# Gun control wouldn't have stopped what happened in Vegas...should we do it anyway? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 3, 2017, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-control-wouldnt-have-stopped-what-happened-in-vegas-should-we-do-it-anyway/797873 "2017-10-03T15:32:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 31
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-control-wouldnt-have-stopped-what-happened-in-vegas-should-we-do-it-anyway/797873/601 "2017-10-12T21:41:49Z")
> [@XT](#): > > I think they are apt descriptors. Now, back to the subject at hand… > > Oh, was this supposed to be another distraction? It didn’t work. > > I’ve answered this. Now, back to the subject at hand. Do you have anything besides ‘People are complex animals’ for a limit? Is there any rational reason you can think of? I know you are distracted (or want to seem distracted) by my use of horseshit to describe your points, so try and stay focused here. > > Let me explain WHY it’s horseshit. You have nothing to back it up. It actually is exactly the same horseshit that our carrot-haired president is using in his Muslim ban. There is simply no good evidence tying the countries on his list to terrorist attacks, while countries not on his list (like, oh, say Saudi Arabia) DO actually have at least some correlation to terrorist attacks (like, I don’t know, 9/11 say). You are using the same logic. Do gun owners with 20 guns cause more crime? You don’t know…in fact, you have no fucking idea. You THINK it must, but have nothing to back it up. But, really, the reason you want a limit is because you have already come to a conclusion (Trump: Muslims are bad, You: Guns are bad) and you simply want to create a limit justified by your feelings and whatever else is bouncing about in your head. So to you guns = muslims? ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-control-wouldnt-have-stopped-what-happened-in-vegas-should-we-do-it-anyway/797873/602 "2017-10-12T21:44:11Z")
> [@drad\_dog](#): > > So to you guns = muslims? No. Obviously babies=bowling balls. Geez, you seem to have a really hard time following along. ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-control-wouldnt-have-stopped-what-happened-in-vegas-should-we-do-it-anyway/797873/603 "2017-10-12T21:47:35Z")
> [@begbert2](#): > > I’m not interested enough in dealing with this bullshit to bother. Read back through the thread if you really care. > > Your continued insistence that I’m too ignorant to participate in the discussion only indicates to me that you realize that your arguments and position can’t stand up to scrutiny. Why else would you be devoting so much time to desperately trying to discredit me? > > I’m not up on the fine points of gun mechanics, true. (Well, actually I am NOW, after this thread, but let’s not split hairs.) But I am knowledgeable about the difference between ad hominem and having an argument. And which one you harping endlessly on my prior mistake is. This is nothing. I said the orange baboon was compromised in his problem with russia and he said it was “retarded” because donald trump cannot be blackmailed. There’s a problem there. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-control-wouldnt-have-stopped-what-happened-in-vegas-should-we-do-it-anyway/797873/604 "2017-10-12T21:49:04Z")
> [@XT](#): > > Of course, as you can see, registration is also a big concern on the pro-gun side. And the reason is pretty apparent in this thread. It’s clear that at least some on the anti-gun side would use such a list to first identify what all is out there than to use it to confiscate weapons down the road or to set some sort of arbitrary number and use this to enforce it. So if the 2nd amendment and laws get changed such that gun owners cannot own a certain number or type (or any) guns the gun owners want to be able to break the law and not get caught. Gotcha. ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-control-wouldnt-have-stopped-what-happened-in-vegas-should-we-do-it-anyway/797873/605 "2017-10-12T21:50:15Z")
> [@XT](#): > > No. Obviously babies=bowling balls. Geez, you seem to have a really hard time following along. I followed when you said gun ownership and muslim immigration are a somehow analogous, but it seemed ridiculous so I wanted to let you clarify. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-control-wouldnt-have-stopped-what-happened-in-vegas-should-we-do-it-anyway/797873/606 "2017-10-12T21:50:56Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > So if the 2nd amendment and laws get changed such that gun owners cannot own a certain number or type (or any) guns the gun owners want to be able to break the law and not get caught. > > Gotcha. And here we see the distrust the other way. Which is why compromise seems unlikely on this issue. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-control-wouldnt-have-stopped-what-happened-in-vegas-should-we-do-it-anyway/797873/607 "2017-10-12T21:53:06Z")
