# Gun Grabbers **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 16, 2013, 11:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-grabbers/669014 "2013-09-16T23:24:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![A\_nice\_guy\_with\_an\_opinion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/76d3ee/32.png) [@A\_nice\_guy\_with\_an\_opinion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/A_nice_guy_with_an_opinion)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2013, 11:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-grabbers/669014/1 "2013-09-16T23:24:59Z")
All of the slogans tugging on emotions. All of the shootings in gun free zones that go on until the shooters takes himself out, or is shot by someone finally arriving(with a gun) after maximum damage. Fuck you, gun grabber. ---
**Author:** ![Ferret\_Herder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e47774/32.png) [@Ferret\_Herder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ferret_Herder)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2013, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-grabbers/669014/2 "2013-09-16T23:31:13Z")
[The Gabrielle Giffords shooting](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Tucson_shooting) was stopped by tackling the guy, and a CCW carrier arriving at the scene chose not to draw. He nearly ID’d a bystander as the shooter. But thanks anyway! ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2013, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-grabbers/669014/3 "2013-09-16T23:32:24Z")
As you have been told many times before, your, your friends’, and the NRA’s knee-jerk insistence that anybody be able to carry any gun anywhere in any manner they please is doing more to destroy the Second Amendment than all the Nancy Pelosis in the world by making people like me, who like guns but support reasonable regulation, turn against you because you are plainly insane and should not be allowed near guns. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2013, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-grabbers/669014/4 "2013-09-16T23:52:26Z")
> [@A\_nice\_guy\_with\_an\_opinion](#): > > All of the slogans tugging on emotions. You mean like “gun grabber”? > [@A\_nice\_guy\_with\_an\_opinion](#): > > All of the shootings in gun free zones that go on until the shooters takes himself out, or is shot by someone finally arriving(with a gun) after maximum damage. There are no gun free zones in the US, thanks to the gun worshipers. You should be _happy_ when you hear of some lunatic with a gun shooting people up; that’s what you are fighting for. ---
**Author:** ![Sailboat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sailboat/32/461_2.png) [@Sailboat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sailboat)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2013, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-grabbers/669014/5 "2013-09-16T23:58:15Z")
“Gun-free zones” got nothin’ to do with it. [The world’s best-trained, most-alert, most heavily armed men couldn’t stop it either.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reagan_assassination_attempt) ---
**Author:** ![njtt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ecd19e/32.png) [@njtt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/njtt)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2013, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-grabbers/669014/6 "2013-09-16T23:58:24Z")
> [@A\_nice\_guy\_with\_an\_opinion](#): > > All of the shootings in gun free zones that go on until the shooters takes himself out, or is shot by someone finally arriving(with a gun) after maximum damage. The notion that way to stop shootings is to make sure that guns are freely available is the epitome of insanity and twisted logic. ---
**Author:** ![A\_nice\_guy\_with\_an\_opinion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/76d3ee/32.png) [@A\_nice\_guy\_with\_an\_opinion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/A_nice_guy_with_an_opinion)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2013, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-grabbers/669014/7 "2013-09-17T00:02:03Z")
For every mass shooting in a gun free zone, there are far more incidents of “gun worshipers” using them to defend themselves and others. They just don’t get the attention that mass killings do because it is tragic when so many lives are lost. The disconnect is that they are mass killings because nobody had a chance to stop them. > [@](#): > > You mean like “gun grabber”? Gun Grabbers is a name, not a slogan. ---
**Author:** ![A\_nice\_guy\_with\_an\_opinion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/76d3ee/32.png) [@A\_nice\_guy\_with\_an\_opinion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/A_nice_guy_with_an_opinion)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2013, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-grabbers/669014/8 "2013-09-17T00:05:19Z")
> [@Ferret\_Herder](#): > > [The Gabrielle Giffords shooting](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Tucson_shooting) was stopped by tackling the guy, and a CCW carrier arriving at the scene chose not to draw. He nearly ID’d a bystander as the shooter. But thanks anyway! Fine. Disarm Obama’s protection. ---
