# Guitar Players: I need a little help **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** music\ **Created:** [May 30, 2025, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/guitar-players-i-need-a-little-help/1019015 "2025-05-30T19:16:16Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Jackknifed\_Juggernaut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de053/32.png) [@Jackknifed\_Juggernaut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackknifed_Juggernaut)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2025, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/guitar-players-i-need-a-little-help/1019015/1 "2025-05-30T19:16:16Z")
I’m trying to play [this](https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-1-d&sca_esv=bf7d34be7343ee42&channel=entpr&q=sand+in+my+boots+guitar+lesson&udm=7&fbs=AIIjpHxU7SXXniUZfeShr2fp4giZud1z6kQpMfoEdCJxnpm_3YlUqOpj4OTU_HmqxOd8LCYAmZcz3xp4-s3ijYzIP40LlddfBAhJDuHsBzPcairVH6jEyLRYOBQgKx39vFebUA6gMRyOjUtKr2tAgLt8-riYCxo7cqYvgVIxY_03doEIFjWWiF6brNIzAObqF7XNPBoa6nWqDYwiLKQb2ooNcABsdF3WMg&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwi4kNL-8suNAxVMLVkFHWCbKKoQtKgLegQIGBAB&biw=1920&bih=891&dpr=1#fpstate=ive&vld=cid:b3c155a0,vid:Q9DDzpXXVd0,st:0) song. At the 1:49 mark, he plays a normal D chort, but then raises his pinky to the 2nd string of the 4th fret. I can’t make that stretch quite yet, so wondering if there’s a good easier alternative. ---
**Author:** ![Eonwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eonwe/32/240_2.png) [@Eonwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eonwe)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2025, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/guitar-players-i-need-a-little-help/1019015/2 "2025-05-30T19:27:29Z")
I don’t have a guitar in-hand, but yes, that’s kind of a tough stretch. One thing to try might be to allow your middle finger to come off the fretboard, which could let you rotate your wrist under a bit more and not need to have that wide stretch between the pinky and middle finger. Your strumming for that moment would have to not play the high E string. ---
**Author:** ![Jackknifed\_Juggernaut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de053/32.png) [@Jackknifed\_Juggernaut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackknifed_Juggernaut)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2025, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/guitar-players-i-need-a-little-help/1019015/3 "2025-05-30T19:32:07Z")
Thanks! Will give it a try, although I’m also not adept that being able to stop the down stroke before the high E. Maybe even lifting the middle finger a bit allowing it to mute the high E will work. Will give it a shot later ---
**Author:** ![Pork\_Rind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pork_rind/32/111_2.png) [@Pork\_Rind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pork_Rind)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2025, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/guitar-players-i-need-a-little-help/1019015/4 "2025-05-30T19:37:36Z")
I have a guitar right next to me here, so I gave it a go. Note that I can’t find my capo so trying it without so the stretch is just a tiny bit further. Result - I found it pretty easy but see that I find it more natural to change my left hand position from the “thumb on back of neck” fingering to “thumb coming over the top to mute the low E” method. Dunno why, but it feels easier and more natural that way. ---
**Author:** ![Jaycat.again](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jaycat.again/32/11525_2.png) [@Jaycat.again](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jaycat.again)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2025, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/guitar-players-i-need-a-little-help/1019015/5 "2025-05-30T20:25:31Z")
Looks like a D chord with a C# in the bass, which kinda makes it a D major 7th. There are various ways to play that. A simple way is just to fret the G, B and E strings at the 2nd fret. ---
**Author:** ![74westy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/74westy/32/3950_2.png) [@74westy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/74westy)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2025, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/guitar-players-i-need-a-little-help/1019015/6 "2025-05-30T20:55:23Z")
Putting the C# in the bass is key to how the chord sounds. It’s adding a bassline to the chords. Having a D in the bass and the C# higher isn’t the same. ---
**Author:** ![xtenkfarpl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/c2a13f/32.png) [@xtenkfarpl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xtenkfarpl)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2025, 11:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/guitar-players-i-need-a-little-help/1019015/7 "2025-05-31T11:15:19Z")
> [@74westy](#): > > Putting the C# in the bass is key to how the chord sounds. It’s adding a bassline to the chords. Right, it’s a classic bassline run down from the tonic to the relative minor. An alternative approach might be to capo on 3 and play the song using a C shape. That converts it into a easier run down on the 5th string from C shape to A minor shape (and also avoids the barre B minor shape). Does change the inversions of the IV and V chords a bit, though. ---