> [@drad\_dog](#): > > I followed when you said gun ownership and muslim immigration are a somehow analogous, but it seemed ridiculous so I wanted to let you clarify. I think he was more saying that some anti-gun types’ reaction to guns remind him of The Orange Menace’s reaction to muslims - one gun is bad, two guns is worse, and twenty guns will force you to wear a burka. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-control-wouldnt-have-stopped-what-happened-in-vegas-should-we-do-it-anyway/797873/608 "2017-10-12T21:54:24Z")
> [@drad\_dog](#): > > I followed when you said gun ownership and muslim immigration are a somehow analogous, but it seemed ridiculous so I wanted to let you clarify. No, quite obviously you didn’t follow and have no idea what I was saying…or you did and you are having a piss, as my British friends would say. I’m trying to figure out if you really don’t get this stuff or are trying to be a shiny lure in the water…or, really, what your deal is. I keep going back and forth on this and haven’t arrived at a conclusion. Clearly, more study is needed. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-control-wouldnt-have-stopped-what-happened-in-vegas-should-we-do-it-anyway/797873/609 "2017-10-12T22:00:45Z")
> [@begbert2](#): > > I think he was more saying that some anti-gun types’ reaction to guns remind him of The Orange Menace’s reaction to muslims - one gun is bad, two guns is worse, and twenty guns will force you to wear a burka. If you take out ‘some anti-gun types’ and substitute that with ‘drad dog’s arbitrary limit that somehow people who own 20 guns or more are a threat and we should fix this threat by imposing said limit’, then pretty much. I actually didn’t think this was that hard to follow. It’s the same logic. Have a fear. Create an arbitrary limit or ban based on that fear with very little or no data as to why you want to create that limit or ban except your own fear. Circle around. Regardless, jumping to the conclusion that ‘guns = muslims’ from what I said is kind of ridiculous, no? ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-control-wouldnt-have-stopped-what-happened-in-vegas-should-we-do-it-anyway/797873/610 "2017-10-12T22:06:55Z")
> [@drad\_dog](#): > > Why don’t you love my gut feelings too? Because they’re wrong 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-control-wouldnt-have-stopped-what-happened-in-vegas-should-we-do-it-anyway/797873/611 "2017-10-12T22:09:49Z")
> [@XT](#): > > And here we see the distrust the other way. Which is why compromise seems unlikely on this issue. What distrust? Why else would they oppose registration? ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-control-wouldnt-have-stopped-what-happened-in-vegas-should-we-do-it-anyway/797873/612 "2017-10-12T22:10:15Z")
> [@XT](#): > > Regardless, jumping to the conclusion that ‘guns = muslims’ from what I said is kind of ridiculous, no? Oh, I don’t know. They both have the letter ‘U’ in them; that’s basically equality right there, isn’t it? I’m not particularly impressed by the whole “one guy with more guns = bad!” argument, obviously. Which is not to say I’d go within twenty feet of his gun wall, mind you - I still am averse to firearms. But there have _got_ to be better ways to identify threats than simply counting the triggers - especially since, and pardon my _ **infamous** _ ignorance, but a dude with one gun and fifty clips is precisely as dangerous as a dude with fifty guns with one clip each. If anybody points out that the one gun may jam I’m slapping them. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-control-wouldnt-have-stopped-what-happened-in-vegas-should-we-do-it-anyway/797873/613 "2017-10-12T22:22:14Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > What distrust? > > Why else would they oppose registration? It may have been when you intimated that “gun owners want to be able to break the law and not get caught”. That isn’t verbiage that screams that you trust the gun owners’ moral fortitude. The gun owners think we want to take all their guns away; why else would we protest our society being saturated in deadly weapons? We think that the gun owners are just waiting for the chance to murder, like, everyone; why else would they want to own deadly weapons? ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-control-wouldnt-have-stopped-what-happened-in-vegas-should-we-do-it-anyway/797873/614 "2017-10-12T22:25:03Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Because they’re wrong 😉 That didn’t bother you when you voted for the baboon. I think my gut feelings are at least as good as yours. ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-control-wouldnt-have-stopped-what-happened-in-vegas-should-we-do-it-anyway/797873/615 "2017-10-12T22:26:14Z")
> [@XT](#): > > No, quite obviously you didn’t follow and have no idea what I was saying…or you did and you are having a piss, as my British friends would say. I’m trying to figure out if you really don’t get this stuff or are trying to be a shiny lure in the water…or, really, what your deal is. I keep going back and forth on this and haven’t arrived at a conclusion. Clearly, more study is needed. You said they were analogous. Do you want to make more paragraphage to hide it? ---