**Author:** ![get\_lives](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/ecb155/32.png) [@get\_lives](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/get_lives)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2013, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-grabbers/669014/9 "2013-09-17T00:07:48Z")
> [@A\_nice\_guy\_with\_an\_opinion](#): > > Fine. Disarm Obama’s protection. Are you stupid, or have you just not thought your shit through? ---
**Author:** ![11811](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/1/9d8465/32.png) [@11811](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/11811)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2013, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-grabbers/669014/10 "2013-09-17T00:08:14Z")
David Frum has posted these helpful tips Another mass casualty shooting, this time at Washington Navy Yard. (1) In wake of this most recent mass-casualty shooting, it is important that we all respect the feelings of America’s gun enthusiasts. (2) Observing a few simple rules of etiquette will help the post-shooting conversation to proceed in appropriate ways. (3) Rule 1: It is “ghoulish” to suggest in any way that the easy availability of guns might in any way enable gun slaughter. Rule 2: Gun crime in the president’s hometown proves that guns anywhere else are no fit topic of conversation. Rule 3: All gun owners are to be complimented as responsible and law-abiding until they personally have hurt themselves or somebody else Rule 4: Any attempt to stop mass casualty shootings is “political.” Allowing them to continue is"non-political." Rule 5: Gun ownership is essential to freedom, as in Serbia & Guatemala. Gun restrictions lead to tyranny, as in Australia & Canada. ---
**Author:** ![A\_nice\_guy\_with\_an\_opinion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/76d3ee/32.png) [@A\_nice\_guy\_with\_an\_opinion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/A_nice_guy_with_an_opinion)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2013, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-grabbers/669014/11 "2013-09-17T00:08:32Z")
> [@njtt](#): > > The notion that way to stop shootings is to make sure that guns are freely available is the epitome of insanity and twisted logic. Ensuring that people who obey the law are disarmed in an area is a good way to make a soft target for a shooter who wants a high body count. ---
**Author:** ![SpoilerVirgin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/4491bb/32.png) [@SpoilerVirgin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SpoilerVirgin)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2013, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-grabbers/669014/12 "2013-09-17T00:08:36Z")
> [@A\_nice\_guy\_with\_an\_opinion](#): > > For every mass shooting in a gun free zone, there are far more incidents of “gun worshipers” using them to defend themselves and others. > > They just don’t get the attention that mass killings do because it is tragic when so many lives are lost. The disconnect is that they are mass killings because nobody had a chance to stop them. > > Gun Grabbers is a name, not a slogan. I admit I’m not aware of any instances where a person was intending to commit a mass shooting, and a civilian with a gun was able to stop the assault. Would you mind linking to a few? ---
**Author:** ![A\_nice\_guy\_with\_an\_opinion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/76d3ee/32.png) [@A\_nice\_guy\_with\_an\_opinion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/A_nice_guy_with_an_opinion)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2013, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-grabbers/669014/13 "2013-09-17T00:09:39Z")
> [@11811](#): > > David Frum has posted these helpful tips You need someone else’s tips? ---
**Author:** ![A\_nice\_guy\_with\_an\_opinion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/76d3ee/32.png) [@A\_nice\_guy\_with\_an\_opinion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/A_nice_guy_with_an_opinion)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2013, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-grabbers/669014/14 "2013-09-17T00:12:14Z")
> [@SpoilerVirgin](#): > > I admit I’m not aware of any instances where a person was intending to commit a mass shooting, and a civilian with a gun was able to stop the assault. Would you mind linking to a few? Before I go look for links, what does that have to do with gun grabbers wanting to disarm a woman the age of 70, and her right to carry a weapon to defend herself from an attacker wanting to rob, rape, or kill her? ---
