# Gun owners...how bad is it, how bad could it be? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 1, 2009, 1:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-how-bad-is-it-how-bad-could-it-be/483942 "2009-02-01T01:27:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2009, 1:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-how-bad-is-it-how-bad-could-it-be/483942/1 "2009-02-01T01:27:08Z")
Composing this at the airport on an iPod so go gently on me for syntax and spelling screwups. Ok, here is the OP. In my office right now there are several of my cow-orkers who are in a low level state of panic right now concerning their guns. More specifically right this minute they are most worried about their access to ammo for their guns. They seem to be under the impression that the Dems are making a major move wrt gun control via ammo as part of a broader move to eventually take their guns away from them. What I’m looking for here is what the basis for this fear is (if it has a basis) and exactly what’s going on atm on the gun control front…and how worried our gun owning 'dopers are. Please…this debate is for gun owners or for 'dopers who want to engage in the specific debate. I’m not looking for 'dopers who want to re-iterate for the umptieth time how they think gun control is a good idea (or a bad one), blah blah blah. What I’m looking for here is…what IS being done right now and if there is any basis for the fear of my fellow workers, some of who are buying up ever scrap of ammo they can get their hands on atm. According to them they aren’t the only ones doing so right now either since they are complaining of shortages in some calibers and types (especially the higher quality rounds that they all seem to favor). -XT ---
**Author:** ![Bill\_Door](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@Bill\_Door](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bill_Door)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2009, 1:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-how-bad-is-it-how-bad-could-it-be/483942/2 "2009-02-01T01:34:52Z")
I’ve had a lot of emails forwarded to me, I’ve seen posted notices at gun shops and pistol ranges, but I believe none of them. There is no chance of any successful back door banning of handguns by way of some ammunition accountability act. It’s panic buying, pure and simple. I applaud the gun shop owners who are undoubtedly profiting mightily from the simpletons. There’s a sucker born every minute, and if god did not mean them to be shorn, he would not have made them sheep. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2009, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-how-bad-is-it-how-bad-could-it-be/483942/3 "2009-02-01T01:47:21Z")
that’s the impression I got too. -XT ---
**Author:** ![spike404](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@spike404](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/spike404)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2009, 1:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-how-bad-is-it-how-bad-could-it-be/483942/4 "2009-02-01T01:51:23Z")
The present administration, and congress, are definitely anti-gun. HR45 is just the beginning: > **[OpenCongress - Track bills, votes, senators, and representatives in the U.S....](https://formspal.com/opencongress/)** > > OpenCongress helps you track bills, senators, representatives as well as gain access to hundreds of legal forms and templates. They will go after ammo, I guarantee. ---
**Author:** ![Dostoyevsky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b5a626/32.png) [@Dostoyevsky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dostoyevsky)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2009, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-how-bad-is-it-how-bad-could-it-be/483942/5 "2009-02-01T01:56:51Z")
Even though [**The President Is Not a Gun Slinger**](http://www.reason.com/news/show/131352.html) I’m still not that worried [**all things considered.**](http://www.reason.com/news/show/129991.html) ---
**Author:** ![brazil84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8491ac/32.png) [@brazil84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brazil84)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2009, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-how-bad-is-it-how-bad-could-it-be/483942/6 "2009-02-01T02:01:20Z")
> [@xtisme](#): > > Composing this at the airport on an iPod so go gently on me for syntax and spelling screwups. > > Ok, here is the OP. In my office right now there are several of my cow-orkers who are in a low level state of panic right now concerning their guns. More specifically right this minute they are most worried about their access to ammo for their guns. They seem to be under the impression that the Dems are making a major move wrt gun control via ammo as part of a broader move to eventually take their guns away from them. What I’m looking for here is what the basis for this fear is (if it has a basis) and exactly what’s going on atm on the gun control front…and how worried our gun owning 'dopers are. > > Please…this debate is for gun owners or for 'dopers who want to engage in the specific debate. I’m not looking for 'dopers who want to re-iterate for the umptieth time how they think gun control is a good idea (or a bad one), blah blah blah. What I’m looking for here is…what IS being done right now and if there is any basis for the fear of my fellow workers, some of who are buying up ever scrap of ammo they can get their hands on atm. According to them they aren’t the only ones doing so right now either since they are complaining of shortages in some calibers and types (especially the higher quality rounds that they all seem to favor). > > -XT Gun control is a bit of a stale issue right now. Plenty of lawmakers still remember what happened around 1994. The dems thought they had a winning issue and they got killed at the polls. So the odds are pretty good that nothing will happen. Still, what’s depressing is that the best we can usually hope for from Congress is that our rights will not be eroded further. ---