**Author:** ![Bone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bone/32/407_2.png) [@Bone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bone)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-control-wouldnt-have-stopped-what-happened-in-vegas-should-we-do-it-anyway/797873/616 "2017-10-12T22:36:37Z")
I step away for a meeting and the thread goes off the rails. > [@drad\_dog](#): > > You really do get hot and bothered about this. And you don’t own a gun IIRC. Why the vulgarity? You don’t agree with someone so it’s all horseshit this, coming out of ones ass that etc etc. Do not say or imply that your fellow posters achieve sexual gratification or soil themselves. > [@XT](#): > > No, quite obviously you didn’t follow and have no idea what I was saying…or you did and you are having a piss, as my British friends would say. Not sure how you are using ‘having a piss’, but to the extent it’s similar to trolling, don’t do that. * * * Again I will caution folks to be civil. [/moderating] ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-control-wouldnt-have-stopped-what-happened-in-vegas-should-we-do-it-anyway/797873/617 "2017-10-12T22:47:53Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > What distrust? > > Why else would they oppose registration? Because they don’t trust your side and think it’s a ploy to grab their guns. And, frankly, based on some of the posts in this thread, their fear is justified. Some posters in this thread pretty clearly DO want to use whatever pretext they can to grab the guns, and such a list would help them do so very efficiently. Like I said, there is distrust on both sides…and both sides think their distrust is justified. You obviously do, and so do they. Can we get past that? Can we get past the decades of distrust and bad blood, can we compromise? Based on this thread, I’d say no…we can’t. The middle ground is simply a place to be sniped at from both sides, though I have to say it’s your side that’s attacked me the most…and has most ignored the actual OP. > [@Bone](#): > > Again I will caution folks to be civil. Fair enough, though I honestly think I’m being provoked in all of this. That could just be my frustration, however. This thread has been an incredibly frustrating experience from my perspective. > [@drad dog](#): > > You said they were analogous. Do you want to make more paragraphage to hide it? Look up the word analogous next as part of your continued experience from this thread. Once you do, think about what the definition is telling you, then compare and contrast that to using an = sign between two things. Perhaps you will see the disconnect…perhaps not. Apparently it was harder to understand than I thought, since you don’t seem to be the only one at a loss over it. ---
**Author:** ![Okrahoma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/90db22/32.png) [@Okrahoma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Okrahoma)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-control-wouldnt-have-stopped-what-happened-in-vegas-should-we-do-it-anyway/797873/618 "2017-10-12T23:28:58Z")
> [@XT](#): > > Look up the word analogous next as part of your continued experience from this thread. Once you do, think about what the definition is telling you, then compare and contrast that to using an = sign between two things. Perhaps you will see the disconnect…perhaps not. Apparently it was harder to understand than I thought, since you don’t seem to be the only one at a loss over it. That’s a very common mode of attack on SMDB. Poster X: Presents an analogy for A by giving an example of B. Poster Y: How dare you equate A to B! Happens all the time. ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-control-wouldnt-have-stopped-what-happened-in-vegas-should-we-do-it-anyway/797873/619 "2017-10-12T23:29:42Z")
> [@Bone](#): > > I step away for a meeting and the thread goes off the rails. > Do not say or imply that your fellow posters achieve sexual gratification or soil themselves. > > Not sure how you are using ‘having a piss’, but to the extent it’s similar to trolling, don’t do that. > > * * * > > Again I will caution folks to be civil. > > [/moderating] I was referring to the posters own words about me. I wasn’t imagining his or her sexuality. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2017, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-control-wouldnt-have-stopped-what-happened-in-vegas-should-we-do-it-anyway/797873/620 "2017-10-12T23:33:11Z")
“Hot and bothered” doesn’t mean “annoyed about the temperature in the room being too high”. Incidentally. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-control-wouldnt-have-stopped-what-happened-in-vegas-should-we-do-it-anyway/797873.md?page=30) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-control-wouldnt-have-stopped-what-happened-in-vegas-should-we-do-it-anyway/797873.md?page=32)