real reverberations on the Roman polity which eventually supplanted it in the west. That beside the fact that Alexander is the very archetype of the world-conqueror, then and now. Also, for a drunken, paranoid, violent, narcissitic asshole, he was one hell of a general :D. Zhukov simply does not have that historical stature or impact. Not by a mile - Alexander radically re-shaped the international scene for centuries. Zhukov ( understandably, given the very different eras they lived in ) almost certainly will not be able to claim the same. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2010, 7:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-military-leader-elimination-game-game-thread/550010/462 "2010-10-22T07:48:20Z")
> [@Tamerlane](#): > > That beside the fact that Alexander is the very archetype of the world-conqueror, then and now. Also, for a drunken, paranoid, violent, narcissitic asshole, he was one hell of a general :D. Yes, but the topic is the greatest military leader, not the greatest general. It’s a subtle difference. Don’t get me wrong: he’s right up there, but he’s beaten by better people. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2010, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-military-leader-elimination-game-game-thread/550010/463 "2010-10-22T16:29:37Z")
The votes in our 28th round: **Hannibal - 12** Georgy Zhukov - 10 Alexander the Great - 5 Julius Caesar - 2 (again) The boldfaced leader above is now gone, leaving: Alexander the Great: Conquered the known world Genghis Khan: Built the perfect war machine Julius Caesar: Rome’s most brilliant commander Georgy Zhukov: Led from Moscow to Berlin Eliminated so far: George B. McClellan Charles the Bold Hernan Cortez Douglas MacArthur Pompey Magnus Carl von Clausewitz Robert E. Lee Josip Broz Tito Zachary Taylor John S. McCain Sr. Titokowaru Albert Kesselring Curtis Le May Sun Tzu Gabriel Dumont Charles Upham Richard H. O’Kane Charles de Gaulle Paul von Hindenburg Marc Mitscher Flavius Aetius Mehmet the Conqueror Pyrrhus Orde Wingate Paul Emil von Lettow-Vorbeck Sebastien Le Prestre de Vauban Tsao Tsao (also Cao Cao) Hugh Dowding Yamamoto Isoroku Sir Isaac Brock Moshe Dayan Michiel Adriaenszoon de Ruyter Phil Sheridan Dwight D. Eisenhower Kong Ming/Zhuge Liang Henry V John Paul Jones Vo Nguyen Giap Attila the Hun Togo Heihachiro Bernard Montgomery Erich von Manstein George S. Patton Philip II of Macedon Gaius Marius Akbar the Great Arthur Currie Yi-Sun Shin George Washington Oda Nobunaga Erwin Rommel Belisarius U.S. Grant Timur-e-Lang Stonewall Jackson Frederick the Great Napoleon Bonaparte Themistocles Gustavus Adolphus William T. Sherman Lord Nelson Subutai Scipio Africanus Duke of Marlborough Khalid ibn al-Walid Duke of Wellington Hannibal Same rules as the previous round. The next round will conclude at noon EST on Mon. Oct. 25. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2010, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-military-leader-elimination-game-game-thread/550010/464 "2010-10-22T16:32:51Z")
Continuing to make up for lack of content by getting my vote in early: Georgy Zhukov - 2 Julius Caesar - 1 ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2010, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-military-leader-elimination-game-game-thread/550010/465 "2010-10-22T16:36:06Z")
Georgy Zhukov -2 Ceasar - 1 ---
**Author:** ![MOIDALIZE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e274bd/32.png) [@MOIDALIZE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MOIDALIZE)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2010, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-military-leader-elimination-game-game-thread/550010/466 "2010-10-22T16:36:26Z")
**Caesar** - 2 **Zhukov** - 1 ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2010, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-military-leader-elimination-game-game-thread/550010/467 "2010-10-22T18:16:15Z")
Alexander - 2 Zhukov - 1 ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Excellent](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f19dbf/32.png) [@Mr.Excellent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Excellent)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2010, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-military-leader-elimination-game-game-thread/550010/468 "2010-10-22T18:39:52Z")
**Alexander** - 2. At this point in the game, the fact he couldn’t build anything that lasted beyond his death matters. **Zhukov** - 1. I really hate to do this - the man killed Nazis, after all, and I don’t think there are a lot of finer accomplishments than that. (Yes, I know not all Wehrmacht were Nazis - but SS were, and Zhukov put a lot of them out of our misery as well.) But he wasn’t a head of state, he didn’t set top-level policy, and he didn’t play as fundamental role in his military as Caesar or Khan did. Time for him to go, with all the honors and respect due the man who burned the Nazi dream to ash. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2010, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-military-leader-elimination-game-game-thread/550010/469 "2010-10-22T19:06:08Z")
Tough call, but I’m persuaded. Alexander the Great - 2 Georgy Zhukov - 1 ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Excellent](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f19dbf/32.png) [@Mr.Excellent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Excellent)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2010, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-military-leader-elimination-game-game-thread/550010/470 "2010-10-22T19:28:31Z")
/hums The Internationale sadly. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2010, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-military-leader-elimination-game-game-thread/550010/471 "2010-10-22T19:37:34Z")