**Author:** ![Jackknifed\_Juggernaut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de053/32.png) [@Jackknifed\_Juggernaut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackknifed_Juggernaut)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2025, 12:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/guitar-players-i-need-a-little-help/1019015/8 "2025-05-31T12:07:04Z")
> [@xtenkfarpl](#): > > An alternative approach might be to capo on 3 There are other lessons for this song that are played with the capo on the 3rd fret as opposed to 1st. ---
**Author:** ![xtenkfarpl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/c2a13f/32.png) [@xtenkfarpl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xtenkfarpl)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2025, 12:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/guitar-players-i-need-a-little-help/1019015/9 "2025-05-31T12:20:15Z")
> [@Jackknifed\_Juggernaut](#): > > There are other lessons for this song that are played with the capo on the 3rd fret as opposed to 1st. May well be, I just came up with the idea off the cuff. Thought it might work out a bit easier… ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2025, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/guitar-players-i-need-a-little-help/1019015/10 "2025-06-02T01:09:04Z")
> [@xtenkfarpl](#): > > Right, it’s a classic bassline run down from the tonic to the relative minor. So it’s not a crucial part of the chord (you’re just adding a C# bass note to a plain-vanilla D chord). As a beginner, you could skip that and no one would notice. If you want, add it back in when you get better\*. \*And you will get better! You’ll get smoother, and your hands will get stretchier. Adding in little bass runs like that will become easy enough that it’ll sound natural (it would NOT sound ‘organic’ if I, who’s been a beginner for forty years, did that… better for me to wait as well). . eta: I’ve always wondered: what’s the point of a capo on the first fret? You’re only raising the notes a half-step (doubt it would make a difference to someone’s singing range). ---
**Author:** ![xtenkfarpl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/c2a13f/32.png) [@xtenkfarpl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xtenkfarpl)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2025, 12:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/guitar-players-i-need-a-little-help/1019015/11 "2025-06-02T12:36:31Z")
> [@digs](#): > > So it’s not a crucial part of the chord (you’re just adding a C# bass note to a plain-vanilla D chord). It _is_ a fairly important component of the flow of the song, though… > [@digs](#): > > eta: I’ve always wondered: what’s the point of a capo on the first fret? You’re only raising the notes a half-step (doubt it would make a difference to someone’s singing range). You might be surprised. If you’re right at the edge of your vocal range, a half step can make all the difference! ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2025, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/guitar-players-i-need-a-little-help/1019015/12 "2025-06-02T17:58:22Z")
Ok, I defer to those who’ve paid more dues than I have. Thanks! ---
**Author:** ![Eonwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eonwe/32/240_2.png) [@Eonwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eonwe)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2025, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/guitar-players-i-need-a-little-help/1019015/13 "2025-06-02T20:25:50Z")
> [@digs](#): > > So it’s not a crucial part of the chord (you’re just adding a C# bass note to a plain-vanilla D chord). Totally agree that for this song you could skip it. However, I wouldn’t write off bass movement as “not crucial” as a rule. Often that stepwise motion, either because the movement becomes a notable melody of its own or because of the dissonance of a non-chord-tone against the chord, is essential to the song. > [@digs](#): > > eta: I’ve always wondered: what’s the point of a capo on the first fret? You’re only raising the notes a half-step (doubt it would make a difference to someone’s singing range). There are a few reasons to use a capo. Matching a vocal range is one, but not even the most important. This song, for example, is in Eb. Why? Don’t know. Maybe because it sits most comfortably there vocally for the guy who recorded it. Maybe it was written in that key on the piano, where keys like that come more naturally under the fingers than they would on the guitar (the original recording uses piano as the primary rhythmic instrument). Ok, so now there’s a song in Eb, and you’re bringing in a guitar player (or you’re making an instructional video for guitar players to learn the song in its original key). Why would they capo 1st fret? It allows you to get that open chord sound/shapes/fingerings, including that moving descending bass that would be impossible with barre chords. And, it keeps the register of the chords in a specific pitch range- you could capo 8th fret and play the Eb chord using an open G shape and go from there, though the guitar would be sounding an octave higher. You could also capo this on 3rd fret and play C shapes, which is probably what I would do if I wanted to get the stepwise bass motion- much easier, IMO, playing in C than D. ---