**Author:** ![ExTank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/35a633/32.png) [@ExTank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ExTank)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2009, 2:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-how-bad-is-it-how-bad-could-it-be/483942/7 "2009-02-01T02:07:06Z")
Let the current administration get a few hand-in-hand “wins” with Pelosi et. al. and _then_ look for “common sense, reasonable restrictions” being proposed. All the ammo buying right now is panic hysteria. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2009, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-how-bad-is-it-how-bad-could-it-be/483942/8 "2009-02-01T02:27:36Z")
It’s the Dems we’re talking about here. You remember, the ones who can screw up the simplest things. There will be no “hand-in-hand” wins. On top of that, the second they try to do anything restrictive, the party will fragment and the Pubbies will win a bunch of House seats. That will scare the grabbers back into their holes for another generation. All the hysteria now is the NRA nutballs exercising their paranoia muscles. ---
**Author:** ![BrightNShiny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@BrightNShiny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrightNShiny)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2009, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-how-bad-is-it-how-bad-could-it-be/483942/9 "2009-02-01T02:39:34Z")
> [@spike404](#): > > The present administration, and congress, are definitely anti-gun. HR45 is just the beginning: > > [http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-h45/show](http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-h45/show) > > They will go after ammo, I guarantee. Isn’t this the “gunshow loophole” bill? Or is there something else in there that has you worried? ---
**Author:** ![ExTank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/35a633/32.png) [@ExTank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ExTank)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2009, 2:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-how-bad-is-it-how-bad-could-it-be/483942/10 "2009-02-01T02:44:40Z")
Hope, Change, Mandate. The anti-gun groups need a “win” in an attempt to set back or otherwise moderate the Heller decision. As in, “Okay, sure, you have the right to keep and bear arms, but _we_ have the right to regulate your ammo in such a way that you can only use them as paperweights and doorstops. The 2nd. Ad. says absolutely nothing about your right to keep and bear ammunition; so buy, own, keep, and bear all the guns you want.” Such an act requires political capital this admin. and congress currently lacks, and besides, there _are_ more pressing issues. But don’t be fooled for a minute; the gun grabbers are merely on hiatus, marshalling arguments, and resources, biding their time for the opportune moment before jumping out of the bushes again to sweep something through congress in a moment of hysteria. Fer crying out loud, California banned the .50 rifle as a terrorist weapon without one ever having been used in an act of terrorism. It’s not like we’re dealing with rational, logical people here. They aren’t gone by a long shot. And don’t ever forget [The Hughes Amendment.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firearm_Owners_Protection_Act#Machine_gun_ban_.28The_Hughes_Amendment.29) They did it once, and it worked. Why not try it again? It’s not as if they are directly addressing a constitutionally protected right. ---
**Author:** ![spike404](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@spike404](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/spike404)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2009, 2:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-how-bad-is-it-how-bad-could-it-be/483942/11 "2009-02-01T02:45:09Z")
“…All the hysteria now is the NRA nutballs exercising their paranoia muscles.” Interesting. Anyone who disagrees with you is a nutball? Correct? Makes one wonder–who has paranoia? ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2009, 2:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-how-bad-is-it-how-bad-could-it-be/483942/12 "2009-02-01T02:46:59Z")
It might be helpful to note that I am a Life member of the NRA, for what it’s worth. ---
**Author:** ![spike404](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@spike404](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/spike404)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2009, 2:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-how-bad-is-it-how-bad-could-it-be/483942/13 "2009-02-01T02:50:16Z")
> [@BrightNShiny](#): > > Isn’t this the “gunshow loophole” bill? Or is there something else in there that has you worried? What has me worried is the assault on the 2nd Amendment. I do not know what the “gunshow loophole” bill is. Have a resolution number? ---