**Author:** ![A\_nice\_guy\_with\_an\_opinion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/76d3ee/32.png) [@A\_nice\_guy\_with\_an\_opinion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/A_nice_guy_with_an_opinion)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2013, 12:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-grabbers/669014/15 "2013-09-17T00:17:53Z")
[http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/local\_news/article/Two-wounded-in-theater-shooting-4122668.php](http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/local_news/article/Two-wounded-in-theater-shooting-4122668.php) Does this count, or does there have to be a body count. You have noticed that a lot of mass shootings start in gun free zones, and end when people with guns show up, correct? ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2013, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-grabbers/669014/16 "2013-09-17T00:25:16Z")
> [@A\_nice\_guy\_with\_an\_opinion](#): > > Gun Grabbers is a name, not a slogan. So is “asshole”. ---
**Author:** ![Shayna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shayna/32/17976_2.png) [@Shayna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shayna)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2013, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-grabbers/669014/17 "2013-09-17T00:27:37Z")
> [@A\_nice\_guy\_with\_an\_opinion](#): > > Before I go look for links, what does that have to do with gun grabbers wanting to disarm a woman the age of 70, and her right to carry a weapon to defend herself from an attacker wanting to rob, rape, or kill her? Straw man. No one wants to disarm 70-year-old women who want to defend themselves from being raped. But as the Supreme Court said in _Heller_: > [@Antonin Scalia](#): > > Like most rights, **the Second Amendment right is not unlimited. It is not a right to keep and carry any weapon whatsoever in any manner whatsoever and for whatever purpose** : For example, concealed weapons prohibitions have been upheld under the Amendment or state analogues. **The Court’s opinion should not be taken to cast doubt on longstanding prohibitions on the possession of firearms by felons and the mentally ill, or laws forbidding the carrying of firearms in sensitive places such as schools and government buildings, or laws imposing conditions and qualifications on the commercial sale of arms.** Miller’s holding that the sorts of weapons protected are those “in common use at the time” **finds support in the historical tradition of prohibiting the carrying of dangerous and unusual weapons.** So if you have a problem with those of us who advocate enforcing this ruling, talk to the robed ones who handed it down. ---
**Author:** ![Shayna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shayna/32/17976_2.png) [@Shayna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shayna)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2013, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-grabbers/669014/18 "2013-09-17T00:28:50Z")
> [@A\_nice\_guy\_with\_an\_opinion](#): > > [http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/local\_news/article/Two-wounded-in-theater-shooting-4122668.php](http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/local_news/article/Two-wounded-in-theater-shooting-4122668.php) > > Does this count, or does there have to be a body count. You have noticed that a lot of mass shootings start in gun free zones, and end when people with guns show up, correct? Anecdote /= Data. ---
**Author:** ![Gray\_Ghost](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/c0e974/32.png) [@Gray\_Ghost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gray_Ghost)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2013, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-grabbers/669014/19 "2013-09-17T00:30:31Z")
> [@SpoilerVirgin](#): > > I admit I’m not aware of any instances where a person was intending to commit a mass shooting, and a civilian with a gun was able to stop the assault. Would you mind linking to a few? [Jeanne Assam](http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/12/10/colorado.shootings/) is another. Ms. Assam was a volunteer security guard at the [New Life Church in Colorado Springs, CO, December 9th, 2007](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2007_Colorado_YWAM_and_New_Life_shootings), when Matthew Murray continued his killing spree. She exchanged gunfire with Murray as he entered the church, hitting him with several shots, and killing him. According to the pastor of the church, Ms. Assam saved several hundred lives. YMMV as to the veracity of that claim. Opinions vary as to whether [Nick Meli’s confrontation](http://www.kgw.com/news/Clackamas-man-armed-confronts-mall-shooter-183593571.html) of Jacob Roberts at the [Clackamas Town Center mall,](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clackamas_Town_Center_shooting) December 11, 2012, induced Roberts to stop shooting at the shoppers, take cover, and take his own life. I’m sure there are others; these are just what I had remembered off the top of my head. ---
**Author:** ![Eutychus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Eutychus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eutychus)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2013, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-grabbers/669014/20 "2013-09-17T00:35:05Z")
> [@A\_nice\_guy\_with\_an\_opinion](#): > > Fuck you, gun grabber. To quote Jack Aubrey, _ **“I do not have time for your damned hobbies!”** _ [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-grabbers/669014.md?page=2)