**Author:** ![NoCoolUserName](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5fc32e/32.png) [@NoCoolUserName](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NoCoolUserName)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2025, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/guitar-players-i-need-a-little-help/1019015/14 "2025-06-07T22:54:43Z")
I totally agree that a capo 2 frets higher is the easiest way to go. A different way to do it would be to play the D chord by using a barre on the top 3 strings (index finger), then use your middle finger on the b string (3rd fret). Now it should be easier to reach the 4th fret on the a string. ---
**Author:** ![DaveUnknown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/94ad74/32.png) [@DaveUnknown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DaveUnknown)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2025, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/guitar-players-i-need-a-little-help/1019015/15 "2025-06-07T23:45:56Z")
Eb is a very easy piano key and horn key. If you capo/transpose up 1 fret, A becomes Bb, D becomes Eb, E becomes F— all the same fingering but obviously easier to play in Eb, those are the main chords in Eb ---
**Author:** ![Jackknifed\_Juggernaut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de053/32.png) [@Jackknifed\_Juggernaut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackknifed_Juggernaut)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2025, 2:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/guitar-players-i-need-a-little-help/1019015/16 "2025-06-08T02:31:38Z")
None of this is obvious to me. My guitar experience is learning through YouTube video lessons of songs I want to play. ---
**Author:** ![Jackknifed\_Juggernaut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de053/32.png) [@Jackknifed\_Juggernaut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackknifed_Juggernaut)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2025, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/guitar-players-i-need-a-little-help/1019015/17 "2025-06-08T02:34:16Z")
This was very helpful! It took me a while to try it, as it didn’t seem to make sense, but I think the better stability helps with the stretch. I still can’t do it perfectly, but getting there. Hopefully in a few days. ---
**Author:** ![DaveUnknown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/94ad74/32.png) [@DaveUnknown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DaveUnknown)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2025, 2:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/guitar-players-i-need-a-little-help/1019015/18 "2025-06-08T02:47:28Z")
(Deleted, I think you answered in an earlier post) ---
**Author:** ![engineer\_comp\_geek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/engineer_comp_geek/32/504_2.png) [@engineer\_comp\_geek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/engineer_comp_geek)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2025, 3:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/guitar-players-i-need-a-little-help/1019015/19 "2025-06-08T03:28:15Z")
> [@Eonwe](#): > > I don’t have a guitar in-hand, but yes, that’s kind of a tough stretch. One thing to try might be to allow your middle finger to come off the fretboard, which could let you rotate your wrist under a bit more and not need to have that wide stretch between the pinky and middle finger. I was curious so I just tried it. I didn’t have any difficulty playing it as in the video, but I guess it’s up to your personal experience. It sounds to me like he’s only playing the bottom strings though. So you can do the above and skip the E string, or you can go one step further and skip both the E and B strings. Then you just need to keep your first finger on the G string (on the A fret, exactly where it was during the D chord) and move your ring finger down to the C#. No need to do anything with your middle finger except keep it out of the way. It’s just a two finger chord if you do it that way, which seems easy to me. It sounds better to me if you deaden the D string with your ring finger as you hold down the C# but either way sounds ok. So there’s another option if you aren’t used to using your pinky finger.