**Georgy Zhukov** - 2. Not fit to carry Alexander’s jock. I mean we’re talking Alexander the _Great_ here. He’s got Frosted Flakes-level cred! By comparison Zhukov is generic, unfrosted mini-wheats :D. **Alexander the Great** - 1. That said, I’m going to give JC a slight nod over Alex :). If for no other reason, Julius seems to have been far less prone to murdering his own officers in fits of drunken rage. ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2010, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-military-leader-elimination-game-game-thread/550010/472 "2010-10-22T20:13:19Z")
> [@Tamerlane](#): > > If for no other reason, Julius seems to have been far less prone to murdering his own officers in fits of drunken rage. You say that as if it were a _bad_ thing. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Sternvogel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bc79bd/32.png) [@Sternvogel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sternvogel)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2010, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-military-leader-elimination-game-game-thread/550010/473 "2010-10-22T20:47:37Z")
After knocking off so many higher seeds to reach the Final Four, his run finally ends: Georgy Zhukov – 2 If only because I have “experience” killing him, having played the role of Cassius in a truncated version of Shakespeare’s account of the great leader’s life: Julius Caesar – 1 ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Excellent](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f19dbf/32.png) [@Mr.Excellent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Excellent)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2010, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-military-leader-elimination-game-game-thread/550010/474 "2010-10-24T18:06:08Z")
> [@Sternvogel](#): > > After knocking off so many higher seeds to reach the Final Four, his run finally ends: > > Georgy Zhukov – 2 > > If only because I have “experience” killing him, having played the role of Cassius in a truncated version of Shakespeare’s account of the great leader’s life: > > Julius Caesar – 1 Et tu, **Sternvogel**? Why, this is violence! ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2010, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-military-leader-elimination-game-game-thread/550010/475 "2010-10-25T17:30:58Z")
The votes in our 29th round: **Georgy Zhukov - 12** Alexander the Great - 7 Julius Caesar - 5 The boldfaced leader above is now gone, leaving: Alexander the Great: Conquered the known world Genghis Khan: Built the perfect war machine Julius Caesar: Rome’s most brilliant commander Eliminated so far: George B. McClellan Charles the Bold Hernan Cortez Douglas MacArthur Pompey Magnus Carl von Clausewitz Robert E. Lee Josip Broz Tito Zachary Taylor John S. McCain Sr. Titokowaru Albert Kesselring Curtis Le May Sun Tzu Gabriel Dumont Charles Upham Richard H. O’Kane Charles de Gaulle Paul von Hindenburg Marc Mitscher Flavius Aetius Mehmet the Conqueror Pyrrhus Orde Wingate Paul Emil von Lettow-Vorbeck Sebastien Le Prestre de Vauban Tsao Tsao (also Cao Cao) Hugh Dowding Yamamoto Isoroku Sir Isaac Brock Moshe Dayan Michiel Adriaenszoon de Ruyter Phil Sheridan Dwight D. Eisenhower Kong Ming/Zhuge Liang Henry V John Paul Jones Vo Nguyen Giap Attila the Hun Togo Heihachiro Bernard Montgomery Erich von Manstein George S. Patton Philip II of Macedon Gaius Marius Akbar the Great Arthur Currie Yi-Sun Shin George Washington Oda Nobunaga Erwin Rommel Belisarius U.S. Grant Timur-e-Lang Stonewall Jackson Frederick the Great Napoleon Bonaparte Themistocles Gustavus Adolphus William T. Sherman Lord Nelson Subutai Scipio Africanus Duke of Marlborough Khalid ibn al-Walid Duke of Wellington Hannibal Georgy Zhukov New Rule: We’re now at the Final Three, so, as earlier announced, everyone gets one vote in each round. The next round will conclude at noon EST on Weds. Oct. 27. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2010, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-military-leader-elimination-game-game-thread/550010/476 "2010-10-25T17:33:18Z")
Julius Caesar ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Excellent](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f19dbf/32.png) [@Mr.Excellent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Excellent)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2010, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-military-leader-elimination-game-game-thread/550010/477 "2010-10-25T17:41:19Z")
**Alexander the Great**. Just for grins, do people want to start posting who they’d like to see win? Of the three remaining, I think I’d have to prefer that **Genghis Khan** prevail. He has the strongest claim to having _built_ his military from the ground-up, and also for making the longest-lasting impact. The Roman Republic after Caesar fell into civil war, and it took Augustus to stabilize it. Khan’s structure _lasted_. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2010, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-military-leader-elimination-game-game-thread/550010/478 "2010-10-25T17:45:43Z")
Pretty much from the start I’ve thought the great Khan was the clear #1; nothing since then has changed my mind. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2010, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-military-leader-elimination-game-game-thread/550010/479 "2010-10-25T17:49:57Z")
I don’t like stinky barbarians. Genghis Khan. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Excellent](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f19dbf/32.png) [@Mr.Excellent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Excellent)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2010, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-military-leader-elimination-game-game-thread/550010/480 "2010-10-25T17:53:32Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > I don’t like stinky barbarians. > > Genghis Khan. I doubt that the sandal-vandals smelled too good. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-military-leader-elimination-game-game-thread/550010.md?page=23) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/greatest-military-leader-elimination-game-game-thread/550010.md?page=25)