**Author:** ![Amp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Amp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amp)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2009, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-how-bad-is-it-how-bad-could-it-be/483942/14 "2009-02-01T03:01:23Z")
I have to agree with **silenus**. I am an NRA member and receive their monthly magazine _American Rifleman_. The editorials are always doom and gloom about how the government is going to grab our guns and our ammunition either through legislation or forcibly. It gets kind of old after awhile. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2009, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-how-bad-is-it-how-bad-could-it-be/483942/15 "2009-02-01T03:01:25Z")
I posted here [Darn you Obama! (semi-serious) - The BBQ Pit - Straight Dope Message Board](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=504075) about the ammo shortage due to hysteria buying. The political prospects of gun restriction are mixed. At the state level, many states have augmented state constitution protections on gun ownership by passing explicit “shall issue” laws, mandating that carry permits cannot be denied except for cause. And of course the Supreme Court _Heller_ decision was huge. At the federal level however, Obama comes from Illinois, one of the most anti-gun states in the union, both at the state level and at the municipal level, Chicago having the most restrictive gun ban in the nation second only to DC itself. Obama’s voting record largely reflects this, and no one is going to forget that he painted gun owners as “clinging” to their guns. That and a federal legislative branch that seems to love to pass gun restrictions is hardly reassuring. The best that can be hoped is that Obama and the Dems have read the wind and are too pragmatic to force an anti-gun social experiment on the public. ---
**Author:** ![tumbleddown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e9bcb4/32.png) [@tumbleddown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tumbleddown)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2009, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-how-bad-is-it-how-bad-could-it-be/483942/16 "2009-02-01T03:09:57Z")
> [@spike404](#): > > What has me worried is the assault on the 2nd Amendment. I do not know what the “gunshow loophole” bill is. Have a resolution number? Assault on the second amendment is scare language. It’s talking points. The gunshow loophole is the problematic fact that a person who wishes to walk into a normal gun dealer and make a firearm purchase has to be vetted and background checked, but just about anyone can buy at a gunshow with no such checks because it’s classed a “private” sale. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2009, 3:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-how-bad-is-it-how-bad-could-it-be/483942/17 "2009-02-01T03:24:33Z")
I don’t see any fear of significant gun control being realistic. Gun ownership is a constitutional issue and that means any new attempts at gun control have to get past the Roberts court - which effectively means no new gun control laws. ---
**Author:** ![Grumman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/43a26b/32.png) [@Grumman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grumman)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2009, 3:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-how-bad-is-it-how-bad-could-it-be/483942/18 "2009-02-01T03:25:39Z")
Obama and Biden have expressed support for the Federal Assault Weapons Ban, a law which bans guns on the basis of features like pistol grips, bayonet mounts and whether or not a similar weapon exists that is capable of automatic fire. I do not trust them to act reasonably in this area. ---
**Author:** ![BrightNShiny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@BrightNShiny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrightNShiny)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2009, 3:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-how-bad-is-it-how-bad-could-it-be/483942/19 "2009-02-01T03:28:47Z")
> [@spike404](#): > > What has me worried is the assault on the 2nd Amendment. I do not know what the “gunshow loophole” bill is. Have a resolution number? You posted the link, so I thought you had read the bill. I was asking a genuine question as to the contents, and what has you worried, so I could get the context for the posting. I don’t have time to review the link right now, so it would be helpful if you would categorize what it is you are talking about with the link you posted. ---
**Author:** ![spike404](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@spike404](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/spike404)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2009, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-how-bad-is-it-how-bad-could-it-be/483942/20 "2009-02-01T03:35:01Z")
> [@tumbleddown](#): > > Assault on the second amendment is scare language. It’s talking points. > > The gunshow loophole is the problematic fact that a person who wishes to walk into a normal gun dealer and make a firearm purchase has to be vetted and background checked, but just about anyone can buy at a gunshow with no such checks because it’s classed a “private” sale. It is obvious, that you have not been to a gunshow lately. All vendors have to obey all laws. A red herring. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/gun-owners-how-bad-is-it-how-bad-could-it-be/483942.md?page=2)